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Magic Late in Life
Elanor Wed May 18, 2011 8:45 am
Magic Late in Life
Phelim Mcintyre - May 2, 2005 11:14 am
Edited by Kip Carter Aug 30, 2007 5:18 am
On a number of threads the fact that someone in one of the next two books (I think Half-Blood Prince) will do magic late in life is being discussed. But who is it?
Some think it will be Petunia, as some form of punishment for her treatment of Harry - a real payback that will be mental torture. Others hope that Petunia will not be rewarded with something as nice as magical powers. So who will it be and why? Answers by owl post but not howler via the Lexicon Forum (unless someone wants to move this to the vote thread).
Magic Late in Life thread index
This topic serves as an archive of a thread from the Harry Potter Lexicon Forum as hosted on World Crossing which ceased operation on April 15, 2011. Elanor
Phelim Mcintyre - May 2, 2005 11:14 am
Edited by Kip Carter Aug 30, 2007 5:18 am
On a number of threads the fact that someone in one of the next two books (I think Half-Blood Prince) will do magic late in life is being discussed. But who is it?
Some think it will be Petunia, as some form of punishment for her treatment of Harry - a real payback that will be mental torture. Others hope that Petunia will not be rewarded with something as nice as magical powers. So who will it be and why? Answers by owl post but not howler via the Lexicon Forum (unless someone wants to move this to the vote thread).
Magic Late in Life thread index
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Last edited by Elanor on Wed May 18, 2011 8:57 am; edited 1 time in total
Elanor- Hufflepuff Prefect
- Posts : 1440
Join date : 2011-02-19
Age : 51
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Magic late in life (Post 1 to 50)
Elanor Wed May 18, 2011 8:49 am
Kip Carter - May 2, 2005 12:16 pm (#1 of 342)
co-Host with Steve on the Lexicon Forum, but he has the final say as the Owner!
Phelim Mcintyre, recently in the Vote Folder, a poll titled Magical Late In Life? ran for seven days between 21 April and 28 April.
The associated discussion thread has been closed and deleted; however the results and the fifteen posts that were pertinent start are located in the Vote thread starting at Message #31.
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T Brightwater - May 2, 2005 12:31 pm (#2 of 342)
Anyone want to discuss the possibility that it's Grawp? That would also relate to Jo's hint that Grawp might be the one of Hagrid's "projects" that actually works out for the best.
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fleur-de-lys - May 2, 2005 12:52 pm (#3 of 342)
Grawp, now there's a possibility I hadn't heard yet. Do we know any info relating Giants and magic in the Harry Potter world? We know Hagrid is magical, do we know about any other giants? Can it be assumed that all giants have magical abilities or are there muggle giants?
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timrew - May 2, 2005 12:56 pm (#4 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
What's he going to use as a wand? A tree from The Forbidden Forest?
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fleur-de-lys - May 2, 2005 1:43 pm (#5 of 342)
Probably...I'll have to check JK's list of wand wood and see which would be the best for him. What did Hagrid use for a wand? Maybe Grawp will use Hagrid's umbrella. Speaking of which, a little off the thread, but does Hagrid get a wand now that his name is cleared? I don't remember that being addressed in the books.
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So Sirius - May 2, 2005 1:56 pm (#6 of 342)
Actually, I think it'll be Hagrid who will do magic late in life. He hasn't been allowed to do magic because he was wrongly accused, but now i'm sure that charge has or will be cleared and he'll be able to openly do magic.
Edit: I didn't see your post as I was posting, and typing rather slowly, how funny, we were both writing about Hagrid at the same time.
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T Brightwater - May 2, 2005 2:59 pm (#7 of 342)
fleur-de-lys, I think we can assume that most giants are not magical. Hagrid's father wasn't sure Hagrid would be able to attend Hogwarts because he was half-giant. (GoF) Hagrid also tells the trio in OotP that giants like magical things but hate having magic used against them; I get the feeling from this that they are rather jealous of wizards and their abilities.
Having said that, it may be that an occasional giant shows magical talent but is not allowed to attend wizard school or use a wand, due to the general prejudice of the WW. I could see Grawp becoming a test case if he does turn out to be magical.
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Steve Newton - May 2, 2005 4:36 pm (#8 of 342)
Librarian
I also think that giants are nonmagical, but...It is emphasized how small Grawp is. Maybe there is more wizard blood in the family than just Hagrid's Dad.
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Mrs. Sirius - May 2, 2005 9:53 pm (#9 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
It's got to be Filch. Wahahaha, bring back the old punishments, now I have a wand wahah haaha.
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 3, 2005 4:52 am (#10 of 342)
Kip - thanks for letting me know about the vote and discussion. I missed that due to chaos at my end. But this topic is starting to take over at least two threads (Aunt Petunia and the Squib threads) so I thought I'd start a new thread. There is just too much on this thread to take in!!!!
Mrs Sirirus - you can't be serious. Filch having magical powers. I do hope not and don't think so. I'm betting on Petunia. Mental torture or what.
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T Brightwater - May 3, 2005 6:03 am (#11 of 342)
Filch with a wand - say it ain't so, Jo!
Here's another way-out speculation - what about Firenze? Centaurs have their own wisdom and Divination skills, but I don't think they do magic. I get the feeling they think magic is beneath them. Firenze is already a renegade, so maybe he'll go even farther.
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Tomoé - May 3, 2005 1:40 pm (#12 of 342)
Back in business
First, Hagrid can't be "the one who will do magic late in life" because he's already doing magic (Dudley's pig tail anyone?)
Second, even if non-human magical beings are not allowed to use wand, they are still magical. Magical beings include Goblins, House Elves, Giants, and any other creatures that are not considered as real creatures by muggles, fantastic beast or undead creatures by wizards. So any magical being is magical (we don't expect to see a non-magical pheonix, do we?).
Here's the quote we are working with:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desesperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotionnal magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now).
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Mrs. Sirius - May 6, 2005 10:54 pm (#13 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
Oh come on give poor Filch-y a break. Think of all those years, if not decades, of frustration not being able to do anything to those bratty witches and wizard kids doing magic and making messes while he has to do everything by pure elbow grease and his on wits. Think of the humiliation he endure when he had to confess to everyone that he was a squib. Can you imagine another Gred and Feorge coming along and poor Filch still has to run after them, use a mop, write things out never getting a break. How many limits has he given Dumbledore to announce at the beginning of the school year? 472 now?
Just once give him a moment to shine, to be a part of the world he lives in. Poor guy.
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haymoni - May 6, 2005 10:59 pm (#14 of 342)
Maybe Filch finally takes that class and learns something!
Maybe he learns how to clean up the rest of the Weasley Swamp.
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Lav - May 10, 2005 6:40 am (#15 of 342)
well, Mrs. Sirius, if some one must be magical later on, they'd have to be magical to do something special... I just don't see Filch contributing to the plot like that...it's more likely to be someone like Petunia...
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Joanna S Lupin - May 10, 2005 9:44 am (#16 of 342)
Little Bobik
I think it will be Petunia also, in some dramatic circumenstances when Diddikins is threatened...
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far from prefect - May 11, 2005 4:05 pm (#17 of 342)
I agree with you Joanna. I think Petunia has some latent magical ability (nearly squashed out of her) that will come to her aid in defense of her precious boykins. Perhaps LV will make an assault on Harry at 4PD and she, knowing as much as she does about the magical world, will understand the peril. She will have to protect Dudders and maybe even Vernon, but where will Harry be in all that?
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far from prefect - May 12, 2005 10:42 am (#18 of 342)
Hey, what about Arabella Figg? She certainly has knowledge of magic and maybe even knows some spells, just can't make them work... Just a thought.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 12, 2005 5:28 pm (#19 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Arabella Figg is exactly whom I was thinking of too, far from prefect. She did come to his aid (in its loosest sense) after Harry fended off the dementors. Also, she acted in a peculiar way during Harry's hearing.
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Finn BV - May 12, 2005 6:07 pm (#20 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
It would be nice to see Mrs. Figg get something, but I'm with Filch. Yes, it's true, I don't want to seem him get magic, but I think it's just one of those things you've got to cope with - like Sirius dying, like Umbridge – being Umbridge, like Voldie's rising power. Filch can't just be ignored like this the whole time.
Now, both Figgy and Filchy… that would be quite something… then they go off, get married, witch and wizard, and have fun with all their kneazles! ;-)
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Regan of Gong - May 13, 2005 4:17 am (#21 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
I agree with Tomoe, that all creatures in the WW have their own breed of magic, e.g house elves and centaurs, with their Divination skills. Therefore I believe that Giants do have their own breed of Magic, but no-one's ever survived it to tell the tale. Grawp being able to harness powereful giant magic would be an invaluable weapon, he would be UNSTOPPABLE!
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Tomoé - May 13, 2005 6:14 am (#22 of 342)
Back in business
Exactly Regan, even if the Giant don't have a magic as powerfull as the House-elves or the magical humain, they still have a strong resistance to magic, and that's magic in itself.
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Finn BV - May 13, 2005 7:02 am (#23 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yes, I would think it would be very hard to Stun Grawp…
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Lav - May 14, 2005 12:35 am (#24 of 342)
I'm still with Petunia... she's a much MUCH more likely candidate than Filch or Figg...
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Cuivienen - May 14, 2005 7:11 am (#25 of 342)
I agree with Petunia being the late-bloomer. Flich doesn't work because JKR's quote explicitly says, "in desperate circumstances." I can hardly imagine Filch ever being in desperate circumstances that would cause him to use magic as he has been kept on the sidelines so far. Aunt Petunia seems more likely than Mrs. Figg for the irony factor. Mrs. Figg is just a Squib, but Aunt Petunia harbors a deep hatred for magic.
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Choices - May 14, 2005 9:26 am (#26 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
If Voldemort tries to invade or attack Hogwart's, Filch will surely find himself in desperate circumstances. I'm not saying I really think it's him, but he is a good candidate as is Mrs. Figg and Petunia.
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Solitaire - May 14, 2005 10:45 am (#27 of 342)
I agree, Choices. I do believe it will come down to one of the three of them, and each is as good a possibility as the other two.
Solitaire
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Finn BV - May 14, 2005 1:47 pm (#28 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Solitaire, I would think it would have to be one of them. Who else could it really be? Unless you're considering Dudley, these three seem to be the only possible candidates.
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Solitaire - May 14, 2005 3:48 pm (#29 of 342)
Yes, fbv ... that's why I said I believe it will be one of the three. I have seen Aunt Marge, Uncle Vernon, and Dudley mentioned as possibilities, but they do not seem to me to be viable options. Figgy is still the one I want it to be ... but I believe that Figgy, Filch, and Pet are all possibilities.
Solitaire
Edit: I suppose it could be Grawp ... I think I've seen him mentioned, as well. But the first three still are my best bets.
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Regan of Gong - May 15, 2005 1:28 am (#30 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
If Dudley did show signs of magic late in life, d'you reckon Vernon and Petunia would hate him as much as Harry and try to crush it out of him, or would they just start to accept that they had an abnormal family. Dudley is their son, so they'll naturally love him more anyhow, but would their behaviour change dramatically toward him?
Regan
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Steve Newton - May 15, 2005 6:07 am (#31 of 342)
Librarian
After giving it a modicum of thought I have, reluctantly, concluded that Dudley is the one who comes to magic late in life. I think that JKR told us this in SS when Dudley entered the snakes cage at the zoo. He crossed the invisible barrier separating the worlds.
I don't like it but I think that it works. I had originally guessed Aunt Marge since she seems to have broken 2 glasses. I think that the Dudley idea is a little stronger.
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I Am Used Vlad - May 15, 2005 9:36 am (#32 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
I don't have time to find the quote at the moment, but didn't JKR say something like when it comes to Dudley, what you see is what you get.
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Ydnam96 - May 15, 2005 10:13 am (#33 of 342)
Vlad, you are correct she did say that. Plus, he's not really into the "late in life" stage just yet in my thinking. I would be more inclined to think it will be: Arabella, Filch, Petunia, Aunt Marge, Grawp, or maybe the barman at the leaky cauldron? (we don't know that he isn't a squib or something...but I'm joking really on this one).
My guess is really Arabella or Petunia.
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Finn BV - May 15, 2005 10:54 am (#34 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Sorry, Solitaire, I had posted ten messages yesterday and thus could not post until today. I took your words differently, but after reading them again I understand now.
Steve and Vlad, the quote is from the Edinburgh Book Festival, 2004.
Is there more to Dudley than meets the eye?
No. [Laughter]. What you see is what you get. I am happy to say that he is definitely a character without much back story. He is just Dudley. The next book, Half Blood Prince, is the least that you see of the Dursleys. You see them quite briefly. You see them a bit more in the final book, but you don’t get a lot of Dudley in book six—very few lines. I am sorry if there are Dudley fans out there, but I think you need to look at your priorities if it is Dudley that you are looking forward to. [Laughter].
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Steve Newton - May 15, 2005 11:00 am (#35 of 342)
Librarian
Shot down again. Eventually I'll get one right.
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Solitaire - May 15, 2005 12:37 pm (#36 of 342)
No problem, fbv. LOL Steve! I have lots of dungbomb scars myself!
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 15, 2005 7:23 pm (#37 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
On a number of threads the fact that someone in one of the next two books (I think Half-Blood Prince) will do magic late in life is being discussed.
Is this based on a quote from JKR? If so, can anyone help me out as to where it is? I'd like to read it to get a better feel for the topic.
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I Am Used Vlad - May 15, 2005 8:11 pm (#38 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. 1999 Barnes and Noble interview
That's the quote, HungarianHorntail11.
I think the fact that she says "quite late in life" points to either Figg or Filch.
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Solitaire - May 15, 2005 9:50 pm (#39 of 342)
Having come from magical families, Figgy and Filch might know some actual spells ... even though they have not been able to get them to work. When Figgy says she has "never so much as Transfigured a teabag--" it made me wonder if perhaps she had tried to do that particular thing.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 16, 2005 12:51 am (#40 of 342)
I have one problem with the Filch idea. This is Filch supported Umbridge, because he would be allowed to do such things as torture the studets. Does this suggest that he would support Voldemort. But imagine Filch with magical abilities - forbidden curses all over the place. Crucio for getting mud on the floor, imperious to make you clean up after yourself, and avada kedavra if the job isn't good enough. Filch doing magic - I hope not!!!
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Ydnam96 - May 16, 2005 8:17 am (#41 of 342)
I don't think that just because Flich liked Umbridge he would automatically become a follower of VM if he suddenly had magical powers. I think he only liked Umbridge because he finally was given a chance to exercise a little "power" over the students.
I think it was Sirius that said that the world isn't split into good people and death eaters.
There has to be a reason that Filch has remained loyal to DD throughout the years...working quite hard at Hogwarts when he could be somewhere else...
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Choices - May 16, 2005 10:14 am (#42 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I got the impression from what JKR said, that the person who does magic late in life, does it as a "one time only" sort of thing because of desperate circumstances. I didn't think she meant they would continue to do magic, but just were able to do it one time in an emergency type situation.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 16, 2005 10:16 am (#43 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Thanks so much, I Am Used Vlad. Yes, that does seem to point to either of those two, or even Petunia.
I would prefer it to be Figg, but if the letter Harry found in Filch's office is a clue from JKR, then it would make sense that it's Filch (yuk).
On a lighter note, if it is Filch whom JKR is referring to, just because he may start using magic late in life, doesn't mean he can do any magic at free will.
I just saw your post, Choices and the desperate circumstances can infer that it would be a one-shot deal. But maybe, just maybe the person will then go on to try and develop this newly-found talent? (Such as putting a charm on a mop!)
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pottermom34 - May 16, 2005 11:05 am (#44 of 342)
You're right about what she said choices, and when I read that the first time I thought of Petunia being the one who would use magic late in life. Also JKR said something (don't remember exactly)like Petunia definately being a muggle, but there is something about her that makes us think there's more to her than that.
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Solitaire - May 16, 2005 4:17 pm (#45 of 342)
Hey, Horntail ... if you figure out that mop charm, please let me know! I might try it on my vacuum and my feather duster! I'll agree, Phelim, that anyone as punitive as Filch wielding a wand is a bit frightening. Then again, with the Weasley twins and their shenanigans gone, maybe his temper will improve. They seemed to be the bane of his existence!
Soliaire
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I Am Used Vlad - May 16, 2005 6:30 pm (#46 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Is Aunt Petunia a Squib?
Good question. No, she is not, but—[Laughter]. No, she is not a Squib. She is a Muggle, but—[Laughter]. You will have to read the other books. You might have got the impression that there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia than meets the eye, and you will find out what it is. She is not a squib, although that is a very good guess. Oh, I am giving a lot away here. I am being shockingly indiscreet. Edinburgh Book Festival
That's the quote about Petunia. It does not lead me to believe that she will be the one to preform magic late in life. I think what's "more than meets the eye" about Pet deals with the letters from Dumbledore and her knowing more about the Wizarding World than she lets on. These are clues about her past, not her future.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 17, 2005 7:55 am (#47 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
I agree, I Am Used Vlad. The fact that JKR says there is a little bit more to Petunia would lead me to believe just what you stated, the letters from Dumbledore and her knowing more about the Wizarding World than she lets on. Her statement doesn't seem to lead towards something so revealing like magic under desperate circumstances. But I still kind of feel as though I can't rule out Hagrid, since he's never openly practiced magic and let's face it, we'd all be quite shocked if he whipped out a wand and saved one of the students. (I know, I know, boo, hiss, how can I write this after all I've been told? I guess I'm just a stubborn Hungarian!)
Solitaire, I'm still working on self-folding laundry that will find its way back home. Maybe some spell-o-tape would help . . .
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far from prefect - May 17, 2005 8:38 am (#48 of 342)
HH, but hasn't Hagrid spent three years at Hogwarts learning magic as a youngster? He is still using magic, in a clandestine way, throughout the books. I think it will be Petunia or Figgy or someone completely unexpected...
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Steve Newton - May 17, 2005 9:21 am (#49 of 342)
Librarian
I see no way that Hagrid can come to magic late in life. He had magic at the usual age and, while officially banned, we have a good idea that he never stopped.
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spinowner - May 17, 2005 1:31 pm (#50 of 342)
I think Petunia is the most likely character to be latently magical, although the fact that I think she's the most likely one probably means it will turn out to be someone else.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
co-Host with Steve on the Lexicon Forum, but he has the final say as the Owner!
Phelim Mcintyre, recently in the Vote Folder, a poll titled Magical Late In Life? ran for seven days between 21 April and 28 April.
The associated discussion thread has been closed and deleted; however the results and the fifteen posts that were pertinent start are located in the Vote thread starting at Message #31.
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T Brightwater - May 2, 2005 12:31 pm (#2 of 342)
Anyone want to discuss the possibility that it's Grawp? That would also relate to Jo's hint that Grawp might be the one of Hagrid's "projects" that actually works out for the best.
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fleur-de-lys - May 2, 2005 12:52 pm (#3 of 342)
Grawp, now there's a possibility I hadn't heard yet. Do we know any info relating Giants and magic in the Harry Potter world? We know Hagrid is magical, do we know about any other giants? Can it be assumed that all giants have magical abilities or are there muggle giants?
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timrew - May 2, 2005 12:56 pm (#4 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
What's he going to use as a wand? A tree from The Forbidden Forest?
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fleur-de-lys - May 2, 2005 1:43 pm (#5 of 342)
Probably...I'll have to check JK's list of wand wood and see which would be the best for him. What did Hagrid use for a wand? Maybe Grawp will use Hagrid's umbrella. Speaking of which, a little off the thread, but does Hagrid get a wand now that his name is cleared? I don't remember that being addressed in the books.
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So Sirius - May 2, 2005 1:56 pm (#6 of 342)
Actually, I think it'll be Hagrid who will do magic late in life. He hasn't been allowed to do magic because he was wrongly accused, but now i'm sure that charge has or will be cleared and he'll be able to openly do magic.
Edit: I didn't see your post as I was posting, and typing rather slowly, how funny, we were both writing about Hagrid at the same time.
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T Brightwater - May 2, 2005 2:59 pm (#7 of 342)
fleur-de-lys, I think we can assume that most giants are not magical. Hagrid's father wasn't sure Hagrid would be able to attend Hogwarts because he was half-giant. (GoF) Hagrid also tells the trio in OotP that giants like magical things but hate having magic used against them; I get the feeling from this that they are rather jealous of wizards and their abilities.
Having said that, it may be that an occasional giant shows magical talent but is not allowed to attend wizard school or use a wand, due to the general prejudice of the WW. I could see Grawp becoming a test case if he does turn out to be magical.
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Steve Newton - May 2, 2005 4:36 pm (#8 of 342)
Librarian
I also think that giants are nonmagical, but...It is emphasized how small Grawp is. Maybe there is more wizard blood in the family than just Hagrid's Dad.
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Mrs. Sirius - May 2, 2005 9:53 pm (#9 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
It's got to be Filch. Wahahaha, bring back the old punishments, now I have a wand wahah haaha.
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 3, 2005 4:52 am (#10 of 342)
Kip - thanks for letting me know about the vote and discussion. I missed that due to chaos at my end. But this topic is starting to take over at least two threads (Aunt Petunia and the Squib threads) so I thought I'd start a new thread. There is just too much on this thread to take in!!!!
Mrs Sirirus - you can't be serious. Filch having magical powers. I do hope not and don't think so. I'm betting on Petunia. Mental torture or what.
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T Brightwater - May 3, 2005 6:03 am (#11 of 342)
Filch with a wand - say it ain't so, Jo!
Here's another way-out speculation - what about Firenze? Centaurs have their own wisdom and Divination skills, but I don't think they do magic. I get the feeling they think magic is beneath them. Firenze is already a renegade, so maybe he'll go even farther.
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Tomoé - May 3, 2005 1:40 pm (#12 of 342)
Back in business
First, Hagrid can't be "the one who will do magic late in life" because he's already doing magic (Dudley's pig tail anyone?)
Second, even if non-human magical beings are not allowed to use wand, they are still magical. Magical beings include Goblins, House Elves, Giants, and any other creatures that are not considered as real creatures by muggles, fantastic beast or undead creatures by wizards. So any magical being is magical (we don't expect to see a non-magical pheonix, do we?).
Here's the quote we are working with:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desesperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotionnal magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now).
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Mrs. Sirius - May 6, 2005 10:54 pm (#13 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
Oh come on give poor Filch-y a break. Think of all those years, if not decades, of frustration not being able to do anything to those bratty witches and wizard kids doing magic and making messes while he has to do everything by pure elbow grease and his on wits. Think of the humiliation he endure when he had to confess to everyone that he was a squib. Can you imagine another Gred and Feorge coming along and poor Filch still has to run after them, use a mop, write things out never getting a break. How many limits has he given Dumbledore to announce at the beginning of the school year? 472 now?
Just once give him a moment to shine, to be a part of the world he lives in. Poor guy.
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haymoni - May 6, 2005 10:59 pm (#14 of 342)
Maybe Filch finally takes that class and learns something!
Maybe he learns how to clean up the rest of the Weasley Swamp.
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Lav - May 10, 2005 6:40 am (#15 of 342)
well, Mrs. Sirius, if some one must be magical later on, they'd have to be magical to do something special... I just don't see Filch contributing to the plot like that...it's more likely to be someone like Petunia...
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Joanna S Lupin - May 10, 2005 9:44 am (#16 of 342)
Little Bobik
I think it will be Petunia also, in some dramatic circumenstances when Diddikins is threatened...
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far from prefect - May 11, 2005 4:05 pm (#17 of 342)
I agree with you Joanna. I think Petunia has some latent magical ability (nearly squashed out of her) that will come to her aid in defense of her precious boykins. Perhaps LV will make an assault on Harry at 4PD and she, knowing as much as she does about the magical world, will understand the peril. She will have to protect Dudders and maybe even Vernon, but where will Harry be in all that?
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far from prefect - May 12, 2005 10:42 am (#18 of 342)
Hey, what about Arabella Figg? She certainly has knowledge of magic and maybe even knows some spells, just can't make them work... Just a thought.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 12, 2005 5:28 pm (#19 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Arabella Figg is exactly whom I was thinking of too, far from prefect. She did come to his aid (in its loosest sense) after Harry fended off the dementors. Also, she acted in a peculiar way during Harry's hearing.
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Finn BV - May 12, 2005 6:07 pm (#20 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
It would be nice to see Mrs. Figg get something, but I'm with Filch. Yes, it's true, I don't want to seem him get magic, but I think it's just one of those things you've got to cope with - like Sirius dying, like Umbridge – being Umbridge, like Voldie's rising power. Filch can't just be ignored like this the whole time.
Now, both Figgy and Filchy… that would be quite something… then they go off, get married, witch and wizard, and have fun with all their kneazles! ;-)
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Regan of Gong - May 13, 2005 4:17 am (#21 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
I agree with Tomoe, that all creatures in the WW have their own breed of magic, e.g house elves and centaurs, with their Divination skills. Therefore I believe that Giants do have their own breed of Magic, but no-one's ever survived it to tell the tale. Grawp being able to harness powereful giant magic would be an invaluable weapon, he would be UNSTOPPABLE!
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Tomoé - May 13, 2005 6:14 am (#22 of 342)
Back in business
Exactly Regan, even if the Giant don't have a magic as powerfull as the House-elves or the magical humain, they still have a strong resistance to magic, and that's magic in itself.
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Finn BV - May 13, 2005 7:02 am (#23 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yes, I would think it would be very hard to Stun Grawp…
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Lav - May 14, 2005 12:35 am (#24 of 342)
I'm still with Petunia... she's a much MUCH more likely candidate than Filch or Figg...
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Cuivienen - May 14, 2005 7:11 am (#25 of 342)
I agree with Petunia being the late-bloomer. Flich doesn't work because JKR's quote explicitly says, "in desperate circumstances." I can hardly imagine Filch ever being in desperate circumstances that would cause him to use magic as he has been kept on the sidelines so far. Aunt Petunia seems more likely than Mrs. Figg for the irony factor. Mrs. Figg is just a Squib, but Aunt Petunia harbors a deep hatred for magic.
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Choices - May 14, 2005 9:26 am (#26 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
If Voldemort tries to invade or attack Hogwart's, Filch will surely find himself in desperate circumstances. I'm not saying I really think it's him, but he is a good candidate as is Mrs. Figg and Petunia.
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Solitaire - May 14, 2005 10:45 am (#27 of 342)
I agree, Choices. I do believe it will come down to one of the three of them, and each is as good a possibility as the other two.
Solitaire
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Finn BV - May 14, 2005 1:47 pm (#28 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Solitaire, I would think it would have to be one of them. Who else could it really be? Unless you're considering Dudley, these three seem to be the only possible candidates.
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Solitaire - May 14, 2005 3:48 pm (#29 of 342)
Yes, fbv ... that's why I said I believe it will be one of the three. I have seen Aunt Marge, Uncle Vernon, and Dudley mentioned as possibilities, but they do not seem to me to be viable options. Figgy is still the one I want it to be ... but I believe that Figgy, Filch, and Pet are all possibilities.
Solitaire
Edit: I suppose it could be Grawp ... I think I've seen him mentioned, as well. But the first three still are my best bets.
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Regan of Gong - May 15, 2005 1:28 am (#30 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
If Dudley did show signs of magic late in life, d'you reckon Vernon and Petunia would hate him as much as Harry and try to crush it out of him, or would they just start to accept that they had an abnormal family. Dudley is their son, so they'll naturally love him more anyhow, but would their behaviour change dramatically toward him?
Regan
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Steve Newton - May 15, 2005 6:07 am (#31 of 342)
Librarian
After giving it a modicum of thought I have, reluctantly, concluded that Dudley is the one who comes to magic late in life. I think that JKR told us this in SS when Dudley entered the snakes cage at the zoo. He crossed the invisible barrier separating the worlds.
I don't like it but I think that it works. I had originally guessed Aunt Marge since she seems to have broken 2 glasses. I think that the Dudley idea is a little stronger.
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I Am Used Vlad - May 15, 2005 9:36 am (#32 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
I don't have time to find the quote at the moment, but didn't JKR say something like when it comes to Dudley, what you see is what you get.
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Ydnam96 - May 15, 2005 10:13 am (#33 of 342)
Vlad, you are correct she did say that. Plus, he's not really into the "late in life" stage just yet in my thinking. I would be more inclined to think it will be: Arabella, Filch, Petunia, Aunt Marge, Grawp, or maybe the barman at the leaky cauldron? (we don't know that he isn't a squib or something...but I'm joking really on this one).
My guess is really Arabella or Petunia.
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Finn BV - May 15, 2005 10:54 am (#34 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Sorry, Solitaire, I had posted ten messages yesterday and thus could not post until today. I took your words differently, but after reading them again I understand now.
Steve and Vlad, the quote is from the Edinburgh Book Festival, 2004.
Is there more to Dudley than meets the eye?
No. [Laughter]. What you see is what you get. I am happy to say that he is definitely a character without much back story. He is just Dudley. The next book, Half Blood Prince, is the least that you see of the Dursleys. You see them quite briefly. You see them a bit more in the final book, but you don’t get a lot of Dudley in book six—very few lines. I am sorry if there are Dudley fans out there, but I think you need to look at your priorities if it is Dudley that you are looking forward to. [Laughter].
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Steve Newton - May 15, 2005 11:00 am (#35 of 342)
Librarian
Shot down again. Eventually I'll get one right.
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Solitaire - May 15, 2005 12:37 pm (#36 of 342)
No problem, fbv. LOL Steve! I have lots of dungbomb scars myself!
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 15, 2005 7:23 pm (#37 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
On a number of threads the fact that someone in one of the next two books (I think Half-Blood Prince) will do magic late in life is being discussed.
Is this based on a quote from JKR? If so, can anyone help me out as to where it is? I'd like to read it to get a better feel for the topic.
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I Am Used Vlad - May 15, 2005 8:11 pm (#38 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. 1999 Barnes and Noble interview
That's the quote, HungarianHorntail11.
I think the fact that she says "quite late in life" points to either Figg or Filch.
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Solitaire - May 15, 2005 9:50 pm (#39 of 342)
Having come from magical families, Figgy and Filch might know some actual spells ... even though they have not been able to get them to work. When Figgy says she has "never so much as Transfigured a teabag--" it made me wonder if perhaps she had tried to do that particular thing.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 16, 2005 12:51 am (#40 of 342)
I have one problem with the Filch idea. This is Filch supported Umbridge, because he would be allowed to do such things as torture the studets. Does this suggest that he would support Voldemort. But imagine Filch with magical abilities - forbidden curses all over the place. Crucio for getting mud on the floor, imperious to make you clean up after yourself, and avada kedavra if the job isn't good enough. Filch doing magic - I hope not!!!
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Ydnam96 - May 16, 2005 8:17 am (#41 of 342)
I don't think that just because Flich liked Umbridge he would automatically become a follower of VM if he suddenly had magical powers. I think he only liked Umbridge because he finally was given a chance to exercise a little "power" over the students.
I think it was Sirius that said that the world isn't split into good people and death eaters.
There has to be a reason that Filch has remained loyal to DD throughout the years...working quite hard at Hogwarts when he could be somewhere else...
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Choices - May 16, 2005 10:14 am (#42 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I got the impression from what JKR said, that the person who does magic late in life, does it as a "one time only" sort of thing because of desperate circumstances. I didn't think she meant they would continue to do magic, but just were able to do it one time in an emergency type situation.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 16, 2005 10:16 am (#43 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Thanks so much, I Am Used Vlad. Yes, that does seem to point to either of those two, or even Petunia.
I would prefer it to be Figg, but if the letter Harry found in Filch's office is a clue from JKR, then it would make sense that it's Filch (yuk).
On a lighter note, if it is Filch whom JKR is referring to, just because he may start using magic late in life, doesn't mean he can do any magic at free will.
I just saw your post, Choices and the desperate circumstances can infer that it would be a one-shot deal. But maybe, just maybe the person will then go on to try and develop this newly-found talent? (Such as putting a charm on a mop!)
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pottermom34 - May 16, 2005 11:05 am (#44 of 342)
You're right about what she said choices, and when I read that the first time I thought of Petunia being the one who would use magic late in life. Also JKR said something (don't remember exactly)like Petunia definately being a muggle, but there is something about her that makes us think there's more to her than that.
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Solitaire - May 16, 2005 4:17 pm (#45 of 342)
Hey, Horntail ... if you figure out that mop charm, please let me know! I might try it on my vacuum and my feather duster! I'll agree, Phelim, that anyone as punitive as Filch wielding a wand is a bit frightening. Then again, with the Weasley twins and their shenanigans gone, maybe his temper will improve. They seemed to be the bane of his existence!
Soliaire
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I Am Used Vlad - May 16, 2005 6:30 pm (#46 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Is Aunt Petunia a Squib?
Good question. No, she is not, but—[Laughter]. No, she is not a Squib. She is a Muggle, but—[Laughter]. You will have to read the other books. You might have got the impression that there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia than meets the eye, and you will find out what it is. She is not a squib, although that is a very good guess. Oh, I am giving a lot away here. I am being shockingly indiscreet. Edinburgh Book Festival
That's the quote about Petunia. It does not lead me to believe that she will be the one to preform magic late in life. I think what's "more than meets the eye" about Pet deals with the letters from Dumbledore and her knowing more about the Wizarding World than she lets on. These are clues about her past, not her future.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 17, 2005 7:55 am (#47 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
I agree, I Am Used Vlad. The fact that JKR says there is a little bit more to Petunia would lead me to believe just what you stated, the letters from Dumbledore and her knowing more about the Wizarding World than she lets on. Her statement doesn't seem to lead towards something so revealing like magic under desperate circumstances. But I still kind of feel as though I can't rule out Hagrid, since he's never openly practiced magic and let's face it, we'd all be quite shocked if he whipped out a wand and saved one of the students. (I know, I know, boo, hiss, how can I write this after all I've been told? I guess I'm just a stubborn Hungarian!)
Solitaire, I'm still working on self-folding laundry that will find its way back home. Maybe some spell-o-tape would help . . .
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far from prefect - May 17, 2005 8:38 am (#48 of 342)
HH, but hasn't Hagrid spent three years at Hogwarts learning magic as a youngster? He is still using magic, in a clandestine way, throughout the books. I think it will be Petunia or Figgy or someone completely unexpected...
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Steve Newton - May 17, 2005 9:21 am (#49 of 342)
Librarian
I see no way that Hagrid can come to magic late in life. He had magic at the usual age and, while officially banned, we have a good idea that he never stopped.
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spinowner - May 17, 2005 1:31 pm (#50 of 342)
I think Petunia is the most likely character to be latently magical, although the fact that I think she's the most likely one probably means it will turn out to be someone else.
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Magic late in life (Post 51 to 100)
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So Sirius - May 19, 2005 10:50 am (#51 of 342)
Perhaps the magic Petunia uses late in life is in protecting Harry. Unknowingly she uses her blood protection to keep him safe, thus, indirectly using magic. Not being magical, still being a muggle, yet using this old magic, anyhow.
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Choices - May 19, 2005 11:04 am (#52 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Gosh, Very Sirius, I just don't think Petunia possesses any of the "old Magic" - at least not for Harry. She has been so very hateful to him that it is hard to even imagine a spark of love between the two. She might protect Dudley, but I just don't think that would extend to Harry.
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far from prefect - May 19, 2005 11:15 am (#53 of 342)
There's a whole lotta back story to good ol Aunt P. I'm wondering if she might have overheard Lily practicing some spells (you know, when she was turning mice into teacups or whatever that was), and retained some fragments. Then, if she is in dire circumstances, and it involves saving Dudders she could let fly with some emotional magic...
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Choices - May 19, 2005 11:23 am (#54 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think for that to happen, we are going to have to discover that Petunia has some magic in her....or is a Squib, and I think JKR has pretty well squashed those rumors. She has stated that Petunia is a Muggle. Now, I am a Muggle no matter how hard I wish to be otherwise. I have gotten terribly frightened before and terribly angry too, and not once have I evoked one bit of emotional magic. I just don't see how Petunia (as much a Muggle as I am) is going to squeeze out any magic even in the most desperate of situations. If she does, then the rules about Muggles and magic are going to have to be changed or broken. Of course, JKR made the rules and she can do anything she wants, but I just don't see it happening. If it turns out I have to eat these words, I'll have them with some jam, please.
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So Sirius - May 19, 2005 11:52 am (#55 of 342)
Choices, Aunt Petunia carries this "old magic" in her veins, whether she wants to or not. It's this magic that saved Harry and is continuing to keep him alive. I was saying that this magic she'll do is unknowingly. She'll use this old magic to protect him till the end. Her blood will keep him alive. Thus, she'll be using magic, regardless of wanting to or not or even being capable of actually conjuring a spell.
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The Artful Dodger - May 19, 2005 12:06 pm (#56 of 342)
One thought about Petunia: I did a bit of research on her name to find out that petunia, the flower, is in bloom during summertime. As most flowers bloom in spring (correct me if I'm wrong here), summer is rather late, isn't it? That fits well with the idea of Petunia performing magic late in life (I guess that's a bit of a stretch, but I do like the association).
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far from prefect - May 19, 2005 1:30 pm (#57 of 342)
It's a great idea, Dodger, but I have to point out that asters bloom in the Fall and camellias bloom in the Winter. Lots of other flowers, too, these just Spring to mind...
)
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Finn BV - May 19, 2005 1:46 pm (#58 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
I love it Dodger! Wish far from prefect hadn't pointed it out… That's so clever and just like JKR's ideas.
Anyway, I'm wondering right now (has this been asked before?): Do we even know that somebody will receive magic late in life? Or is it very hypothetical? I know that Mrs. Sirius said it's been discussed on other threads, but we should contemplate whether it's likely to have a "late bloomer"… .
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Choices - May 19, 2005 3:08 pm (#59 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Very Sirius - "She'll use this old magic to protect him till the end"
Isn't she already doing that and hasn't she been doing it since Harry ended up on her doorstep? I think the person who does magic late in life is going to do something they have not done before.
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The Artful Dodger - May 20, 2005 9:12 am (#60 of 342)
Alas, earwax! I was only thinking of tulips or primroses or lavender, which, if memory serves, do start to bloom in spring. I didn't even know that there are asters and camellias! Oh well...
But nevertheless, thanks for liking my idea.
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Tomoé - May 21, 2005 7:10 pm (#61 of 342)
Back in business
Here it goes, fbv807:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
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Finn BV - May 22, 2005 7:09 am (#62 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Thanks, Tomoé. The only thing about that is how she phrases her answer. She says "There is a character …" The intriguing thing is, why wouldn't she say "There will be a character…"? She admits this is rare. Maybe the story will talk about somebody who, many years ago, received magic late in life, and is either currently:
not doing magic anymore
exceptionally good at magic now.
That was how I interpreted this quote when I saw it.
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Saralinda Again - May 22, 2005 9:33 am (#63 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
She says "There is a character …" The intriguing thing is, why wouldn't she say "There will be a character…"?
Since she says the whole series has been mapped out in her mind for some years, I don't have problems imagining her speaking in the present tense about something that we don't know about, but she does. Could even be in HBP!
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Choices - May 22, 2005 12:58 pm (#64 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think she is just indicating it will be a character we have already met and know.
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Ponine - May 22, 2005 2:05 pm (#65 of 342)
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Choices, that would reduce our suspects significantly
I mean - in March 1999, PoA was not even out yet, according to the Scholastic website... This would leave us with only those present in book SS and CoS... Come to think of it, that realy makes no difference, does it??? *giggles* Well, after ten minutes of putzing around trying to figure out when PoA first came out, I realize that it does not really matter... *ahem* Oh well. I try, I really do...
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essie125 - May 26, 2005 2:32 am (#66 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I think it is Petunia. Not only is her house unusually clean also Harry never got a warning for blowing up his aunt and the reason for that is not just Sirius black being on the run, but also because I belive that it was aunt Petunia who secretly made Aunt marge's glass explode and thhrough the schock of that made her swell up.
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applepie - May 26, 2005 6:52 am (#67 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Essie, that being said....it would arise all sorts of questions to me...
Did Harry really do all of the random acts of "emotional" magic, or was some of that Petunia's doing? Did Petunia do some of it on purpose to keep Harry under Vernon's disciplined hand? Maybe that's why she's so worried about the neighbors all the time...what have they possibly witnessed?
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essie125 - May 27, 2005 7:53 am (#68 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Well it's emotional magic, so I don't think she did it on purpose, and that's why the shock is so great. And I don't know, but Harry get's really angry with Marge after she broke her glass. At least in the book. So maybe the glass is Petunia's doing. Oh I just love what the fifth book has done. Petunia is one of my favourite character, just like Snape, because I don't belive that they really hate Harry that much. I think they would both protect him, if he could get to harm. They have both proven they would. Harry doesn't like them, but he can rely on them were he to be in danger. I think the Petunia not liking Harry is because Vernon does that. Do you know what the neighbours wouyld say if she and Vernon were to get a divorce.
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applepie - May 27, 2005 8:10 am (#69 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I agree that she would protect him. She already has in so many ways. Maybe her hatred of him is because she knows how much Vernon despises him, but not so much THAT Vernon despises him, as to WHY Vernon despises him. I think she is the one to do magic late, and her hating Harry is her desparation to deny that she is just like him.
You bringing up the divorce of the Dursley's leads me back to the protection issue of 4PD. If Petunia is removed, for whatever reason,...what happens to the protection?
See Protection at Privet Drive
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 8:29 am (#70 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
and her hating Harry is her desparation to deny that she is just like him.
Now there is a good reason for a writer to make it Petunia!
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applepie - May 27, 2005 8:31 am (#71 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Thank you, Thank you...**bows and waves**
Just kidding...I was beginning to wonder if I would ever make a valid contribution to the forum....
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 9:36 am (#72 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
I was beginning to wonder if I would ever make a valid contribution to the forum.
Well, that just leaves one of us now, applepie.
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applepie - May 27, 2005 9:38 am (#73 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
HH, I have no doubt that you've made various meaningful contributions.
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Choices - May 27, 2005 10:25 am (#74 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
My take on making valid contributions.....even the most frivolous theory may just be the thing that causes someone else to think about something and come up with an idea. You may laugh at someone's theory, then say wait a minute, if you change this to this, it just might work. I never hesitate to post an idea because someone else may take it and run with it and come up with a really sound and interesting theory. Not that I'm advocating posting frivolous theories - I prefer to see theories based on and supported by canon - but you never know..... :-)
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 10:33 am (#75 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
You're too kind, Choices & applepie!
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Regan of Gong - May 27, 2005 4:02 pm (#76 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Choices, I remember when you brought me back down to earth with canon evidence after I suggested Neville being the Half-Blood Prince. That was one time where I might have been wise to hesitate...
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 28, 2005 10:36 am (#77 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Ouch, Regan! LOL
There is one thing that just keeps pecking away in my mind against Petunia being the one - JKR also stated that there is a bit more to Petunia. That would lead me to believe we might find out that she's in on DD making the squib watch over Harry in their absence, or something small like that. Unless JKR is holding out and downplaying it for our sakes, magic late in life seems like more than a bit. She's been on the money, so far, though, if you look back at her answers to the 5 books we've been able to check.
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Netherlandic - May 28, 2005 11:52 am (#78 of 342)
How I would love that! Petunia being able to perform magic. What a shocker for her husband and son!
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Regan of Gong - May 29, 2005 4:50 am (#79 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
What will the neighbours say?
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Netherlandic - May 29, 2005 12:05 pm (#80 of 342)
Indeed!
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Eloise Black - May 30, 2005 5:03 pm (#81 of 342)
Hi All
What if Vernon, is a "squib", and Petunia, is a muggle by choice.
DD, does say that "it is our choices that make us what we are", or "who we are".
This may be why Vernon, is so anti-magic and angry at the magic world.
What if Vernon, was the one to do magic late in life.
What do you guys think.
Eloise
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Finn BV - May 30, 2005 5:55 pm (#82 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
I wouldn't classify Vernon as a "squib," because then that would mean he would be a muggle born into a non-magic family. He's more like Lily, that he has parents who have some small trace of magic that they pass on to their child. I really don't think it would be Vernon, because he has no trace of Petunia's or Lily's blood. If he received magic Harry wouldn't go live with him, he would go with Petunia, wherever she was. (See also the "Protection at Privet Drive" thread.) I think our best bets are Lily, Figgy, or Filch.
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Choices - May 30, 2005 6:10 pm (#83 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
fbv807 - "I wouldn't classify Vernon as a "squib," because then that would mean he would be a muggle born into a non-magic family."
If I'm not mistaken, a Squib is a non-magical child born into a magical family - just the opposite of a muggle born witch or wizard.
fbv807 - "I think our best bets are Lily, Figgy, or Filch."
I think we can discount Lily - she was a witch and she is now dead. There won't be any late in life magic for her unfortunately.
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Finn BV - May 30, 2005 6:34 pm (#84 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Of course, Choices, you are right about squibs. I mean to say, "because that would mean he would be a muggle born into a MAGIC family." The "non" just seemed to creep in there somehow.
And as for the three I named, I simply meant that so far those seem to be the three most likely. I personally have not yet ruled out Lily, however, I haven't even established the fact that somebody will turn magic late in life!
Oh well. What a horrible post! :-) LOL – just establishing whatever ground we may have to work on.
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Solitaire - May 30, 2005 7:41 pm (#85 of 342)
I did not realize Jo had said someone will become magical late in life; I thought she said someone will manage to perform magic in desparate circumstances--or something like that--late in life.
Solitaire
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Eponine - May 30, 2005 7:56 pm (#86 of 342)
That is what she said Solitaire. I see it as being a one time only occurence, not a permanent development.
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Tomoé - May 30, 2005 8:18 pm (#87 of 342)
Back in business
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
fbv807 -> I personally have not yet ruled out Lily
Er, she got her Hogwarts letter, she was as old as the other students around her in Snape's worst memory and she's dead. What make you think she could be the one?
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Solitaire - May 30, 2005 9:47 pm (#88 of 342)
Perhaps fbv meant Petunia but wrote Lily by mistake???
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Finn BV - May 31, 2005 8:43 am (#89 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yes, I seem to be having a bad day. First I reverse the definition of Squibs and then throughout that post I switch Petunia and Lily. I realized that as I read it over and thought I had corrected everything, but… wow. *goes into a corner and hides*… just kidding
LOL, Tomoé, thanks for the reassurance that Lily's dead… :-)
Anyway, I have said this before, earlier in the thread. Jo says that there is a character who "manages to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about." I have taken this to mean that there will not necessarily be a character who will turn magical late in life, but that there was a character who turned magical, many years ago. Go back to post 62.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 31, 2005 10:22 am (#90 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
It could also be because she has had this entire story beginning to end laid out in her mind for so long. Who knows?
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essie125 - Jun 1, 2005 1:20 am (#91 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Your can get inspired by othe people's theories. You may be able to look at a completely different angle then the person who posted it. By the way Last night I had an epiphany. How can hermione send Harry things by owl if she doesn't have one? Could this mean that Hermione lives in Londen, making it easy for her to go to Diagon Alley? I know it's of topic, but I was just wondering about this. Does Hermione strike you as a city girl? I don't think she travells by flew powder.
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Tomoé - Jun 1, 2005 4:30 pm (#92 of 342)
Back in business
I thought you switched Petunia and Lily at first, but when you repeated it was Lily, I didn't know what to think anymore.
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Regan of Gong - Jun 1, 2005 11:48 pm (#93 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Hmmmm, I guess she must Essie. How else would she do it?
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essie125 - Jun 3, 2005 1:13 am (#94 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I have no idea. I never imagined her to be a city girl, more of a country girl. Not that it's very important to the plot though.
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ellebell86 - Jun 7, 2005 8:31 pm (#95 of 342)
Both her father and mother are dentists, it would have to be a town that is somewhat large to support 2 dentists. London is a possibility. Hermione mentions going to the ministry of magic to look up McGonagall as a animagus, so she probably lives near or in London.
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Tomoé - Jun 8, 2005 8:08 am (#96 of 342)
Back in business
It doesn't have to be that big a town, I know a town of 2382 inhabitants that have three dentists (all working in the same private clinic). There's another town with another dentist clinic 10 kilometers away, with a polulation of 3018 (I have no idea how many dentist work there). Sure, some of their clients come from smaller village around.
So the Granger could came from almost anywhere in Britain.
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haymoni - Jun 8, 2005 4:42 pm (#97 of 342)
I don't know about travelling around Europe from country to country but I figured with the trip to France and being dentists - I just pictured big city, some place where a girl with magical powers would go unnoticed.
"It's like going into Wisconsin!"
Uh oh - she's speaking in movie quotes!
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I Am Used Vlad - Jun 8, 2005 6:03 pm (#98 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
I don't think anyone is suggesting that one of Hermione's parents is going to be the magic late in life person, so I'll try to bring it back on topic.
fbv, what would be the point of having a character from the past who developed magic late in life? How would further the story?
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Choices - Jun 8, 2005 6:56 pm (#99 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think we keep forgetting that this person doesn't become magical late in life - they only are able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation, and then they go back to being non-magical.
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Finn BV - Jun 8, 2005 7:24 pm (#100 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Vlad, what Choices said is right OR the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time OR the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time. They are either done with it (back to being a Muggle), going to be a surprise (for instance – SIMPLY FOR EXAMPLE – Albus Dumbledore was always a Muggle but then he got magic late in life and now it's a surprise – REMEMBER SIMPLY AN EXAMPLE I HIGHLY DOUBT IT).
I really think, though, that it's the last one, JKR tells us of a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life. I doubt GG too, but it's simply an example to explain what appears to be something only I believe.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Perhaps the magic Petunia uses late in life is in protecting Harry. Unknowingly she uses her blood protection to keep him safe, thus, indirectly using magic. Not being magical, still being a muggle, yet using this old magic, anyhow.
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Choices - May 19, 2005 11:04 am (#52 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Gosh, Very Sirius, I just don't think Petunia possesses any of the "old Magic" - at least not for Harry. She has been so very hateful to him that it is hard to even imagine a spark of love between the two. She might protect Dudley, but I just don't think that would extend to Harry.
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far from prefect - May 19, 2005 11:15 am (#53 of 342)
There's a whole lotta back story to good ol Aunt P. I'm wondering if she might have overheard Lily practicing some spells (you know, when she was turning mice into teacups or whatever that was), and retained some fragments. Then, if she is in dire circumstances, and it involves saving Dudders she could let fly with some emotional magic...
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Choices - May 19, 2005 11:23 am (#54 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think for that to happen, we are going to have to discover that Petunia has some magic in her....or is a Squib, and I think JKR has pretty well squashed those rumors. She has stated that Petunia is a Muggle. Now, I am a Muggle no matter how hard I wish to be otherwise. I have gotten terribly frightened before and terribly angry too, and not once have I evoked one bit of emotional magic. I just don't see how Petunia (as much a Muggle as I am) is going to squeeze out any magic even in the most desperate of situations. If she does, then the rules about Muggles and magic are going to have to be changed or broken. Of course, JKR made the rules and she can do anything she wants, but I just don't see it happening. If it turns out I have to eat these words, I'll have them with some jam, please.
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So Sirius - May 19, 2005 11:52 am (#55 of 342)
Choices, Aunt Petunia carries this "old magic" in her veins, whether she wants to or not. It's this magic that saved Harry and is continuing to keep him alive. I was saying that this magic she'll do is unknowingly. She'll use this old magic to protect him till the end. Her blood will keep him alive. Thus, she'll be using magic, regardless of wanting to or not or even being capable of actually conjuring a spell.
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The Artful Dodger - May 19, 2005 12:06 pm (#56 of 342)
One thought about Petunia: I did a bit of research on her name to find out that petunia, the flower, is in bloom during summertime. As most flowers bloom in spring (correct me if I'm wrong here), summer is rather late, isn't it? That fits well with the idea of Petunia performing magic late in life (I guess that's a bit of a stretch, but I do like the association).
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far from prefect - May 19, 2005 1:30 pm (#57 of 342)
It's a great idea, Dodger, but I have to point out that asters bloom in the Fall and camellias bloom in the Winter. Lots of other flowers, too, these just Spring to mind...
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Finn BV - May 19, 2005 1:46 pm (#58 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
I love it Dodger! Wish far from prefect hadn't pointed it out… That's so clever and just like JKR's ideas.
Anyway, I'm wondering right now (has this been asked before?): Do we even know that somebody will receive magic late in life? Or is it very hypothetical? I know that Mrs. Sirius said it's been discussed on other threads, but we should contemplate whether it's likely to have a "late bloomer"… .
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Choices - May 19, 2005 3:08 pm (#59 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Very Sirius - "She'll use this old magic to protect him till the end"
Isn't she already doing that and hasn't she been doing it since Harry ended up on her doorstep? I think the person who does magic late in life is going to do something they have not done before.
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The Artful Dodger - May 20, 2005 9:12 am (#60 of 342)
Alas, earwax! I was only thinking of tulips or primroses or lavender, which, if memory serves, do start to bloom in spring. I didn't even know that there are asters and camellias! Oh well...
But nevertheless, thanks for liking my idea.
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Tomoé - May 21, 2005 7:10 pm (#61 of 342)
Back in business
Here it goes, fbv807:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
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Finn BV - May 22, 2005 7:09 am (#62 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Thanks, Tomoé. The only thing about that is how she phrases her answer. She says "There is a character …" The intriguing thing is, why wouldn't she say "There will be a character…"? She admits this is rare. Maybe the story will talk about somebody who, many years ago, received magic late in life, and is either currently:
not doing magic anymore
exceptionally good at magic now.
That was how I interpreted this quote when I saw it.
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Saralinda Again - May 22, 2005 9:33 am (#63 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
She says "There is a character …" The intriguing thing is, why wouldn't she say "There will be a character…"?
Since she says the whole series has been mapped out in her mind for some years, I don't have problems imagining her speaking in the present tense about something that we don't know about, but she does. Could even be in HBP!
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Choices - May 22, 2005 12:58 pm (#64 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think she is just indicating it will be a character we have already met and know.
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Ponine - May 22, 2005 2:05 pm (#65 of 342)
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Choices, that would reduce our suspects significantly
I mean - in March 1999, PoA was not even out yet, according to the Scholastic website... This would leave us with only those present in book SS and CoS... Come to think of it, that realy makes no difference, does it??? *giggles* Well, after ten minutes of putzing around trying to figure out when PoA first came out, I realize that it does not really matter... *ahem* Oh well. I try, I really do... - - - - - - - - - -
essie125 - May 26, 2005 2:32 am (#66 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I think it is Petunia. Not only is her house unusually clean also Harry never got a warning for blowing up his aunt and the reason for that is not just Sirius black being on the run, but also because I belive that it was aunt Petunia who secretly made Aunt marge's glass explode and thhrough the schock of that made her swell up.
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applepie - May 26, 2005 6:52 am (#67 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Essie, that being said....it would arise all sorts of questions to me...
Did Harry really do all of the random acts of "emotional" magic, or was some of that Petunia's doing? Did Petunia do some of it on purpose to keep Harry under Vernon's disciplined hand? Maybe that's why she's so worried about the neighbors all the time...what have they possibly witnessed?
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essie125 - May 27, 2005 7:53 am (#68 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Well it's emotional magic, so I don't think she did it on purpose, and that's why the shock is so great. And I don't know, but Harry get's really angry with Marge after she broke her glass. At least in the book. So maybe the glass is Petunia's doing. Oh I just love what the fifth book has done. Petunia is one of my favourite character, just like Snape, because I don't belive that they really hate Harry that much. I think they would both protect him, if he could get to harm. They have both proven they would. Harry doesn't like them, but he can rely on them were he to be in danger. I think the Petunia not liking Harry is because Vernon does that. Do you know what the neighbours wouyld say if she and Vernon were to get a divorce.
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applepie - May 27, 2005 8:10 am (#69 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I agree that she would protect him. She already has in so many ways. Maybe her hatred of him is because she knows how much Vernon despises him, but not so much THAT Vernon despises him, as to WHY Vernon despises him. I think she is the one to do magic late, and her hating Harry is her desparation to deny that she is just like him.
You bringing up the divorce of the Dursley's leads me back to the protection issue of 4PD. If Petunia is removed, for whatever reason,...what happens to the protection?
See Protection at Privet Drive
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 8:29 am (#70 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
and her hating Harry is her desparation to deny that she is just like him.
Now there is a good reason for a writer to make it Petunia!
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applepie - May 27, 2005 8:31 am (#71 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Thank you, Thank you...**bows and waves**
Just kidding...I was beginning to wonder if I would ever make a valid contribution to the forum....
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 9:36 am (#72 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
I was beginning to wonder if I would ever make a valid contribution to the forum.
Well, that just leaves one of us now, applepie.
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applepie - May 27, 2005 9:38 am (#73 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
HH, I have no doubt that you've made various meaningful contributions.
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Choices - May 27, 2005 10:25 am (#74 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
My take on making valid contributions.....even the most frivolous theory may just be the thing that causes someone else to think about something and come up with an idea. You may laugh at someone's theory, then say wait a minute, if you change this to this, it just might work. I never hesitate to post an idea because someone else may take it and run with it and come up with a really sound and interesting theory. Not that I'm advocating posting frivolous theories - I prefer to see theories based on and supported by canon - but you never know..... :-)
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 27, 2005 10:33 am (#75 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
You're too kind, Choices & applepie!
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Regan of Gong - May 27, 2005 4:02 pm (#76 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Choices, I remember when you brought me back down to earth with canon evidence after I suggested Neville being the Half-Blood Prince. That was one time where I might have been wise to hesitate...
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 28, 2005 10:36 am (#77 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
Ouch, Regan! LOL
There is one thing that just keeps pecking away in my mind against Petunia being the one - JKR also stated that there is a bit more to Petunia. That would lead me to believe we might find out that she's in on DD making the squib watch over Harry in their absence, or something small like that. Unless JKR is holding out and downplaying it for our sakes, magic late in life seems like more than a bit. She's been on the money, so far, though, if you look back at her answers to the 5 books we've been able to check.
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Netherlandic - May 28, 2005 11:52 am (#78 of 342)
How I would love that! Petunia being able to perform magic. What a shocker for her husband and son!
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Regan of Gong - May 29, 2005 4:50 am (#79 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
What will the neighbours say?
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Netherlandic - May 29, 2005 12:05 pm (#80 of 342)
Indeed!
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Eloise Black - May 30, 2005 5:03 pm (#81 of 342)
Hi All
What if Vernon, is a "squib", and Petunia, is a muggle by choice.
DD, does say that "it is our choices that make us what we are", or "who we are".
This may be why Vernon, is so anti-magic and angry at the magic world.
What if Vernon, was the one to do magic late in life.
What do you guys think.
Eloise
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Finn BV - May 30, 2005 5:55 pm (#82 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
I wouldn't classify Vernon as a "squib," because then that would mean he would be a muggle born into a non-magic family. He's more like Lily, that he has parents who have some small trace of magic that they pass on to their child. I really don't think it would be Vernon, because he has no trace of Petunia's or Lily's blood. If he received magic Harry wouldn't go live with him, he would go with Petunia, wherever she was. (See also the "Protection at Privet Drive" thread.) I think our best bets are Lily, Figgy, or Filch.
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Choices - May 30, 2005 6:10 pm (#83 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
fbv807 - "I wouldn't classify Vernon as a "squib," because then that would mean he would be a muggle born into a non-magic family."
If I'm not mistaken, a Squib is a non-magical child born into a magical family - just the opposite of a muggle born witch or wizard.
fbv807 - "I think our best bets are Lily, Figgy, or Filch."
I think we can discount Lily - she was a witch and she is now dead. There won't be any late in life magic for her unfortunately.
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Finn BV - May 30, 2005 6:34 pm (#84 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Of course, Choices, you are right about squibs. I mean to say, "because that would mean he would be a muggle born into a MAGIC family." The "non" just seemed to creep in there somehow.
And as for the three I named, I simply meant that so far those seem to be the three most likely. I personally have not yet ruled out Lily, however, I haven't even established the fact that somebody will turn magic late in life!
Oh well. What a horrible post! :-) LOL – just establishing whatever ground we may have to work on.
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Solitaire - May 30, 2005 7:41 pm (#85 of 342)
I did not realize Jo had said someone will become magical late in life; I thought she said someone will manage to perform magic in desparate circumstances--or something like that--late in life.
Solitaire
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Eponine - May 30, 2005 7:56 pm (#86 of 342)
That is what she said Solitaire. I see it as being a one time only occurence, not a permanent development.
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Tomoé - May 30, 2005 8:18 pm (#87 of 342)
Back in business
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
fbv807 -> I personally have not yet ruled out Lily
Er, she got her Hogwarts letter, she was as old as the other students around her in Snape's worst memory and she's dead. What make you think she could be the one?
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Solitaire - May 30, 2005 9:47 pm (#88 of 342)
Perhaps fbv meant Petunia but wrote Lily by mistake???
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Finn BV - May 31, 2005 8:43 am (#89 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yes, I seem to be having a bad day. First I reverse the definition of Squibs and then throughout that post I switch Petunia and Lily. I realized that as I read it over and thought I had corrected everything, but… wow. *goes into a corner and hides*… just kidding
LOL, Tomoé, thanks for the reassurance that Lily's dead… :-)
Anyway, I have said this before, earlier in the thread. Jo says that there is a character who "manages to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about." I have taken this to mean that there will not necessarily be a character who will turn magical late in life, but that there was a character who turned magical, many years ago. Go back to post 62.
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HungarianHorntail11 - May 31, 2005 10:22 am (#90 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
It could also be because she has had this entire story beginning to end laid out in her mind for so long. Who knows?
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essie125 - Jun 1, 2005 1:20 am (#91 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Your can get inspired by othe people's theories. You may be able to look at a completely different angle then the person who posted it. By the way Last night I had an epiphany. How can hermione send Harry things by owl if she doesn't have one? Could this mean that Hermione lives in Londen, making it easy for her to go to Diagon Alley? I know it's of topic, but I was just wondering about this. Does Hermione strike you as a city girl? I don't think she travells by flew powder.
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Tomoé - Jun 1, 2005 4:30 pm (#92 of 342)
Back in business
I thought you switched Petunia and Lily at first, but when you repeated it was Lily, I didn't know what to think anymore.
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Regan of Gong - Jun 1, 2005 11:48 pm (#93 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Hmmmm, I guess she must Essie. How else would she do it?
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essie125 - Jun 3, 2005 1:13 am (#94 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I have no idea. I never imagined her to be a city girl, more of a country girl. Not that it's very important to the plot though.
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ellebell86 - Jun 7, 2005 8:31 pm (#95 of 342)
Both her father and mother are dentists, it would have to be a town that is somewhat large to support 2 dentists. London is a possibility. Hermione mentions going to the ministry of magic to look up McGonagall as a animagus, so she probably lives near or in London.
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Tomoé - Jun 8, 2005 8:08 am (#96 of 342)
Back in business
It doesn't have to be that big a town, I know a town of 2382 inhabitants that have three dentists (all working in the same private clinic). There's another town with another dentist clinic 10 kilometers away, with a polulation of 3018 (I have no idea how many dentist work there). Sure, some of their clients come from smaller village around.
So the Granger could came from almost anywhere in Britain.
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haymoni - Jun 8, 2005 4:42 pm (#97 of 342)
I don't know about travelling around Europe from country to country but I figured with the trip to France and being dentists - I just pictured big city, some place where a girl with magical powers would go unnoticed.
"It's like going into Wisconsin!"
Uh oh - she's speaking in movie quotes!
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I Am Used Vlad - Jun 8, 2005 6:03 pm (#98 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
I don't think anyone is suggesting that one of Hermione's parents is going to be the magic late in life person, so I'll try to bring it back on topic.
fbv, what would be the point of having a character from the past who developed magic late in life? How would further the story?
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Choices - Jun 8, 2005 6:56 pm (#99 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think we keep forgetting that this person doesn't become magical late in life - they only are able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation, and then they go back to being non-magical.
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Finn BV - Jun 8, 2005 7:24 pm (#100 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Vlad, what Choices said is right OR the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time OR the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time. They are either done with it (back to being a Muggle), going to be a surprise (for instance – SIMPLY FOR EXAMPLE – Albus Dumbledore was always a Muggle but then he got magic late in life and now it's a surprise – REMEMBER SIMPLY AN EXAMPLE I HIGHLY DOUBT IT).
I really think, though, that it's the last one, JKR tells us of a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life. I doubt GG too, but it's simply an example to explain what appears to be something only I believe.
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Magic late in life (Post 101 to 150)
Elanor Wed May 18, 2011 8:51 am
Choices - Jun 8, 2005 7:35 pm (#101 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
fbv - "JKR tells us of a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life."
Could you direct me to the quote from JKR about this? All I have heard is that she says there will be a person in one of the upcoming books, who does magic (late in life) in a desperate situation. They do not become magical, but are simply able to perform a feat of magic in a desperate situation. Please tell me where she says this??
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applepie - Jun 8, 2005 8:10 pm (#102 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I'm still banking on Petunia. But, if I'm wrong...we will soon find out, and I will happily admit it.
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Tomoé - Jun 8, 2005 8:51 pm (#103 of 342)
Back in business
Here it is:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
So, the options are:
a) the person is only able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation
b)the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time
c)the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time.
It sounds rather like a, or more likely we witness that person first emotional magic, but we don't witness the rest of her/his story.
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applepie - Jun 9, 2005 6:48 am (#104 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Tomoé, I would have to agree. I believe "a" would be my choice as well.
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Finn BV - Jun 9, 2005 7:23 am (#105 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Choices, when I said "tells" I was in the wrong tense. I meant to say "Perhaps JKR will tell us of someone…"
Anyway, to everybody: I have said this before regarding the quote Tomoé has given us:
Since JKR has the entire story planned out, she can say "there is" a character, meaning that someone along in her story – whether it be before, during, or after the seven years in the books – was able, is able, or will be able to perform magic in desperate circumstances. Sorry for the boldness, just trying to reinforce this. Just because she says "there is" doesn't mean that the person is still alive. She knows everybody in the story, and so she can say "there is." Am I still not making sense?
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applepie - Jun 9, 2005 8:06 am (#106 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
No, I understand perfectly.
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Joanne R. Reid - Jun 10, 2005 8:29 am (#107 of 342)
Hi,
We've made a lot of great arguments for and against many characters performing magic late in life. Although I've read and contemplated each, I'm still sticking with my candidate.
Petunia has already surprised us. I think she's going to do it again. JM2K.
Thanks,
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applepie - Jun 10, 2005 8:34 am (#108 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Here, Here... *raises butterbeer to Joanne*
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Solitaire - Jun 12, 2005 11:34 am (#109 of 342)
a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life
I do not think GG acquired magic late in life. I believe he, together with Slytherin, Ravenclaw, and Hufflepuff, were considered the greatest Wizards and Witches of their time, and that is why they started Hogwarts in the first place--to pass on their knowledge to up-and-coming young Witches and Wizards.
I think there are three realistic candidates for the "magic late in life" position: Figgy, Filch, and Petunia. Each is as likely as the other, IMO. Figgy is my hope, though.
Solitaire
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Ydnam96 - Jun 13, 2005 9:01 am (#110 of 342)
Maybe one of Hermione's parents?!? Maybe they will find that they are needed to protect their daughter and whala, they have magical powers. I mean, Hermione got it from somewhere down the familial line didn't she?
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Catherine - Jun 13, 2005 9:09 am (#111 of 342)
Canon Seeker
I mean, Hermione got it from somewhere down the familial line didn't she? --Ydnam
I don't think it works like that. I see it as more of a spontanteous thing, rather like a genetic sport. I seem to remember a quote by JKR; I'll post if if I can find it.
EDIT: From the Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999:
Hi, Ms. Rowling. How does a Muggle-born like Hermione develop magical abilities?
Nobody knows where magic comes from. It is like any other talent. Sometimes it seems to be inherited, but others are the only ones in their family who have the ability.
So one does not necessarily have magical blood further back in the family line if one is a Muggle-born, although it could be the case.
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Mrs. Sirius - Jun 15, 2005 7:44 am (#112 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
I think there are three realistic candidates for the "magic late in life" position: Figgy, Filch, and Petunia.
I certainly agree with the three likely candidates. But Aunt Petunia and Filch I think will have greater impact.
Filch is a squib, quite possibly from an all wizard family, like the Malfoys (proud and imperious)or possibly from a Stan Shunpike type (while Stan is magical, it seems to me from how he is portrayed in the book and movie, not all that powerful, he carries Harry's luggage huffing and puffing). Filch has to work for, service the children of wizard who but for the fluke of nature, would be his peers and social equals. He was to clean up after, and chase after, the likes of Fred and George. As we have seen Filch is often emotional when he is cleaning up after-chasing the students. And to make it all worse the little brats now even know his secret, he's a squib.
Aunt Pet has great disdain for her sister and all that she represents. Lily was beautiful, she played with things which were not all that clean (frog spawn in the pockets, yuck) she didn't conform to the strict norm, she dressed weird. Harry is just like his mother. But he is her blood. When push comes to shove in an emotional moment I can see Pet overcome by emotion and coming up with some magic. We saw in OoTP 1) her come to her sense and protect Harry (after Dumbldore gentle reminder) 2) acknowledge that she knows more than she lets on.
It may happen that she'll use magic in extremeous, more likely to protect Dudley than Harry but still plausible.
I think that if it is Mrs. Figg it will be the only least emotional to the overall story but gratifying because of how poorly she was treated by the Fudge at the hearing and how dismissed in general squibs are.
Overall I think JK writes a very well rounded story. She gives information and satisfies characters that are not central to the core story.
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applepie - Jun 15, 2005 8:16 am (#113 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Well said, Mrs. Sirius. I can't wait to find out!
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Choices - Jun 15, 2005 12:17 pm (#114 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Mrs. Sirius - "It may happen that she'll use magic in extremeous, more likely to protect Dudley"
If Petunia was going to do emotional magic, I think she would have used it when Fred and George dropped the Ton Tongue Toffee and Dudley was choking on his four foot long, slimy purple tongue. She was surely hysterical enough. Sorry, I can't type anymore for laughing. That whole scene cracks me up.
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Solitaire - Jun 15, 2005 2:31 pm (#115 of 342)
Choices, she was certainly hysterical. But Arthur remained behind the kids, and she knew he was a Wizard. If she turns out to be the one to perform magic, I believe it will be because no Wizard is available to help her. Any Wizard who IS present will either have been injured, killed, or be a DE who is trying to harm her and her family.
We also do not know what kind of magic will be done. Will it be defensive or offensive? If it is Pet who performs magic, it will almost have to be something she has seen/heard performed by either Harry or Lily. Perhaps it will be something like summoning help. I can hardly wait to find out who does what, can you?
Solitaire
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Choices - Jun 15, 2005 5:39 pm (#116 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I can't wait either. I was being somewhat facetious about the tongue episode - I really don't think it is going to be Petunia, but you never know. I am betting more on it being Mrs. Figg or Filch. Will July never get here?? Tap, tap, tap.....
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applepie - Jun 15, 2005 7:07 pm (#117 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Choices, I'm hoping for Petunia, but I do think you have it narrowed down to the appropriate three. I think it will most likely be Petunia, Figgy or Filch. I do hope that it is not Filch. That would not be impressive to me. I think the most impressive would be Petunia because she is so much against it. But, maybe that is why it will not be her, because it is too predictable.
WILL JULY 16TH EVER GET HERE???? Sorry, didn't mean to scream...
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Ydnam96 - Jun 16, 2005 4:47 pm (#118 of 342)
Maybe it will be Vernon. Hah. Wouldn't that be a laugh!
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applepie - Jun 17, 2005 9:56 am (#119 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I think he would scare himself....lol
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Netherlandic - Jun 17, 2005 1:56 pm (#120 of 342)
Then he would certainly be a candidate for St. Mungo's. lol.
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essie125 - Jun 24, 2005 1:12 am (#121 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Applepie as much as I hope July the 16th will come soon. I don't think JKR meant that a non-magical person performing magic late in life will show his- or herself in the sixth book.
Don't get me wrong I'm curious to, but it might not happen.
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applepie - Jun 24, 2005 8:47 am (#122 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Essie, no worries. I have come to realize that the only person who knows what will happen is JKR, so anything else that anyone thinks is pure speculation.
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Regan of Gong - Jun 25, 2005 6:01 am (#123 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Wait, now I'm tipping Vernon. He's going to do it either when he's really scared (e.g Harry apparating, Neville bouncing) or really angry (e.g Harry/Aunt Marge incident).
He seems to have the least control over his emotions of any Muggle or Squib in the book, and now I think about it, if something gets very extreme (family threatened etc.), he might just lose it.
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Paul Filippelli - Jun 25, 2005 11:25 am (#124 of 342)
I like the Vernon idea. I don't think it will be Petunia, Figg, or Filch because those are too realistic. Ms. Rowling always likes to surprise us. I really want it to be Petunia, but that might be too obvious. Then again, she did say, "...I am being shockingly indiscreet."
On the subject of the A, B, and C options, I will point out that she said circumstances, plural, not circumstance singular. I would say that instead of in one major incident using magic, it would be sparked by an incident and used in all future emergencies.
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essie125 - Jun 27, 2005 7:04 am (#125 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I think that in the case of circumstances it won't be Vernon, because he will die of a serious heartattack when he finds out he is able to perform magic LOL.
With respect to all the people who have actually lost someone because he/she had a heartattack.
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Solitaire - Jun 27, 2005 12:19 pm (#126 of 342)
I don't see Vernon as the one who will exhibit magic. He is too physical; he resorts to "manhandling" Harry when he is angry. Remember that even Millicent Bulstrode resorted to physical behavior--putting Hermione in a headlock--rather than magic when her emotions got the better of her. Uncle Vernon has a very short fuse. I expect he would be more likely to attempt something physical.
Solitaire
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applepie - Jun 27, 2005 12:31 pm (#127 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Solitaire, Vernon's definitely been mad enough to produce some emotional magic. I agree that if he was the one to do it, he would have done it already. He's a pretty angry guy (at least where Harry and the Wizarding World are concerned).
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frogface - Jun 27, 2005 2:41 pm (#128 of 342)
Because Petunia has taken part in a magical contract, so to speak (by which I mean her part in protecting Harry by taking him in), do you think that this "exposure" to magic could have some how given her the ability to do limited magic in desperate circumstances? Would she still be considered a muggle if this were the case? She may be in JKR's eyes because she wasn't born with any magical ability.
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applepie - Jun 27, 2005 2:42 pm (#129 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Wonderful theory, Frogface. I can't wait to find out.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jun 30, 2005 7:10 pm (#130 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I seriously doubt if Uncle will make it out of book 7. He's just to big and juicy a target for Voldemort or Bella.
Mickey
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Ag Hart - Jun 30, 2005 7:13 pm (#131 of 342)
Perhaps Petunia does not have any latent magical ability, but as Lily's sister she could have access to some of Lily's magical devices. I'm thinking of something on the order of the invisibility cloak or the Put-Outer, but something we haven't seen yet. (I wouldn't think one would have to be magical in order to use these devices.) In fact, these magical items could be hidden below the squeaky stair. I don't really think this is what JKR necessarily meant, but it is another possibility. Sorry if this has been discussed before, but I'm new and although I've read a lot of posts, I haven't read all of them.
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Solitaire - Jun 30, 2005 10:45 pm (#132 of 342)
do you think that this "exposure" to magic could have some how given her the ability to do limited magic in desperate circumstances
It sounds as if magic is contagious ... like the flu! Somehow, I don't think so. If Pet peforms magic, I believe it will be because she simply does and not because she was "exposed" to magic.
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frogface - Jul 1, 2005 2:58 am (#133 of 342)
Thats fair enough Solitaire, I only suggested it because of the JKR quote where she says that Petunia "is a muggle...but", combined with the fact that she said a character will perform magic in desperate circumstances leads me to think it could very well be Petunia, the only problem being of course, how could she perform magic if she is a muggle? This seemed to be the only idea I could come up with that would link the two quotes and make them make sense. Then again of course it may not be Petunia after all!
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Saralinda Again - Jul 1, 2005 8:47 am (#134 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
Perhaps we're meant to believe that the potential for magic might be buried deep within each of us -- sort of like the reserves of strength of a 45-kilo grandmother who lifts a car off someone she loves -- just waiting for that moment of righteous motivation to unleash it.
JKR has already done a good bit to blur the lines between muggle and magical worlds (for us, not for her characters). The dementors, for example, could be a real-world cause of depression that we don't see because -- well, because we're only muggles, after all. And doggone it if we don't feel less depressed sometimes after chocolate.
I suspect that it would be completely consistent with JKR's world as she has already outlined it for a muggle motivated exclusively by love to find within one sudden burst of emotional magic. I doubt that the person would even think of it afterwards in terms of "I did magic!" -- More like, "Wow, I don't know how I did that and I'm sure I couldn't do it again!"
I suspect that many of us have had moments exactly like that already in our lives.
JM2K
S/K
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Solitaire - Jul 1, 2005 2:37 pm (#135 of 342)
the potential for magic might be buried deep within each of us
Saralinda, I think that is it in a nutshell!
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frogface - Jul 3, 2005 4:40 am (#136 of 342)
Its certaintly more touching and poetic than my idea
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Saralinda Again - Jul 3, 2005 10:43 am (#137 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
frogface: Its certaintly more touching and poetic than my idea
Nah, I just used more words. That's actually a sign of a weak writer, having to use three paragraphs where you said pretty much the same thing in one.
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HungarianHorntail11 - Jul 4, 2005 2:16 pm (#138 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
And doggone it if we don't feel less depressed sometimes after chocolate.
LOL Saralinda Again.
I sure hope we don't need extra large bars of chocolate at the end of the series!
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Saralinda Again - Jul 4, 2005 4:36 pm (#139 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
HungarianHorntail1: I sure hope we don't need extra large bars of chocolate at the end of the series!
I'm already in a strange pickle. Saturday, I thought, Oh, boy, in just two weeks I won't be speculating anymore -- I'll be reading it.
And a little while later, I suddenly realized, Rats, by this time in two weeks, I'll be done with my first read ... and [sniffle] looking forard again [sniffle] to that l-o-o-o-o-ng wait for HP VII!
Upload me some chocolate, already.
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sanity - Jul 4, 2005 4:47 pm (#140 of 342)
I had posted this under *Good Old Aunt Petunia* (thank you fbv807 for directing me here)
sanity - Jul 4, 2005 1:58 pm I personally believe there is more to Petunia than meets the eye. Due to the tremendous jealousy of her sister she hides her abilities and totally shuns everything magical. I believe her (Petunia) to be magical, more than a squib, but not nearly as gifted as Lilly. We just have not had a chance to delve into Petunia's personal past so we do not know for sure if she is magical or not ... yet.
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HungarianHorntail11 - Jul 5, 2005 9:59 am (#141 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
That could be why she answered in a strange way that Petunia 'is a muggle, but' (Is that quote correct?).
JKR also told us there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia. That doesn't seem to allude to much, IMHO. She sure would be playing with us if you're correct, sanity. Now I'm confused again.
Saralinda Again, that is funny, but think of the bright side, we'll have so much more to go on for Book 7. (Although I don't think it would be premature to start prodding JKR for Book 7. LOL)
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Mrs. Sirius - Jul 5, 2005 11:25 am (#142 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
This isn't directly on topic, but it is "the end". On the Lexicon homepage they have now put up Book 7.
Edit: oh wrong thread, this isn't the "In the End" thread.
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Kip Carter - Aug 2, 2005 11:32 am (#143 of 342)
co-Host with Steve on the Lexicon Forum, but he has the final say as the Owner!
This thread was closed down during the sixteen day period surrounding the release of Book Six. It is now opened for posts.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 2, 2005 11:36 am (#144 of 342)
No one did magic late in life in HBP so we are free to guess. I'm still on Aunt Petunia.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 15, 2005 4:49 am (#145 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
You folks on this thread seem to have set matters up perfectly for my pet theory so I will post it here as well as on "Good Old Aunt Petunia":
recap:Here's the quote we are working with: JKR Interview: (Barnes and Noble March 19, 1999)
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children?
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotional magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now).
So, the options are:
a) the person is only able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation
b)the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time
c)the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time.
It sounds rather like a, or more likely we witness that person first emotional magic, but we don't witness the rest of her/his story.
THEN ADDED: Frogface - Jul 1, 2005 2:58 am (#133 of 144) That's fair enough Solitaire, I only suggested it because of the JKR quote where she says that Petunia "is a muggle...but", combined with the fact that she said a character will perform magic in desperate circumstances leads me to think it could very well be Petunia, the only problem being of course, how could she perform magic if she is a muggle? This seemed to be the only idea I could come up with that would link the two quotes and make them make sense. Then again of course it may not be Petunia after all!
THUS:
Could Petunia be a hag?............. I have searched myself blue and I can't see why hags are considered non-human in the Lexicon. They have some minimal magical abilities and while JKR hasn’t said much about them as a group, individually and, according to the dictionary, they are women.
It seems reasonable that if Wizard folk can have Squibs, then Muggles should sometimes have their equivalent and what would they be called? JKR says that Petunia is a muggle. She also says Petunia is a bit more than a muggle and the thought makes her laugh (rather wildly) for some reason.(separate interview)
If Petunia were minimally magical, she would have gotten the call to Hogwarts in 1960 and not discovered her lack of ability for some months into the term.
DD seems to share an old secret with Petunia and this would fit the fact that they corresponded repeatedly before Harry came to live at #4.
Perhaps DD has cast a spell helping her to hide her haggishness. Maybe that spell expires when Harry comes of age, which, until now, she clearly thought would be when he turns 18.
This could be why she was so red-faced at that point in the conversation with DD in THBP. She thought she had more time for something than she does.
Her unnatural cleanliness obsession could be an over-compensation for a haggish characteristic or maybe she just wants the others to believe her to be cleaning while she gobbles raw meat!
That Petunia is in fact a hag would explain away a number of unsolved mysteries including her apparent jealous hatred of the Wizarding world.
When you look at what it says about individual hags you see that they are unattractive and wont to use Beautification Potion. They are also able to make and/or use simple potions and charms. They also mix readily with Muggles and Wizards and one even attended the Council of Wizards. As I said before, DD may be helping Petunia to suppress her haggishness somehow and that would explain their secret. I would guess that the haggish qualities also increase with age.
Perhaps the evergreen Lily-of-the-Nile plant (Agapanthus) is an essential potion ingredient...For them to be flourishing, Petunia would have to be over-wintering them indoors, thus making her a lily potter(tic)! OK, that was under the table but kinda funny.
That a Hag is actually a failed muggle Witch is a stretch, I admit. BUT: If a Wizard (or a muggle) is bitten, for example, do they then not become "a bit more?" (As JKR has said Petunia is) Lupin is still a Wizard but that's not all. If Petunia were a hag and Hags are muggles with only minimal magical abilities, wouldn't she be a muggle and a bit more?
Petunia has chosen a modern and upright muggle life. She would hate being a Hag if she were one. Who wouldn't?
I find no flaws in the supposition that she is a muggle AND a hag. No proof either, of course, but it would, at least, fit the facts so far in a cohesive fashion despite my incoherency.
What say you?
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Kerfuffle - Aug 15, 2005 12:06 pm (#146 of 342)
I wonder if Merope is the person who does magic late in life under desperate circumstances? She has had a terrible life with her father and brother, her father calls her a squib.
I don't have my books with me so I can't reference page numbers, but after the scene in the Pensieve that Harry and Dumbeldore witness, the person returns from the MOM and takes Marvolo and Morfin into custody. Marvolo is gone for 6 months and Morfin for some time longer than that.
Think about this, Merope is left with no money, no magic, no way to support herself. She is desperately in love with Tom Riddle Sr and I think she "seizes the day" and tries to find a way out of her current existance by using a love potion.
Remember also, Slughorn says in his first lesson with HRH that obsessive love causes more trouble than anything else and that the love potion was the most dangerous of all those potions he had made up as samples.
What do you think?
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Steve Newton - Aug 15, 2005 12:11 pm (#147 of 342)
Librarian
I think that we have already seen Merope do magic. Doesn't she, clumsily, try to retrieve a pot with magic? She also seems to be, ahem, dead.
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Kerfuffle - Aug 15, 2005 12:15 pm (#148 of 342)
Yes, I know she is dead. JKR doesn't say the person doing magic will be in present day, she just says we will see it. Well, we do see it --in the Pensieve.
Perhaps I read the passage wrong, but I thought Merope was unable to retrieve the pot and had to pick it up by hand, thereby infuriating her father who called her a squib.
Just my 2 knuts.
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Steve Newton - Aug 15, 2005 12:24 pm (#149 of 342)
Librarian
I'll have to reread. I thought that she used ineffective magic. I could be wrong.
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Saralinda Again - Aug 16, 2005 8:22 am (#150 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
I think that just being around that hideous Papa Gaunt would have given any dreamy-eyed adolescent girl stage-fright or performance anxiety, or whatever.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
fbv - "JKR tells us of a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life."
Could you direct me to the quote from JKR about this? All I have heard is that she says there will be a person in one of the upcoming books, who does magic (late in life) in a desperate situation. They do not become magical, but are simply able to perform a feat of magic in a desperate situation. Please tell me where she says this??
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applepie - Jun 8, 2005 8:10 pm (#102 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I'm still banking on Petunia. But, if I'm wrong...we will soon find out, and I will happily admit it.
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Tomoé - Jun 8, 2005 8:51 pm (#103 of 342)
Back in business
Here it is:
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? [...]
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about. (Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999)
So, the options are:
a) the person is only able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation
b)the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time
c)the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time.
It sounds rather like a, or more likely we witness that person first emotional magic, but we don't witness the rest of her/his story.
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applepie - Jun 9, 2005 6:48 am (#104 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Tomoé, I would have to agree. I believe "a" would be my choice as well.
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Finn BV - Jun 9, 2005 7:23 am (#105 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Choices, when I said "tells" I was in the wrong tense. I meant to say "Perhaps JKR will tell us of someone…"
Anyway, to everybody: I have said this before regarding the quote Tomoé has given us:
Since JKR has the entire story planned out, she can say "there is" a character, meaning that someone along in her story – whether it be before, during, or after the seven years in the books – was able, is able, or will be able to perform magic in desperate circumstances. Sorry for the boldness, just trying to reinforce this. Just because she says "there is" doesn't mean that the person is still alive. She knows everybody in the story, and so she can say "there is." Am I still not making sense?
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applepie - Jun 9, 2005 8:06 am (#106 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
No, I understand perfectly.
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Joanne R. Reid - Jun 10, 2005 8:29 am (#107 of 342)
Hi,
We've made a lot of great arguments for and against many characters performing magic late in life. Although I've read and contemplated each, I'm still sticking with my candidate.
Petunia has already surprised us. I think she's going to do it again. JM2K.
Thanks,
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applepie - Jun 10, 2005 8:34 am (#108 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Here, Here... *raises butterbeer to Joanne*
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Solitaire - Jun 12, 2005 11:34 am (#109 of 342)
a person who used magic, many years ago – perhaps Godric Gryffindor – but they gained it late in life
I do not think GG acquired magic late in life. I believe he, together with Slytherin, Ravenclaw, and Hufflepuff, were considered the greatest Wizards and Witches of their time, and that is why they started Hogwarts in the first place--to pass on their knowledge to up-and-coming young Witches and Wizards.
I think there are three realistic candidates for the "magic late in life" position: Figgy, Filch, and Petunia. Each is as likely as the other, IMO. Figgy is my hope, though.
Solitaire
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Ydnam96 - Jun 13, 2005 9:01 am (#110 of 342)
Maybe one of Hermione's parents?!? Maybe they will find that they are needed to protect their daughter and whala, they have magical powers. I mean, Hermione got it from somewhere down the familial line didn't she?
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Catherine - Jun 13, 2005 9:09 am (#111 of 342)
Canon Seeker
I mean, Hermione got it from somewhere down the familial line didn't she? --Ydnam
I don't think it works like that. I see it as more of a spontanteous thing, rather like a genetic sport. I seem to remember a quote by JKR; I'll post if if I can find it.
EDIT: From the Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999:
Hi, Ms. Rowling. How does a Muggle-born like Hermione develop magical abilities?
Nobody knows where magic comes from. It is like any other talent. Sometimes it seems to be inherited, but others are the only ones in their family who have the ability.
So one does not necessarily have magical blood further back in the family line if one is a Muggle-born, although it could be the case.
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Mrs. Sirius - Jun 15, 2005 7:44 am (#112 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
I think there are three realistic candidates for the "magic late in life" position: Figgy, Filch, and Petunia.
I certainly agree with the three likely candidates. But Aunt Petunia and Filch I think will have greater impact.
Filch is a squib, quite possibly from an all wizard family, like the Malfoys (proud and imperious)or possibly from a Stan Shunpike type (while Stan is magical, it seems to me from how he is portrayed in the book and movie, not all that powerful, he carries Harry's luggage huffing and puffing). Filch has to work for, service the children of wizard who but for the fluke of nature, would be his peers and social equals. He was to clean up after, and chase after, the likes of Fred and George. As we have seen Filch is often emotional when he is cleaning up after-chasing the students. And to make it all worse the little brats now even know his secret, he's a squib.
Aunt Pet has great disdain for her sister and all that she represents. Lily was beautiful, she played with things which were not all that clean (frog spawn in the pockets, yuck) she didn't conform to the strict norm, she dressed weird. Harry is just like his mother. But he is her blood. When push comes to shove in an emotional moment I can see Pet overcome by emotion and coming up with some magic. We saw in OoTP 1) her come to her sense and protect Harry (after Dumbldore gentle reminder) 2) acknowledge that she knows more than she lets on.
It may happen that she'll use magic in extremeous, more likely to protect Dudley than Harry but still plausible.
I think that if it is Mrs. Figg it will be the only least emotional to the overall story but gratifying because of how poorly she was treated by the Fudge at the hearing and how dismissed in general squibs are.
Overall I think JK writes a very well rounded story. She gives information and satisfies characters that are not central to the core story.
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applepie - Jun 15, 2005 8:16 am (#113 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Well said, Mrs. Sirius. I can't wait to find out!
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Choices - Jun 15, 2005 12:17 pm (#114 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Mrs. Sirius - "It may happen that she'll use magic in extremeous, more likely to protect Dudley"
If Petunia was going to do emotional magic, I think she would have used it when Fred and George dropped the Ton Tongue Toffee and Dudley was choking on his four foot long, slimy purple tongue. She was surely hysterical enough. Sorry, I can't type anymore for laughing. That whole scene cracks me up.
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Solitaire - Jun 15, 2005 2:31 pm (#115 of 342)
Choices, she was certainly hysterical. But Arthur remained behind the kids, and she knew he was a Wizard. If she turns out to be the one to perform magic, I believe it will be because no Wizard is available to help her. Any Wizard who IS present will either have been injured, killed, or be a DE who is trying to harm her and her family.
We also do not know what kind of magic will be done. Will it be defensive or offensive? If it is Pet who performs magic, it will almost have to be something she has seen/heard performed by either Harry or Lily. Perhaps it will be something like summoning help. I can hardly wait to find out who does what, can you?
Solitaire
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Choices - Jun 15, 2005 5:39 pm (#116 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I can't wait either. I was being somewhat facetious about the tongue episode - I really don't think it is going to be Petunia, but you never know. I am betting more on it being Mrs. Figg or Filch. Will July never get here?? Tap, tap, tap.....
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applepie - Jun 15, 2005 7:07 pm (#117 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Choices, I'm hoping for Petunia, but I do think you have it narrowed down to the appropriate three. I think it will most likely be Petunia, Figgy or Filch. I do hope that it is not Filch. That would not be impressive to me. I think the most impressive would be Petunia because she is so much against it. But, maybe that is why it will not be her, because it is too predictable.
WILL JULY 16TH EVER GET HERE???? Sorry, didn't mean to scream...
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Ydnam96 - Jun 16, 2005 4:47 pm (#118 of 342)
Maybe it will be Vernon. Hah. Wouldn't that be a laugh!
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applepie - Jun 17, 2005 9:56 am (#119 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
I think he would scare himself....lol
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Netherlandic - Jun 17, 2005 1:56 pm (#120 of 342)
Then he would certainly be a candidate for St. Mungo's. lol.
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essie125 - Jun 24, 2005 1:12 am (#121 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
Applepie as much as I hope July the 16th will come soon. I don't think JKR meant that a non-magical person performing magic late in life will show his- or herself in the sixth book.
Don't get me wrong I'm curious to, but it might not happen.
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applepie - Jun 24, 2005 8:47 am (#122 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Essie, no worries. I have come to realize that the only person who knows what will happen is JKR, so anything else that anyone thinks is pure speculation.
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Regan of Gong - Jun 25, 2005 6:01 am (#123 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
Wait, now I'm tipping Vernon. He's going to do it either when he's really scared (e.g Harry apparating, Neville bouncing) or really angry (e.g Harry/Aunt Marge incident).
He seems to have the least control over his emotions of any Muggle or Squib in the book, and now I think about it, if something gets very extreme (family threatened etc.), he might just lose it.
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Paul Filippelli - Jun 25, 2005 11:25 am (#124 of 342)
I like the Vernon idea. I don't think it will be Petunia, Figg, or Filch because those are too realistic. Ms. Rowling always likes to surprise us. I really want it to be Petunia, but that might be too obvious. Then again, she did say, "...I am being shockingly indiscreet."
On the subject of the A, B, and C options, I will point out that she said circumstances, plural, not circumstance singular. I would say that instead of in one major incident using magic, it would be sparked by an incident and used in all future emergencies.
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essie125 - Jun 27, 2005 7:04 am (#125 of 342)
Jo, of course I think about Alan when I think about Snape, Who wouldn't think about Alan all day every day eh.
I think that in the case of circumstances it won't be Vernon, because he will die of a serious heartattack when he finds out he is able to perform magic LOL.
With respect to all the people who have actually lost someone because he/she had a heartattack.
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Solitaire - Jun 27, 2005 12:19 pm (#126 of 342)
I don't see Vernon as the one who will exhibit magic. He is too physical; he resorts to "manhandling" Harry when he is angry. Remember that even Millicent Bulstrode resorted to physical behavior--putting Hermione in a headlock--rather than magic when her emotions got the better of her. Uncle Vernon has a very short fuse. I expect he would be more likely to attempt something physical.
Solitaire
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applepie - Jun 27, 2005 12:31 pm (#127 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Solitaire, Vernon's definitely been mad enough to produce some emotional magic. I agree that if he was the one to do it, he would have done it already. He's a pretty angry guy (at least where Harry and the Wizarding World are concerned).
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frogface - Jun 27, 2005 2:41 pm (#128 of 342)
Because Petunia has taken part in a magical contract, so to speak (by which I mean her part in protecting Harry by taking him in), do you think that this "exposure" to magic could have some how given her the ability to do limited magic in desperate circumstances? Would she still be considered a muggle if this were the case? She may be in JKR's eyes because she wasn't born with any magical ability.
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applepie - Jun 27, 2005 2:42 pm (#129 of 342)
"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." -- Oscar Wilde
Wonderful theory, Frogface. I can't wait to find out.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jun 30, 2005 7:10 pm (#130 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I seriously doubt if Uncle will make it out of book 7. He's just to big and juicy a target for Voldemort or Bella.
Mickey
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Ag Hart - Jun 30, 2005 7:13 pm (#131 of 342)
Perhaps Petunia does not have any latent magical ability, but as Lily's sister she could have access to some of Lily's magical devices. I'm thinking of something on the order of the invisibility cloak or the Put-Outer, but something we haven't seen yet. (I wouldn't think one would have to be magical in order to use these devices.) In fact, these magical items could be hidden below the squeaky stair. I don't really think this is what JKR necessarily meant, but it is another possibility. Sorry if this has been discussed before, but I'm new and although I've read a lot of posts, I haven't read all of them.
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Solitaire - Jun 30, 2005 10:45 pm (#132 of 342)
do you think that this "exposure" to magic could have some how given her the ability to do limited magic in desperate circumstances
It sounds as if magic is contagious ... like the flu! Somehow, I don't think so. If Pet peforms magic, I believe it will be because she simply does and not because she was "exposed" to magic.
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frogface - Jul 1, 2005 2:58 am (#133 of 342)
Thats fair enough Solitaire, I only suggested it because of the JKR quote where she says that Petunia "is a muggle...but", combined with the fact that she said a character will perform magic in desperate circumstances leads me to think it could very well be Petunia, the only problem being of course, how could she perform magic if she is a muggle? This seemed to be the only idea I could come up with that would link the two quotes and make them make sense. Then again of course it may not be Petunia after all!
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Saralinda Again - Jul 1, 2005 8:47 am (#134 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
Perhaps we're meant to believe that the potential for magic might be buried deep within each of us -- sort of like the reserves of strength of a 45-kilo grandmother who lifts a car off someone she loves -- just waiting for that moment of righteous motivation to unleash it.
JKR has already done a good bit to blur the lines between muggle and magical worlds (for us, not for her characters). The dementors, for example, could be a real-world cause of depression that we don't see because -- well, because we're only muggles, after all. And doggone it if we don't feel less depressed sometimes after chocolate.
I suspect that it would be completely consistent with JKR's world as she has already outlined it for a muggle motivated exclusively by love to find within one sudden burst of emotional magic. I doubt that the person would even think of it afterwards in terms of "I did magic!" -- More like, "Wow, I don't know how I did that and I'm sure I couldn't do it again!"
I suspect that many of us have had moments exactly like that already in our lives.
JM2K
S/K
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Solitaire - Jul 1, 2005 2:37 pm (#135 of 342)
the potential for magic might be buried deep within each of us
Saralinda, I think that is it in a nutshell!
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frogface - Jul 3, 2005 4:40 am (#136 of 342)
Its certaintly more touching and poetic than my idea
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Saralinda Again - Jul 3, 2005 10:43 am (#137 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
frogface: Its certaintly more touching and poetic than my idea
Nah, I just used more words. That's actually a sign of a weak writer, having to use three paragraphs where you said pretty much the same thing in one.
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HungarianHorntail11 - Jul 4, 2005 2:16 pm (#138 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
And doggone it if we don't feel less depressed sometimes after chocolate.
LOL Saralinda Again.
I sure hope we don't need extra large bars of chocolate at the end of the series!
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Saralinda Again - Jul 4, 2005 4:36 pm (#139 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
HungarianHorntail1: I sure hope we don't need extra large bars of chocolate at the end of the series!
I'm already in a strange pickle. Saturday, I thought, Oh, boy, in just two weeks I won't be speculating anymore -- I'll be reading it.
And a little while later, I suddenly realized, Rats, by this time in two weeks, I'll be done with my first read ... and [sniffle] looking forard again [sniffle] to that l-o-o-o-o-ng wait for HP VII!
Upload me some chocolate, already.
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sanity - Jul 4, 2005 4:47 pm (#140 of 342)
I had posted this under *Good Old Aunt Petunia* (thank you fbv807 for directing me here)
sanity - Jul 4, 2005 1:58 pm I personally believe there is more to Petunia than meets the eye. Due to the tremendous jealousy of her sister she hides her abilities and totally shuns everything magical. I believe her (Petunia) to be magical, more than a squib, but not nearly as gifted as Lilly. We just have not had a chance to delve into Petunia's personal past so we do not know for sure if she is magical or not ... yet.
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HungarianHorntail11 - Jul 5, 2005 9:59 am (#141 of 342)
The heart sees deeper than the eye.
That could be why she answered in a strange way that Petunia 'is a muggle, but' (Is that quote correct?).
JKR also told us there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia. That doesn't seem to allude to much, IMHO. She sure would be playing with us if you're correct, sanity. Now I'm confused again.
Saralinda Again, that is funny, but think of the bright side, we'll have so much more to go on for Book 7. (Although I don't think it would be premature to start prodding JKR for Book 7. LOL)
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Mrs. Sirius - Jul 5, 2005 11:25 am (#142 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
This isn't directly on topic, but it is "the end". On the Lexicon homepage they have now put up Book 7.
Edit: oh wrong thread, this isn't the "In the End" thread.
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Kip Carter - Aug 2, 2005 11:32 am (#143 of 342)
co-Host with Steve on the Lexicon Forum, but he has the final say as the Owner!
This thread was closed down during the sixteen day period surrounding the release of Book Six. It is now opened for posts.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 2, 2005 11:36 am (#144 of 342)
No one did magic late in life in HBP so we are free to guess. I'm still on Aunt Petunia.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 15, 2005 4:49 am (#145 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
You folks on this thread seem to have set matters up perfectly for my pet theory so I will post it here as well as on "Good Old Aunt Petunia":
recap:Here's the quote we are working with: JKR Interview: (Barnes and Noble March 19, 1999)
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children?
[...] No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotional magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now).
So, the options are:
a) the person is only able to perform a magical feat in a desperate situation
b)the person is now a fully-fledged wizard who uses magic all the time
c)the person was a fully-fledged wizard who used magic all the time.
It sounds rather like a, or more likely we witness that person first emotional magic, but we don't witness the rest of her/his story.
THEN ADDED: Frogface - Jul 1, 2005 2:58 am (#133 of 144) That's fair enough Solitaire, I only suggested it because of the JKR quote where she says that Petunia "is a muggle...but", combined with the fact that she said a character will perform magic in desperate circumstances leads me to think it could very well be Petunia, the only problem being of course, how could she perform magic if she is a muggle? This seemed to be the only idea I could come up with that would link the two quotes and make them make sense. Then again of course it may not be Petunia after all!
THUS:
Could Petunia be a hag?............. I have searched myself blue and I can't see why hags are considered non-human in the Lexicon. They have some minimal magical abilities and while JKR hasn’t said much about them as a group, individually and, according to the dictionary, they are women.
It seems reasonable that if Wizard folk can have Squibs, then Muggles should sometimes have their equivalent and what would they be called? JKR says that Petunia is a muggle. She also says Petunia is a bit more than a muggle and the thought makes her laugh (rather wildly) for some reason.(separate interview)
If Petunia were minimally magical, she would have gotten the call to Hogwarts in 1960 and not discovered her lack of ability for some months into the term.
DD seems to share an old secret with Petunia and this would fit the fact that they corresponded repeatedly before Harry came to live at #4.
Perhaps DD has cast a spell helping her to hide her haggishness. Maybe that spell expires when Harry comes of age, which, until now, she clearly thought would be when he turns 18.
This could be why she was so red-faced at that point in the conversation with DD in THBP. She thought she had more time for something than she does.
Her unnatural cleanliness obsession could be an over-compensation for a haggish characteristic or maybe she just wants the others to believe her to be cleaning while she gobbles raw meat!
That Petunia is in fact a hag would explain away a number of unsolved mysteries including her apparent jealous hatred of the Wizarding world.
When you look at what it says about individual hags you see that they are unattractive and wont to use Beautification Potion. They are also able to make and/or use simple potions and charms. They also mix readily with Muggles and Wizards and one even attended the Council of Wizards. As I said before, DD may be helping Petunia to suppress her haggishness somehow and that would explain their secret. I would guess that the haggish qualities also increase with age.
Perhaps the evergreen Lily-of-the-Nile plant (Agapanthus) is an essential potion ingredient...For them to be flourishing, Petunia would have to be over-wintering them indoors, thus making her a lily potter(tic)! OK, that was under the table but kinda funny.
That a Hag is actually a failed muggle Witch is a stretch, I admit. BUT: If a Wizard (or a muggle) is bitten, for example, do they then not become "a bit more?" (As JKR has said Petunia is) Lupin is still a Wizard but that's not all. If Petunia were a hag and Hags are muggles with only minimal magical abilities, wouldn't she be a muggle and a bit more?
Petunia has chosen a modern and upright muggle life. She would hate being a Hag if she were one. Who wouldn't?
I find no flaws in the supposition that she is a muggle AND a hag. No proof either, of course, but it would, at least, fit the facts so far in a cohesive fashion despite my incoherency.
What say you?
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Kerfuffle - Aug 15, 2005 12:06 pm (#146 of 342)
I wonder if Merope is the person who does magic late in life under desperate circumstances? She has had a terrible life with her father and brother, her father calls her a squib.
I don't have my books with me so I can't reference page numbers, but after the scene in the Pensieve that Harry and Dumbeldore witness, the person returns from the MOM and takes Marvolo and Morfin into custody. Marvolo is gone for 6 months and Morfin for some time longer than that.
Think about this, Merope is left with no money, no magic, no way to support herself. She is desperately in love with Tom Riddle Sr and I think she "seizes the day" and tries to find a way out of her current existance by using a love potion.
Remember also, Slughorn says in his first lesson with HRH that obsessive love causes more trouble than anything else and that the love potion was the most dangerous of all those potions he had made up as samples.
What do you think?
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Steve Newton - Aug 15, 2005 12:11 pm (#147 of 342)
Librarian
I think that we have already seen Merope do magic. Doesn't she, clumsily, try to retrieve a pot with magic? She also seems to be, ahem, dead.
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Kerfuffle - Aug 15, 2005 12:15 pm (#148 of 342)
Yes, I know she is dead. JKR doesn't say the person doing magic will be in present day, she just says we will see it. Well, we do see it --in the Pensieve.
Perhaps I read the passage wrong, but I thought Merope was unable to retrieve the pot and had to pick it up by hand, thereby infuriating her father who called her a squib.
Just my 2 knuts.
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Steve Newton - Aug 15, 2005 12:24 pm (#149 of 342)
Librarian
I'll have to reread. I thought that she used ineffective magic. I could be wrong.
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Saralinda Again - Aug 16, 2005 8:22 am (#150 of 342)
My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
I think that just being around that hideous Papa Gaunt would have given any dreamy-eyed adolescent girl stage-fright or performance anxiety, or whatever.
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Magic late in life (Post 151 to 200)
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Regan of Gong - Aug 18, 2005 3:40 am (#151 of 342)
Self declared doctor of everything.
I think KERFUFFLE is onto something, although I don't think that Merope's magical talent was under desperate circumstances. Raugh, I'm torn between the two possibilties...
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Kerfuffle - Aug 18, 2005 9:36 am (#152 of 342)
I thought it would be interesting to think about someone other than Petunia, Dudley, Filch and Mrs. Figg being the only people who the "magic late in life under desperate circumstances" applied to.
I would think being left alone, for perhaps the first time in your life, with no money, no food, no means of support, and no distractions except the obsessive crush on the unattainable cool guy could definately be desperate.
This was a time when the classes were seperated a lot more than today, also as Americans we don't think as much about the old class system, but in Britian the local landowner's son and the daughter of a penniless, crazy, abusive but arrogant jerk would not get together.
Even the girl who was riding with Tom Sr. in the memory wanted Tom and his father to pull down the Gaunt's house because it was a "hovel".
Merope would have been sitting alone, possibly for the first time in her life, wondering what was going to happen. Would someone come over and tear down her house? How was she going to cope? People who have been kept under control don't imagine that they are strong enough to cope on their own, they have been convinced they need the controller to cope.
Also, Dumbledore says she stopped giving Tom Sr. the potion , and then never used magic to make her life better when she was left alone.
Obviously, she was a very damaged soul.
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Madame Librarian - Aug 20, 2005 6:51 am (#153 of 342)
Sorry if someone has suggested this already, but if Petunia is desperate (to save Dud, to protect the house, whatever) and has a stash of magical tools left behind by Lily long ago (under that squeaky stair maybe) it's possible that she resorts to using some protective gizmo by following instructions in a magic textbook or something. The irony is strong here because of Pet's total and absolute rejection of anything magical, but her desperation causes her to change her opinion, so to speak.
So Pet herself does not suddenly become able to use spell or charm-type magic, nor could she make any use of a wand. No, she's muggle to the core. But, with the right tool and right instructions she can turn the thing on and let it do its magic. Doesn't Filch do this in the course of his job at school? Does Figgy?
Ciao. Barb
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Finn BV - Aug 23, 2005 5:45 am (#154 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yay! Another convert to the "magic-late-in-life-is-not-in-the-present!" Thanks, Kerfuffle. I have forever been saying that the way JK worded that answer with the words, "There is a character…" I took it to mean that AT SOME POINT in the world she writes about, whether it be past, present, or future, a wizard/witch or some other person will do magic in unexpected circumstances.
Thus said, Dame Peverell's, "So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotional magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now)" I respectfully disagree with.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 23, 2005 8:04 am (#155 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
FinnBV, I don't quite understand why you attributed the statement in italics to me.
I never said Petunia could "do" magic now. I think she may be minimally magical like Filch and Figg who have that cat communication affinity and can perhaps brew a simple potion that doesn't involve a charm. Perhaps she can see Dementors - who knows?
I assume that Squibs are invited to attend Hogwarts (how else do they get to know so much about it?) and find out that they lack adequate ability early in their education. They are still welcome in the Wizarding world, if looked down upon. I think Petunia MIGHT have attended Hogwarts briefly in much the same way although her parents were both Muggles. But what place in the Wizarding world is there for a Minimally Magical Muggle? Probably no big deal since she could just live a muggle life. (unless she grows a horse face)
My main contention is that it stands to reason that there MUST be some minimally magical people who are to Muggles what Squibs are to Wizards. Squibs are Wizarding children who are only minimally magical. What are Muggle children called who are too?
I have coined the term "Minimally Magical" for the purpose of my argument. It is not canon and and it may well be that Squibs cannot be considered in fact to be Minimally Magical. Perhaps it's the cats who are magical or maybe it's a combination. That Mrs. Figg could see Dementors seems to be true however and she is in the Order.
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haymoni - Aug 23, 2005 8:47 am (#156 of 342)
JKR said that you are either Magical or you aren't. You are put on the list when you are born or you aren't. You get the letter or you don't. That's why Neville's family was so excited that he did indeed get a letter. You can't be "a little bit" magical.
JKR said that some Muggle families choose to ignore the letter and their magical children grow up without being trained. I'm guessing that's why there are so many blue-haired ladies out there.
I don't know that a Muggle could throw the right ingredients together and still get the Polyjuice Potion. Maybe you do indeed need to be magical. If that was the case, Squibs could be pharmacists of a sort. It seems as though you really need to be magical in order to be Potions Master.
But I didn't write the books...
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Dame Peverell - Aug 23, 2005 9:30 am (#157 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
Being Minimally Magical would make you magical.
Do you know Petunia didn't get a letter?
How about Filch and Figg?
Can a child have Magical parents and not be a Witch or a Wizard or even Squib? I would guess yes but very rarely, especially among purebloods.
According to Hermione Polyjuice Potion isn't simple. It may even require advanced magic just to prepare the ingredients for storage. But even Hags seem to be able to prepare a simple form of Love Potion.
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haymoni - Aug 23, 2005 1:25 pm (#158 of 342)
No - we don't know if Petunia got a letter or not. We hardly know anything about her at all, except that JKR said that she was a Muggle. Muggle = non-magic folk.
JKR hasn't said if Squibs receive letters. I think that it would be very cruel to send a letter to a child who had no hope of accomplishing anything. Neville's family thought he might not get a letter because he hadn't shown any signs of being magical. I'm guessing they thought he was a Squib and wouldn't be receiving a letter.
I think in the Wizarding World, if you have 2 magical parents, you should be magical also. Those that aren't magical are Squibs. Ron said they were very rare, so most wizard-wizard couples have magical children.
Polyjuice Potion was complicated because of the ingredients and how long it took to make. Plus they were 2nd years who didn't have a lot of experience brewing potions in the first place. I think there has to be more to it than just following the directions.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 24, 2005 12:19 am (#159 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
JKR specifically said she was "a bit more" than a Muggle which is what got me started in the first place.
How do we know what the criteria for "getting a letter" is? Harry was, correct me if I'm wrong, down for a letter when he was born.
In any case, the West Nile Virus has done in all the crows around here so you are going to have to send me one as I just found this: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
In a nutshell, Squibs can't attend Hogwarts and don't see Dementors. She does however, say that "they still function within the Wizarding world because they have access to certain magical objects and creatures that can help them" so I would have to revamp my Pet theory to so stipulate. It hardly seems worth the effort. Still, these facts remain:
DD secretly corresponded privately with Petunia before Harry arrived.
He recognized the Lily of the Nile plant. (An Egypt connection?)
Petunia is freaked over Harry coming of age too soon.
Her cleanliness fetish is constantly being brought up throughout the series and is described as being "unnatural" which, in and of itself, is no big deal but could be an integral part of something larger.
Her sister was a highly talented witch who excelled at potion-making. JKR says in the above link that "magic is a dominant and resilient gene" so I guess Pet has it too, even if we can't yet see exactly how it is expressed.
The way that DD's "REMEMBER MY LAST" shut her up and made her override Vernon, who was determined to cast Harry out, is extremely suggestive. Also, please see JKR’s comments on this at: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] None of the other theories I've read about why that should be so seem adequate to cover all the bases.
I'm looking forward to reading some better theories inasmuch as book 7 won't be here for forever.
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Finn BV - Aug 24, 2005 7:37 am (#160 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Dame Peverell, my apologies. I was under the impression that my italicized text was written by you and not from the interview. Is that right, or…?
Anyway, my point of view is that whoever is the Magic Late in Life character is not somebody in the present (we will be told about them), or, should it be somebody currently living, they will not continue their magical abilities after this one-shot deal.
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haymoni - Aug 24, 2005 11:13 am (#161 of 342)
Is Madam Rosmerta a witch? Have we actually seen her do magic?
She's running a bar. Doesn't need magic for that.
Draco "Imperio'd" her. Did she do magic under that spell or just his bidding?
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Dame Peverell - Aug 24, 2005 5:25 pm (#162 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
The JKR quote ended just before: It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard,...which was someone else's opinion/post that I pasted too close and didn't notice. sorry about that
Good catch, Haymoni. Madam Rosmerta hasn't ever performed magic that I can remember but she:
Is listed under Wizards on the Lexicon
Does live in the only all-Wizarding settlement in Britain.(Hogsmeade)
Captivate Ron for some odd reason.
Maybe she's really a Hag who doses herself with beauty potion every morning.
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haymoni - Aug 25, 2005 4:22 am (#163 of 342)
We had the same questions about Stan Shunpike - he's got a pretty menial job - does he need to be a wizard to do it?
All of these people can't be Squibs - Ron says they are rare - but the only Squibs we've met for sure are older - Figgy & Filch.
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far from prefect - Aug 25, 2005 3:13 pm (#164 of 342)
The idea of Petunia being a hag is hilarious! It could explain some odd things and it would just be a great joke. I doubt she ever got a letter though and I'm sure she never went to Hogwarts. If she had attended, even for a little while, someone would remember her and nobody seems to know that side of Harry's family at all. Lily was so well-known that others would say "Oh, and remember her sister, the hag?"
I think that Merope is a witch, just a frightened and terrorized teenage witch when we see her. I think she chose not to use magic to better her situation later on because she had given up.
My money is still on Petunia for magic late in life- or possibly Arabella Figg. In a couple of years we'll know!
ffp
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Maddest Dragon - Sep 2, 2005 5:16 pm (#165 of 342)
I agree with everyone who thinks it'll be Aunt Petunia. She'll probably do a spell that she heard Lily or James do--to protect Dudley, or maybe even to protect Harry. I think this will be akin to a mother lifting a two-ton vehicle off her child.
The idea that she might have a spark of magic in her, like Figg's affinity for cats, is an interesting one. It's implied that Arabella has the ability to talk with cats. Notice that, as far as we know, the Dursleys have never had a cat. Maybe they just don't--or maybe it's because Aunt Petunia fears what being around a cat might awaken in her. Perhaps a semi-magical ability like Arabella's?
Merope is certainly a witch. She lacks confidence, and therefore her performance suffers, because of her father's abuse. Chances are, getting Tom Riddle to fall for her was the only time she successfully did magic without getting shot down by her father or brother--and I see her giving up in despair when he abandoned her.
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haymoni - Sep 2, 2005 5:31 pm (#166 of 342)
With all the things they've given Dudley, you'd think they would have given him a dog. I just don't think Petunia would appreciate the dog or cat hair in her perfect house.
I'd like to see Pet do a Jelly-Legs curse or some sort of spell that would indicate that Lily had jinxed Pet a time or two.
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Madame Librarian - Sep 2, 2005 6:24 pm (#167 of 342)
My votes in order of priority as to which character exhibits magical ability late in life are:
1--Petunia
2--Filch
3--Figg
4--Some new character or someone really not on our Forum radar as a candidate.
I think the whole plot device would be most complex and interesting if it was Petunia who pulled it off because of all of the ones on my A-list, she's a known magic-phobe. It just wouldn't be quite as much of a shock if Filch or Figg did a spell or curse (not that we who analyze every possibility can still be shocked).
Another reason I would bet on Petunia the as the one with a sudden appearance (or not so sudden, maybe) of magical ability might tie in very nicely with two other factoids relating to the Petunia's family and the Dursley household.
One, that squeaky stair. Does it hold some of Lily's things left behind or given to Pet upon her sister's death? Does Petunia, in her most private self, really miss and mourn her sister? Does she secretly "visit" this cache of stuff and pour over all the material to the point where she's memorized a certain bits in some of Lily's old schoolbooks? Is there a wand or two there, left in safe keeping to be given to Harry when he reaches his majority? Is she reluctant to give these things up for some mysterious reason? Does that reason have something to do with Petunia's belief that she herself must be responsible for protecting her family if some DEs or worse, Voldemort, should arrive on her doorstep? Has she been working frantically all these years to master some simple protective charms? Did Lily perhaps warn her of the danger and try to teach her sister some elemental magic, or leave ready-to-activate spells in reserve on something she gave to Petunia (Pet would only need know how to release the magic--much like using a magical device)?
Two, taking all of the above into account, is this possibly the reason Pet reacts so strongly to finding out that Harry will be of age at 17, not 18? If so, she's distraught because she thought she had more time to perfect the spell or whatever.
Ciao. Barb
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I Am Used Vlad - Sep 2, 2005 6:36 pm (#168 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Barb, is there someone not on our radar? We've been known to devote entire threads to characters whose names are only mentioned once in the series.
I do agree with your list. I was in the Filch camp prior to HBP, and thought it would happen during an attack on Hogwarts. He seems to have blown his chance. I now think it will be Petunia at the beginning of book 7.
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Madame Librarian - Sep 2, 2005 6:53 pm (#169 of 342)
Vlad, there is always someone (or something) that is not on my radar. I can put my coffee mug down on my dressing table and it's vanished into thin air 5 minutes later when I search the whole house for it.
Ciao. Barb
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timrew - Sep 2, 2005 10:33 pm (#170 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Could it be someone that hasn't been seen to exhibit any magic traits yet; but is one of the characters that crops up now and then?
I mean, Stan Shunpike.
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Neville Longbottom - Sep 3, 2005 12:19 pm (#171 of 342)
On another forum I read the theory, that JKR might have meant Merope Gaunt with this statement? What do you think about this?
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Soul Search - Sep 4, 2005 12:03 pm (#172 of 342)
At first I thought "wow" he's got it. So I went to HBP "The House of Gaunt" (page 205, US Ed.) and read the scene with Merope. Too bad.
Merope has a wand, and Marvolo seems to expect her to use it. My read was that she could do magic, just was not very good or confident in front of her father.
Also, the "late in life" would be a stretch.
That said, I can't think of any other character that would have already satisfied JKR's statement, so Petunia is still my top choice, even though I have trouble reconciling her with JKR's other statement that Petuna is pure muggle. Maybe I just want Petunia to be the one; it would be so ironic, and funny. I might laugh out loud.
My next choice is Mr. Figg. I think she is still "on duty" around Privet Drive and could be a help when Harry returns there.
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Choices - Sep 5, 2005 10:28 am (#173 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
About as late in life as Merope could get was when she had Tom and she didn't even use her magical abilities to save herself. I think we can count her out.
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Neville Longbottom - Sep 5, 2005 1:37 pm (#174 of 342)
But in the context of the interview-question, it is clear that JKR speaks about people, who developed their magical ablities after the age of 11. This would include Merope. I'm not sure about this theory, and still hope it's Filch. But maybe the solution of this question was simply much less spectacular than we thought it to be?
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Steve Newton - Sep 5, 2005 5:58 pm (#175 of 342)
Librarian
Neville, I think that it is clear that Merope showed her magical ability at a young age. In the pensieve scene she performs magic, albeit not up to her father's expectations. The way JKR said late in life I thought that she meant late in life. That is well into adulthood.
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Choices - Sep 5, 2005 6:34 pm (#176 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Yes Steve - late in life and from someone who has not previously shown magical ability - like Filch or Petunia or Mrs. Figg.
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Maddest Dragon - Sep 5, 2005 8:22 pm (#177 of 342)
Of course, the late blooming character could be someone who hasn't been introduced yet. Or it could be someone who turns up in someone else's memory, via Pensieve.
Then again, what if it were Uncle Vernon? Or Aunt Marge?
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Kerfuffle - Sep 6, 2005 10:54 am (#178 of 342)
late in life could also mean right before death. And we know that Merope only had about a year between using the potion and dying.
I think thats its interesting to speculate about others being the magic-late-in-life person, (other than Figg, Filch, Petunia). Remember not to get so locked in on your idea that when JKR finally answers the question, you go into denial because it doesn't match your Potter world view.
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Honour - Oct 5, 2005 1:28 am (#179 of 342)
The term you all are quoting is "...magic late in life " is this the correct term? I'm just wondering, if the term is correct, could JKR have meant someone who has er... died? Maybe a ghost? Professor Binns? Heaven forbid that it could be Peeves! No hang on poltergeist aren't ghosts, so therefore are not strickly dead, scratch Peeves, no, minds gone blank! I thought I was running with a theory there, but no, it just ended up being a bit of a quick step before I fell over my own feet!
I agree with the general contention that maybe it is Figg, Filch, Pet, but my stars I hope its not Dudley!
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Troels Forchhammer - Oct 5, 2005 1:49 am (#180 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Honour wrote on Oct 5, 2005 in message #Honour, "Magic Late in Life" #179, 5 Oct 2005 1:28 am\">179
The term you all are quoting is "...magic late in life " is this the correct term? I'm just wondering, if the term is correct, could JKR have meant someone who has er... died? Maybe a ghost? Professor Binns? Heaven forbid that it could be Peeves! No hang on poltergeist aren't ghosts, so therefore are not strickly dead, scratch Peeves, no, minds gone blank! I thought I was running with a theory there, but no, it just ended up being a bit of a quick step before I fell over my own feet!
The exact quote is this
Patti from Illinois
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
J.K. Rowling:
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
From the on-line chat with at Barnes & Noble (barnesandnoble.com) 19 March, 1999:
EXT: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Regards,
Troels
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Honour - Oct 5, 2005 2:22 am (#181 of 342)
Thank you Troels
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pottermom34 - Oct 5, 2005 6:43 am (#182 of 342)
there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about..
That word, desparate, leads me to think it will be Pet. Because I'm thinking something will happen at 4PD after Harry's protecton wears off. Maybe a DE or Voldy will try something and Pet will use magic not for Harry's sake but her own family and it will help Harry also.
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Maddest Dragon - Oct 5, 2005 1:27 pm (#183 of 342)
The ghost idea is interesting--but Nearly Headless Nick said that only wizards can come back as ghosts. If that's true, then a ghost wouldn't be a ghost if he or she hadn't manifested magical abilities in life.
Of course, Nick may not know everything. I wonder if squibs can become ghosts.
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haymoni - Oct 5, 2005 8:12 pm (#184 of 342)
pottermom - I agree with you. I have always thought it would be Pet for that very "desperate" reason.
But then I thought that Mark Evans would turn out to be related to the Weasley accountant cousin, so what do I know???
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Honour - Oct 6, 2005 2:16 am (#185 of 342)
Yes Maddest Dragon I thought that it was interesting enough to ponder out loud ... and I think we're spoilt for choice when it comes to dead Wizards?
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deletedaccount - Oct 13, 2005 4:22 pm (#186 of 342)
Figgs testified that she saw the dementor in OP book during Harry's trial, so squibs must be able to see dementors. Unless she's deep down not really a squib?
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Liessie - Oct 13, 2005 6:36 pm (#187 of 342)
JKR says (on her website or in an interview) that Mrs. Figg never saw the dementors, but that she knows enough about the wizarding world and dementors' reputation/effects to be able to describe it well (and she could probably feel them, like Dudley did).
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Solitaire - Nov 13, 2005 3:14 pm (#188 of 342)
I think "late in life" generally is an expression applied to older adults. Of those we have met so far, Figgy and Filch seem to be senior citizens by Muggle standards. Aunt Pet might qualify for "late in life," too, depending on Jo's standards. Unless the person in question is someone we have not yet met, it would almost have to be one of these three.
Solitaire
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vickilh42 - Nov 14, 2005 7:03 am (#189 of 342)
As with some of JKR tidbits of information, this one may be just a little morsel--not amounting to anything of major consequence.While I'd like to see Petunia "instinctually" cast a curse to protect her family(dare I even say...Harry!?), I could imagine others doing so as well.
Mrs. Figg, in reaction to a "disturbance" at #4 when Harry turns 17yrs, she might perform a bit of desparate magic to help Harry or send a communication to the Order?
Filch has been portrayed as having "abusive" tendencies(ie manacles, etc) but I'd like to see him perform magic in an attempt to help a student.(I sure hope he's been studying his Kwikspell manual)
I tend to discount Dudley, as JKR has said that there isn't more to him.
My vote? Petunia. JKR's statements about her are just too vague and intriquing! (Not a Squib but....)
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deletedaccount - Dec 1, 2005 9:51 am (#190 of 342)
Maybe it's Professor Trelawney. Haven't seen her do magic have we?
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Steve Newton - Dec 1, 2005 10:12 am (#191 of 342)
Librarian
In GOF Trelawney waves her wand that the lamps go out. Can't remember which chapter.
As someone else pointed out, can't remember who, she did make Hermione drop a class. That has to be some kind of magic.
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Maddest Dragon - Dec 1, 2005 10:04 pm (#192 of 342)
Trelawney may be a fraud of a seer, but she's a witch, not a squib. She can do magic at the level that everyone else in the WW can. If not, she wouldn't be teaching at Hogwarts. Working there, perhaps, a la Filch, but not teaching.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Dec 2, 2005 2:22 am (#193 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
Why did Lockhart just pop in my mind?
...toddles off elsewhere...
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 3, 2005 2:40 am (#194 of 342)
TwinkilngBlue Eyes, but Lockhart was an expert at memory charms. It is just that the big one back fired. Lockhart was a fraud of a defence against the dark arts professor, but a wizard.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Dec 5, 2005 3:29 am (#195 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
I was also thinking about a few other instances, such as mending Harry's broken arm, the incident with the Cornish pixies...
Just because he's a wizard doesn't mean he's a competent one.
Now, what was the topic? Ah yes! Magic late in life.
...toddles off chuckling, I did manage to get the topic mentioned...
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Solitaire - Dec 12, 2005 4:44 pm (#196 of 342)
she did make Hermione drop a class. That has to be some kind of magic.
Given Hermione's sentiments about both Trelawney and the validity of her subject, the real magic would have been convincing Hermione to stay in class!
Solitaire
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Derek Robertson - Dec 14, 2005 2:39 pm (#197 of 342)
Petunia is at the top of my list, but there's a few things that don't add up? If Petunia has inherant magical abilities then McGonagal would have known this and sent her a lette inviting her to Hogwarts, also in the wizengamoot Fudge would have had Petunia on record as being a magical person in Little Whinging (trained or not).
As others have said JKR has hinted at more to petunia but it could just be her knowlegde of the maical world or the secrets of Lilly an James' lives.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 15, 2005 2:03 am (#198 of 342)
Derek Robertson - but Stan Shunpike never went to Hogwarts as far as we are aware. I believe that JKR said that Hogwarts are for those magical enough to go. Stan would not appear to fall into that category, so possibly Petunia is jealous of her sister of being more magical than her.
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haymoni - Dec 15, 2005 6:13 am (#199 of 342)
I don't know that we actually got a straight answer on whether or not Stan Shunpike himself ever went to Hogwarts. As I recall, the answer was rather vague in that JKR said that parents could choose to not send their magical children, but I think she has been pretty clear that you are either magical or you are not. You are either on the Hogwarts list or you are not.
I believe the quote about doing magic late in life says that it is very rare in her world, so perhaps the usual rules don't apply (being on the list or not being on the list).
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Finn BV - Dec 24, 2005 7:20 pm (#200 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Well, so much for Petunia: JKR Official Site.
I personally am back with Figgy, though my idea about somebody who's either was or still is a magician but learned to do magic later in life, not somebody who will do magic late in life. (As in, somebody a while ago could never do magic, and now they can, and they then became a very good wizard/witch.)
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Self declared doctor of everything.
I think KERFUFFLE is onto something, although I don't think that Merope's magical talent was under desperate circumstances. Raugh, I'm torn between the two possibilties...
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Kerfuffle - Aug 18, 2005 9:36 am (#152 of 342)
I thought it would be interesting to think about someone other than Petunia, Dudley, Filch and Mrs. Figg being the only people who the "magic late in life under desperate circumstances" applied to.
I would think being left alone, for perhaps the first time in your life, with no money, no food, no means of support, and no distractions except the obsessive crush on the unattainable cool guy could definately be desperate.
This was a time when the classes were seperated a lot more than today, also as Americans we don't think as much about the old class system, but in Britian the local landowner's son and the daughter of a penniless, crazy, abusive but arrogant jerk would not get together.
Even the girl who was riding with Tom Sr. in the memory wanted Tom and his father to pull down the Gaunt's house because it was a "hovel".
Merope would have been sitting alone, possibly for the first time in her life, wondering what was going to happen. Would someone come over and tear down her house? How was she going to cope? People who have been kept under control don't imagine that they are strong enough to cope on their own, they have been convinced they need the controller to cope.
Also, Dumbledore says she stopped giving Tom Sr. the potion , and then never used magic to make her life better when she was left alone.
Obviously, she was a very damaged soul.
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Madame Librarian - Aug 20, 2005 6:51 am (#153 of 342)
Sorry if someone has suggested this already, but if Petunia is desperate (to save Dud, to protect the house, whatever) and has a stash of magical tools left behind by Lily long ago (under that squeaky stair maybe) it's possible that she resorts to using some protective gizmo by following instructions in a magic textbook or something. The irony is strong here because of Pet's total and absolute rejection of anything magical, but her desperation causes her to change her opinion, so to speak.
So Pet herself does not suddenly become able to use spell or charm-type magic, nor could she make any use of a wand. No, she's muggle to the core. But, with the right tool and right instructions she can turn the thing on and let it do its magic. Doesn't Filch do this in the course of his job at school? Does Figgy?
Ciao. Barb
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Finn BV - Aug 23, 2005 5:45 am (#154 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Yay! Another convert to the "magic-late-in-life-is-not-in-the-present!" Thanks, Kerfuffle. I have forever been saying that the way JK worded that answer with the words, "There is a character…" I took it to mean that AT SOME POINT in the world she writes about, whether it be past, present, or future, a wizard/witch or some other person will do magic in unexpected circumstances.
Thus said, Dame Peverell's, "So no, there will be no "late blooming" students, however there will be a character that will manage to do magic quite late in life, but in desperate circumstances. It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard, just that s/he will be able to do emotional magic (or maybe s/he able to do it right now)" I respectfully disagree with.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 23, 2005 8:04 am (#155 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
FinnBV, I don't quite understand why you attributed the statement in italics to me.
I never said Petunia could "do" magic now. I think she may be minimally magical like Filch and Figg who have that cat communication affinity and can perhaps brew a simple potion that doesn't involve a charm. Perhaps she can see Dementors - who knows?
I assume that Squibs are invited to attend Hogwarts (how else do they get to know so much about it?) and find out that they lack adequate ability early in their education. They are still welcome in the Wizarding world, if looked down upon. I think Petunia MIGHT have attended Hogwarts briefly in much the same way although her parents were both Muggles. But what place in the Wizarding world is there for a Minimally Magical Muggle? Probably no big deal since she could just live a muggle life. (unless she grows a horse face)
My main contention is that it stands to reason that there MUST be some minimally magical people who are to Muggles what Squibs are to Wizards. Squibs are Wizarding children who are only minimally magical. What are Muggle children called who are too?
I have coined the term "Minimally Magical" for the purpose of my argument. It is not canon and and it may well be that Squibs cannot be considered in fact to be Minimally Magical. Perhaps it's the cats who are magical or maybe it's a combination. That Mrs. Figg could see Dementors seems to be true however and she is in the Order.
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haymoni - Aug 23, 2005 8:47 am (#156 of 342)
JKR said that you are either Magical or you aren't. You are put on the list when you are born or you aren't. You get the letter or you don't. That's why Neville's family was so excited that he did indeed get a letter. You can't be "a little bit" magical.
JKR said that some Muggle families choose to ignore the letter and their magical children grow up without being trained. I'm guessing that's why there are so many blue-haired ladies out there.
I don't know that a Muggle could throw the right ingredients together and still get the Polyjuice Potion. Maybe you do indeed need to be magical. If that was the case, Squibs could be pharmacists of a sort. It seems as though you really need to be magical in order to be Potions Master.
But I didn't write the books...
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Dame Peverell - Aug 23, 2005 9:30 am (#157 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
Being Minimally Magical would make you magical.
Do you know Petunia didn't get a letter?
How about Filch and Figg?
Can a child have Magical parents and not be a Witch or a Wizard or even Squib? I would guess yes but very rarely, especially among purebloods.
According to Hermione Polyjuice Potion isn't simple. It may even require advanced magic just to prepare the ingredients for storage. But even Hags seem to be able to prepare a simple form of Love Potion.
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haymoni - Aug 23, 2005 1:25 pm (#158 of 342)
No - we don't know if Petunia got a letter or not. We hardly know anything about her at all, except that JKR said that she was a Muggle. Muggle = non-magic folk.
JKR hasn't said if Squibs receive letters. I think that it would be very cruel to send a letter to a child who had no hope of accomplishing anything. Neville's family thought he might not get a letter because he hadn't shown any signs of being magical. I'm guessing they thought he was a Squib and wouldn't be receiving a letter.
I think in the Wizarding World, if you have 2 magical parents, you should be magical also. Those that aren't magical are Squibs. Ron said they were very rare, so most wizard-wizard couples have magical children.
Polyjuice Potion was complicated because of the ingredients and how long it took to make. Plus they were 2nd years who didn't have a lot of experience brewing potions in the first place. I think there has to be more to it than just following the directions.
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Dame Peverell - Aug 24, 2005 12:19 am (#159 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
JKR specifically said she was "a bit more" than a Muggle which is what got me started in the first place.
How do we know what the criteria for "getting a letter" is? Harry was, correct me if I'm wrong, down for a letter when he was born.
In any case, the West Nile Virus has done in all the crows around here so you are going to have to send me one as I just found this: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
In a nutshell, Squibs can't attend Hogwarts and don't see Dementors. She does however, say that "they still function within the Wizarding world because they have access to certain magical objects and creatures that can help them" so I would have to revamp my Pet theory to so stipulate. It hardly seems worth the effort. Still, these facts remain:
DD secretly corresponded privately with Petunia before Harry arrived.
He recognized the Lily of the Nile plant. (An Egypt connection?)
Petunia is freaked over Harry coming of age too soon.
Her cleanliness fetish is constantly being brought up throughout the series and is described as being "unnatural" which, in and of itself, is no big deal but could be an integral part of something larger.
Her sister was a highly talented witch who excelled at potion-making. JKR says in the above link that "magic is a dominant and resilient gene" so I guess Pet has it too, even if we can't yet see exactly how it is expressed.
The way that DD's "REMEMBER MY LAST" shut her up and made her override Vernon, who was determined to cast Harry out, is extremely suggestive. Also, please see JKR’s comments on this at: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] None of the other theories I've read about why that should be so seem adequate to cover all the bases.
I'm looking forward to reading some better theories inasmuch as book 7 won't be here for forever.
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Finn BV - Aug 24, 2005 7:37 am (#160 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Dame Peverell, my apologies. I was under the impression that my italicized text was written by you and not from the interview. Is that right, or…?
Anyway, my point of view is that whoever is the Magic Late in Life character is not somebody in the present (we will be told about them), or, should it be somebody currently living, they will not continue their magical abilities after this one-shot deal.
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haymoni - Aug 24, 2005 11:13 am (#161 of 342)
Is Madam Rosmerta a witch? Have we actually seen her do magic?
She's running a bar. Doesn't need magic for that.
Draco "Imperio'd" her. Did she do magic under that spell or just his bidding?
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Dame Peverell - Aug 24, 2005 5:25 pm (#162 of 342)
Who wants JKR to hire some help and get on with it...
The JKR quote ended just before: It doesn't sound like it will be a capable witch/wizard,...which was someone else's opinion/post that I pasted too close and didn't notice. sorry about that
Good catch, Haymoni. Madam Rosmerta hasn't ever performed magic that I can remember but she:
Is listed under Wizards on the Lexicon
Does live in the only all-Wizarding settlement in Britain.(Hogsmeade)
Captivate Ron for some odd reason.
Maybe she's really a Hag who doses herself with beauty potion every morning.
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haymoni - Aug 25, 2005 4:22 am (#163 of 342)
We had the same questions about Stan Shunpike - he's got a pretty menial job - does he need to be a wizard to do it?
All of these people can't be Squibs - Ron says they are rare - but the only Squibs we've met for sure are older - Figgy & Filch.
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far from prefect - Aug 25, 2005 3:13 pm (#164 of 342)
The idea of Petunia being a hag is hilarious! It could explain some odd things and it would just be a great joke. I doubt she ever got a letter though and I'm sure she never went to Hogwarts. If she had attended, even for a little while, someone would remember her and nobody seems to know that side of Harry's family at all. Lily was so well-known that others would say "Oh, and remember her sister, the hag?"
I think that Merope is a witch, just a frightened and terrorized teenage witch when we see her. I think she chose not to use magic to better her situation later on because she had given up.
My money is still on Petunia for magic late in life- or possibly Arabella Figg. In a couple of years we'll know!
ffp
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Maddest Dragon - Sep 2, 2005 5:16 pm (#165 of 342)
I agree with everyone who thinks it'll be Aunt Petunia. She'll probably do a spell that she heard Lily or James do--to protect Dudley, or maybe even to protect Harry. I think this will be akin to a mother lifting a two-ton vehicle off her child.
The idea that she might have a spark of magic in her, like Figg's affinity for cats, is an interesting one. It's implied that Arabella has the ability to talk with cats. Notice that, as far as we know, the Dursleys have never had a cat. Maybe they just don't--or maybe it's because Aunt Petunia fears what being around a cat might awaken in her. Perhaps a semi-magical ability like Arabella's?
Merope is certainly a witch. She lacks confidence, and therefore her performance suffers, because of her father's abuse. Chances are, getting Tom Riddle to fall for her was the only time she successfully did magic without getting shot down by her father or brother--and I see her giving up in despair when he abandoned her.
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haymoni - Sep 2, 2005 5:31 pm (#166 of 342)
With all the things they've given Dudley, you'd think they would have given him a dog. I just don't think Petunia would appreciate the dog or cat hair in her perfect house.
I'd like to see Pet do a Jelly-Legs curse or some sort of spell that would indicate that Lily had jinxed Pet a time or two.
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Madame Librarian - Sep 2, 2005 6:24 pm (#167 of 342)
My votes in order of priority as to which character exhibits magical ability late in life are:
1--Petunia
2--Filch
3--Figg
4--Some new character or someone really not on our Forum radar as a candidate.
I think the whole plot device would be most complex and interesting if it was Petunia who pulled it off because of all of the ones on my A-list, she's a known magic-phobe. It just wouldn't be quite as much of a shock if Filch or Figg did a spell or curse (not that we who analyze every possibility can still be shocked).
Another reason I would bet on Petunia the as the one with a sudden appearance (or not so sudden, maybe) of magical ability might tie in very nicely with two other factoids relating to the Petunia's family and the Dursley household.
One, that squeaky stair. Does it hold some of Lily's things left behind or given to Pet upon her sister's death? Does Petunia, in her most private self, really miss and mourn her sister? Does she secretly "visit" this cache of stuff and pour over all the material to the point where she's memorized a certain bits in some of Lily's old schoolbooks? Is there a wand or two there, left in safe keeping to be given to Harry when he reaches his majority? Is she reluctant to give these things up for some mysterious reason? Does that reason have something to do with Petunia's belief that she herself must be responsible for protecting her family if some DEs or worse, Voldemort, should arrive on her doorstep? Has she been working frantically all these years to master some simple protective charms? Did Lily perhaps warn her of the danger and try to teach her sister some elemental magic, or leave ready-to-activate spells in reserve on something she gave to Petunia (Pet would only need know how to release the magic--much like using a magical device)?
Two, taking all of the above into account, is this possibly the reason Pet reacts so strongly to finding out that Harry will be of age at 17, not 18? If so, she's distraught because she thought she had more time to perfect the spell or whatever.
Ciao. Barb
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I Am Used Vlad - Sep 2, 2005 6:36 pm (#168 of 342)
I Am Almighty!
Barb, is there someone not on our radar? We've been known to devote entire threads to characters whose names are only mentioned once in the series.
I do agree with your list. I was in the Filch camp prior to HBP, and thought it would happen during an attack on Hogwarts. He seems to have blown his chance. I now think it will be Petunia at the beginning of book 7.
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Madame Librarian - Sep 2, 2005 6:53 pm (#169 of 342)
Vlad, there is always someone (or something) that is not on my radar. I can put my coffee mug down on my dressing table and it's vanished into thin air 5 minutes later when I search the whole house for it.
Ciao. Barb
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timrew - Sep 2, 2005 10:33 pm (#170 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Could it be someone that hasn't been seen to exhibit any magic traits yet; but is one of the characters that crops up now and then?
I mean, Stan Shunpike.
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Neville Longbottom - Sep 3, 2005 12:19 pm (#171 of 342)
On another forum I read the theory, that JKR might have meant Merope Gaunt with this statement? What do you think about this?
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Soul Search - Sep 4, 2005 12:03 pm (#172 of 342)
At first I thought "wow" he's got it. So I went to HBP "The House of Gaunt" (page 205, US Ed.) and read the scene with Merope. Too bad.
Merope has a wand, and Marvolo seems to expect her to use it. My read was that she could do magic, just was not very good or confident in front of her father.
Also, the "late in life" would be a stretch.
That said, I can't think of any other character that would have already satisfied JKR's statement, so Petunia is still my top choice, even though I have trouble reconciling her with JKR's other statement that Petuna is pure muggle. Maybe I just want Petunia to be the one; it would be so ironic, and funny. I might laugh out loud.
My next choice is Mr. Figg. I think she is still "on duty" around Privet Drive and could be a help when Harry returns there.
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Choices - Sep 5, 2005 10:28 am (#173 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
About as late in life as Merope could get was when she had Tom and she didn't even use her magical abilities to save herself. I think we can count her out.
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Neville Longbottom - Sep 5, 2005 1:37 pm (#174 of 342)
But in the context of the interview-question, it is clear that JKR speaks about people, who developed their magical ablities after the age of 11. This would include Merope. I'm not sure about this theory, and still hope it's Filch. But maybe the solution of this question was simply much less spectacular than we thought it to be?
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Steve Newton - Sep 5, 2005 5:58 pm (#175 of 342)
Librarian
Neville, I think that it is clear that Merope showed her magical ability at a young age. In the pensieve scene she performs magic, albeit not up to her father's expectations. The way JKR said late in life I thought that she meant late in life. That is well into adulthood.
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Choices - Sep 5, 2005 6:34 pm (#176 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Yes Steve - late in life and from someone who has not previously shown magical ability - like Filch or Petunia or Mrs. Figg.
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Maddest Dragon - Sep 5, 2005 8:22 pm (#177 of 342)
Of course, the late blooming character could be someone who hasn't been introduced yet. Or it could be someone who turns up in someone else's memory, via Pensieve.
Then again, what if it were Uncle Vernon? Or Aunt Marge?
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Kerfuffle - Sep 6, 2005 10:54 am (#178 of 342)
late in life could also mean right before death. And we know that Merope only had about a year between using the potion and dying.
I think thats its interesting to speculate about others being the magic-late-in-life person, (other than Figg, Filch, Petunia). Remember not to get so locked in on your idea that when JKR finally answers the question, you go into denial because it doesn't match your Potter world view.
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Honour - Oct 5, 2005 1:28 am (#179 of 342)
The term you all are quoting is "...magic late in life " is this the correct term? I'm just wondering, if the term is correct, could JKR have meant someone who has er... died? Maybe a ghost? Professor Binns? Heaven forbid that it could be Peeves! No hang on poltergeist aren't ghosts, so therefore are not strickly dead, scratch Peeves, no, minds gone blank! I thought I was running with a theory there, but no, it just ended up being a bit of a quick step before I fell over my own feet!
I agree with the general contention that maybe it is Figg, Filch, Pet, but my stars I hope its not Dudley!
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Troels Forchhammer - Oct 5, 2005 1:49 am (#180 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Honour wrote on Oct 5, 2005 in message #Honour, "Magic Late in Life" #179, 5 Oct 2005 1:28 am\">179
The term you all are quoting is "...magic late in life " is this the correct term? I'm just wondering, if the term is correct, could JKR have meant someone who has er... died? Maybe a ghost? Professor Binns? Heaven forbid that it could be Peeves! No hang on poltergeist aren't ghosts, so therefore are not strickly dead, scratch Peeves, no, minds gone blank! I thought I was running with a theory there, but no, it just ended up being a bit of a quick step before I fell over my own feet!
The exact quote is this
Patti from Illinois
Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
J.K. Rowling:
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
From the on-line chat with at Barnes & Noble (barnesandnoble.com) 19 March, 1999:
EXT: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Regards,
Troels
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Honour - Oct 5, 2005 2:22 am (#181 of 342)
Thank you Troels
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pottermom34 - Oct 5, 2005 6:43 am (#182 of 342)
there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about..
That word, desparate, leads me to think it will be Pet. Because I'm thinking something will happen at 4PD after Harry's protecton wears off. Maybe a DE or Voldy will try something and Pet will use magic not for Harry's sake but her own family and it will help Harry also.
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Maddest Dragon - Oct 5, 2005 1:27 pm (#183 of 342)
The ghost idea is interesting--but Nearly Headless Nick said that only wizards can come back as ghosts. If that's true, then a ghost wouldn't be a ghost if he or she hadn't manifested magical abilities in life.
Of course, Nick may not know everything. I wonder if squibs can become ghosts.
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haymoni - Oct 5, 2005 8:12 pm (#184 of 342)
pottermom - I agree with you. I have always thought it would be Pet for that very "desperate" reason.
But then I thought that Mark Evans would turn out to be related to the Weasley accountant cousin, so what do I know???
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Honour - Oct 6, 2005 2:16 am (#185 of 342)
Yes Maddest Dragon I thought that it was interesting enough to ponder out loud ... and I think we're spoilt for choice when it comes to dead Wizards?
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deletedaccount - Oct 13, 2005 4:22 pm (#186 of 342)
Figgs testified that she saw the dementor in OP book during Harry's trial, so squibs must be able to see dementors. Unless she's deep down not really a squib?
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Liessie - Oct 13, 2005 6:36 pm (#187 of 342)
JKR says (on her website or in an interview) that Mrs. Figg never saw the dementors, but that she knows enough about the wizarding world and dementors' reputation/effects to be able to describe it well (and she could probably feel them, like Dudley did).
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Solitaire - Nov 13, 2005 3:14 pm (#188 of 342)
I think "late in life" generally is an expression applied to older adults. Of those we have met so far, Figgy and Filch seem to be senior citizens by Muggle standards. Aunt Pet might qualify for "late in life," too, depending on Jo's standards. Unless the person in question is someone we have not yet met, it would almost have to be one of these three.
Solitaire
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vickilh42 - Nov 14, 2005 7:03 am (#189 of 342)
As with some of JKR tidbits of information, this one may be just a little morsel--not amounting to anything of major consequence.While I'd like to see Petunia "instinctually" cast a curse to protect her family(dare I even say...Harry!?), I could imagine others doing so as well.
Mrs. Figg, in reaction to a "disturbance" at #4 when Harry turns 17yrs, she might perform a bit of desparate magic to help Harry or send a communication to the Order?
Filch has been portrayed as having "abusive" tendencies(ie manacles, etc) but I'd like to see him perform magic in an attempt to help a student.(I sure hope he's been studying his Kwikspell manual)
I tend to discount Dudley, as JKR has said that there isn't more to him.
My vote? Petunia. JKR's statements about her are just too vague and intriquing! (Not a Squib but....)
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deletedaccount - Dec 1, 2005 9:51 am (#190 of 342)
Maybe it's Professor Trelawney. Haven't seen her do magic have we?
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Steve Newton - Dec 1, 2005 10:12 am (#191 of 342)
Librarian
In GOF Trelawney waves her wand that the lamps go out. Can't remember which chapter.
As someone else pointed out, can't remember who, she did make Hermione drop a class. That has to be some kind of magic.
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Maddest Dragon - Dec 1, 2005 10:04 pm (#192 of 342)
Trelawney may be a fraud of a seer, but she's a witch, not a squib. She can do magic at the level that everyone else in the WW can. If not, she wouldn't be teaching at Hogwarts. Working there, perhaps, a la Filch, but not teaching.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Dec 2, 2005 2:22 am (#193 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
Why did Lockhart just pop in my mind?
...toddles off elsewhere...
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 3, 2005 2:40 am (#194 of 342)
TwinkilngBlue Eyes, but Lockhart was an expert at memory charms. It is just that the big one back fired. Lockhart was a fraud of a defence against the dark arts professor, but a wizard.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Dec 5, 2005 3:29 am (#195 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
I was also thinking about a few other instances, such as mending Harry's broken arm, the incident with the Cornish pixies...
Just because he's a wizard doesn't mean he's a competent one.
Now, what was the topic? Ah yes! Magic late in life.
...toddles off chuckling, I did manage to get the topic mentioned...
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Solitaire - Dec 12, 2005 4:44 pm (#196 of 342)
she did make Hermione drop a class. That has to be some kind of magic.
Given Hermione's sentiments about both Trelawney and the validity of her subject, the real magic would have been convincing Hermione to stay in class!
Solitaire
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Derek Robertson - Dec 14, 2005 2:39 pm (#197 of 342)
Petunia is at the top of my list, but there's a few things that don't add up? If Petunia has inherant magical abilities then McGonagal would have known this and sent her a lette inviting her to Hogwarts, also in the wizengamoot Fudge would have had Petunia on record as being a magical person in Little Whinging (trained or not).
As others have said JKR has hinted at more to petunia but it could just be her knowlegde of the maical world or the secrets of Lilly an James' lives.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 15, 2005 2:03 am (#198 of 342)
Derek Robertson - but Stan Shunpike never went to Hogwarts as far as we are aware. I believe that JKR said that Hogwarts are for those magical enough to go. Stan would not appear to fall into that category, so possibly Petunia is jealous of her sister of being more magical than her.
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haymoni - Dec 15, 2005 6:13 am (#199 of 342)
I don't know that we actually got a straight answer on whether or not Stan Shunpike himself ever went to Hogwarts. As I recall, the answer was rather vague in that JKR said that parents could choose to not send their magical children, but I think she has been pretty clear that you are either magical or you are not. You are either on the Hogwarts list or you are not.
I believe the quote about doing magic late in life says that it is very rare in her world, so perhaps the usual rules don't apply (being on the list or not being on the list).
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Finn BV - Dec 24, 2005 7:20 pm (#200 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Well, so much for Petunia: JKR Official Site.
I personally am back with Figgy, though my idea about somebody who's either was or still is a magician but learned to do magic later in life, not somebody who will do magic late in life. (As in, somebody a while ago could never do magic, and now they can, and they then became a very good wizard/witch.)
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Magic late in life (Post 201 to 250)
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Choices - Dec 24, 2005 7:23 pm (#201 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Wow, I guess we can eliminate Petunia from our speculations. Mrs. Figg and Filch are looking more likely by the minute. Even Vernon and Dudley don't seem to be such long shots anymore. LOL
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Solitaire - Dec 24, 2005 7:49 pm (#202 of 342)
Figgy has always been my favorite candidate! I hope she's the one ... although I must admit Filch is as likely a candidate as she is. I don't suppose she could mean Hagrid. He does not lack the ability to perform magic--he's just forbidden in most cases, right? Perhaps the status of things at Hogwarts might induce McGonagall to ask the Ministry to offially lift the ban and allow Hagrid to perform magic legally. Just an idle thought ...
Solitaire
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Circe - Dec 24, 2005 9:48 pm (#203 of 342)
My vote is Dudley
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Solitaire - Dec 24, 2005 11:34 pm (#204 of 342)
I thought Rowling had already said that, with Dudley, what you see is all there is. No?
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 25, 2005 6:16 am (#205 of 342)
Not Dudley and not Petunia - help! Forget roast turkey or duck, how about roast crow for those of us sure it would be Petunia. I still don't think it will be Figgy or Filch, because of previous comments about squibs of Jo's site. It can't be Vernon could it? Oh yes please, imagine Petunia's reaction, and also Vernon's (he he he) there is a nice ward waiting for him in St Mungo's if it is.
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Solitaire - Dec 25, 2005 8:12 am (#206 of 342)
Isn't the original comment that a character will "manage" to perform magic late in life? I am sorry ... I can't remember the exact wording. But if "manage" is part of the wording, then it sounds like the culprit might be someone who has tried unsuccessfully to perform magic in the past. This sounds a lot like Filch (who is taking the Kwikspell correspondence course) or Figgy (who has never transfigured so much as a tea bag), who have probably actually tried but never actually managed to do magic. JM2K, of course ...
Solitaire
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Troels Forchhammer - Dec 25, 2005 9:23 am (#207 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Rowling's original answer was to say that ‘however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life.’ B&N Chat 1999-03-19
My impression, based on this, is that she is talking about some Muggle or Squib managing to do magic once under some particularly desperate circumstances, but who does not suddenly gain permanent magical powers.
This would, IMO, fit well in continuation of the more general trend of strong emotions empowering (and sometimes even invoking) magic for wizards (such as all the accidental magic we've seen Harry do). This particular person has so little magic that it cannot be called upon consciously or with the normal emotional strength, but under extreme desperation they do manage to exceed the threshold.
As for whom it might be, I doubt that e.g. Mrs Figg or Mr Filch can work up the level of emotional commitment (in particular, for Mrs Figg, now that Dumbledore is dead) to manage this, and since Rowling has explicitly cut off Petunia (she's been hinting at it for a while, we just refused to pick up the hints), I think we have very little to go upon if we wish to keep guessing. For all we know, the person she thought of might even have been Mrs Weasley's Squib relative, the father of Mafalda, who was cut during the writing of GoF (I certainly think that JKR would still have been thought she was going to write the original version of the GoF plot-line at the time of the quoted chat).
Regards,
Troels
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haymoni - Dec 27, 2005 7:06 am (#208 of 342)
Poor Pet - I really thought we had given her a way to redeem herself.
Alas, earwax.
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Solitaire - Dec 27, 2005 9:54 am (#209 of 342)
I doubt that e.g. Mrs Figg or Mr Filch can work up the level of emotional commitment (in particular, for Mrs Figg, now that Dumbledore is dead) to manage this
Oddly, I felt just the opposite. I felt that this would probably be a time when the character in question knew it would take every ounce of hope and concentration within his or her being, because he or she is probably the only hope of survival for whomever is being threatened. JM2K ...
Solitaire
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haymoni - Dec 27, 2005 10:01 am (#210 of 342)
I just hope that it's a decent bit of magic, not folding socks or cleaning up a mess.
She does say "in desperate circumstances", so I'm hopeful.
Maybe Figgy needs to help out at Privet Drive.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 27, 2005 10:07 am (#211 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I agree, haymoni. Though I can think of a few college days in which dishes and laundry were desperate situations, somehow I am imagining something more along the lines of a life in danger on this one.
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Solitaire - Dec 27, 2005 10:27 am (#212 of 342)
Exactly! I figure it will be some life-saving gesture on the part of whomever does perform the magic.
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Troels Forchhammer - Dec 28, 2005 1:49 am (#213 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Life-saving, most likely, yes.
From all we know about ‘accidental’, or ‘unintentional’ magic it is triggered by strong emotions. Whether re-growing hair, shrinking a sweater, inflating your adopted aunt or bouncing down the garden-path, the common denominator is emotions: fear, anger, desperation etc. These are the situations under which wizards do their first magical feats: strong emotions.
Since we are speaking of someone who cannot normally do magic (and who will, I believe, not be able to do magic afterwards either), the various tricks that can be used to empower or trigger deliberate magic, however, cannot be used because the person will not expect the magic, and applying concentration etc. works against the strong emotions that trigger the accidental magic. The ‘happy thought’ of the Patronus Charm is precisely a very controlled emotion, not the kind of uncontrolled fear or anger that suddenly put Harry on the roof of the school kitchens.
Regards,
Troels
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 5:18 am (#214 of 342)
I suppose it could be a Muggle with a Wizard or Witch in the family, who may think that all he or she needs to do is pick up the wand--since it is magic--point it at the target, and say a spell. This just sounds more like something a Squib would do, since Squibs would probably be more likely than Muggles to have looked through the spell books and know some actual spells that might work in the given situation. Then again, I guess a curious Muggle could do the same ... although I have a hard time picturing Uncle Vernon even bothering. Dudley? A bit less trouble here, but ...
Solitaire
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Choices - Dec 28, 2005 12:08 pm (#215 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Well, we have so few Muggles that we know well in the books. Only two Squibs that we know of (Filch and Figg), so the choices are very limited. Petunia has been eliminated, so that leaves Dudley, Vernon, Aunt Marge, her friend the Colonel, the Grangers, Colin's father (the milkman) - are there any more that I've overlooked? The Colonel and Colin's father we've never even seen, so I don't think they are strong candidates. So, who will it be?
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Soul Search - Dec 28, 2005 12:34 pm (#216 of 342)
I have always thought that the "Magic Late In Life" would be, somehow, related to Harry. It doesn't have to be. It could be just something heard about or reported in the news. If not related to Harry, the person could be someone we haven't heard of.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 28, 2005 1:10 pm (#217 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I think Dudley and Vernon would sooner snap a wand in two than pick it up and try and use it. Choices is right, we have so few people to choose from. Since Petunia had my vote, I guess I'll have to say Figgy now. She might just linger around 4PD and do something at the beginning of book 7.
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haymoni - Dec 28, 2005 1:21 pm (#218 of 342)
I hope it is someone that we actually know.
I don't want it to be an article in The Prophet about some lone Squib who held off a Death Eater with a Jelly-Legs curse.
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 1:55 pm (#219 of 342)
I think Dudley and Vernon would sooner snap a wand in two than pick it up and try and use it.
I really have to agree, Gina ... although of the two, Dudley would be more likely to attempt it, IMO. I'm still holding out for Figgy, though ... she is my fave!
Solitaire
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Gina R Snape - Dec 28, 2005 2:13 pm (#220 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Solitaire! This is getting scary. We might be able to sit down to tea and agree quite often if not for a certain man in my life!
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 2:47 pm (#221 of 342)
Perhaps we can meet at Hogwarts ... while he is, um, away.
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So Sirius - Dec 29, 2005 11:39 am (#222 of 342)
I think it's Hagrid. Although it's obvious that he never really gave up magic (as he keeps his wand in his umbrella) he's still not supposed to do it and he's not very good at it and doesn't know many spells and I think he'll be given back the rights to perform magic in his later years.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 29, 2005 1:26 pm (#223 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
So Sirius, sorry to burst your bubble. But Hagrid has performed magic and does so now. He regained the right to peform magic when he became a teacher.
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So Sirius - Dec 29, 2005 4:46 pm (#224 of 342)
But, Gina, not before the quote JKR made that someone was going to regain magic late in life. Hagrid wasn't teaching before she made that statement, was he? Also, he was performing magic only in secret for a long time and his knowledge of spells is quite limited, even now. Now that he's a teacher, now that he's able to perform magic perhaps his skills will increase and the quote she made will turn out to be him.
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timrew - Dec 29, 2005 4:54 pm (#225 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Although he has never been called a Squib, neither have we seen him performing any magic. Who am I talking about? Stan Shunpike.
He could use magic to escape from Azkaban, or Avada Kedavra Scrimgeour.
Don't knock it until book 7 comes out!
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Choices - Dec 29, 2005 6:14 pm (#226 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Tim - I have wondered if Stan was a Squib. What really made me think about it was the scene in the movie where he lifts Harry's trunk onto the Knight Bus. I know it is only in the movie, but even in the books he never does magic. Makes me wonder if he can?
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Gina R Snape - Dec 29, 2005 7:25 pm (#227 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
So Sirius, I believe the quote was in response to a question about someone non-magical performing magic. Can anyone here find the exact interview? I confess, your question has made me question my memory!
Tim, we unfortunately don't know enough about Stan Shunpike. JKR even sidestepped that question recently!
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Steve Newton - Dec 29, 2005 8:01 pm (#228 of 342)
Librarian
Choices, I also noted the scene with Stan and the trunk. It would seem to indicate that Stan is a squib, but, as a conductor he is also probably looking for tips. He may make things look more difficult than they are to earn a better tip. Of course, none of this means anything until JKR clears it up.
I recall no JKR quotation about someone regaining magic.
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Ana Cis - Dec 29, 2005 9:00 pm (#229 of 342)
Zen: After the Ecstasy, the laundry.
IMHO, I believe it's Filch. It's not a coincidence that JKR presented us with Filch's bitterness and pain about being a Squib. He may hate and resent the students, but I wouldn't be surprised if he loved Hogwarts as his home and would probably defend it to the death. His emotions will probably enable him to perform magic late in life.
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Solitaire - Dec 30, 2005 12:42 am (#230 of 342)
someone was going to regain magic late in life.
I thought Jo said that someone would manage to perform magic late in life, in desperate circumstances. This is much different than regaining magic. I did mention Hagrid as a possibility several posts back ... but as others have said, he already does perform magic. I simply suggested that he might have the legal right to perform it reinstated.
It sounds to me like the one who performs magic will be either a Squib or a Muggle--someone who has never been able to do it before but manages this time ... in desperate circumstances. BTW, I like the idea of Stan Shunpike. Perhaps Harry will help get him released from prison ... and he will, in turn, help Harry out of a jam in some magical way. I guess we'll have to wait and see!
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Dec 30, 2005 2:06 am (#231 of 342)
I could easily see Filch performing magic in desperate circumstances if said circumstances involved Mrs. Norris. If someone or something threatened her, I could see the emotional involvement necessary.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 30, 2005 2:15 am (#232 of 342)
Weeny, but there was no magic after Mrs Norris was petrified in book 2.
As to it being Dudley, hasn't Jo already said that there is nothing special about Dudley thereby ruling him out. It could still be Vernon though, as not all magic requires a wand. And does he know what a wand looks like? Yes he's seen Harry's and Dumbldedore's when it has been pointed at him but has he seen one close up? Or waht about one hidden like Hagrid's? Could Vernon pick up a hidden wand and suddenly do magic to everyone's horror?
But I am becoming more and more convinced it will be a squib - I just hope it isn't Filch.
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Weeny Owl - Dec 30, 2005 10:31 am (#233 of 342)
There wasn't a need for magic after Mrs. Norris was petrified. It had already happened. He thought she was dead and wanted someone punished.
That's different than someone threatening her, perhaps trying to cast a spell on her when Filch is present.
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DJ Evans - Dec 30, 2005 12:00 pm (#234 of 342)
Genealogy....Where you confuse the dead & irritate the living!
What about Prof. Trelawney? As far as I know, she is just a seer & not magical as a witch/wizard would be. I thought of her last night & didn't know if anyone else would think she might be someone to consider or not. If she has already been suggested & nixed, then I would have to go with Filch too.
Later, Deb
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Gina R Snape - Dec 30, 2005 1:11 pm (#235 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
No, we've seen Trelawney perform magic. Just minor things like the lights, but magic nonetheless.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 31, 2005 1:58 am (#236 of 342)
Weeny - but surely Filch was emotional enough to get revenge. He demanded Potter be punished. My guess was that Filch was so upset he could have done magic then if it was him JKR as talking about. Mrs Norris seems to be Filch's only firend so petrificaion could have been the catalyst to produce some form of spell, especially as Filch was using the quick spell course at the time.
But in HbP we see that emotions can cause magical ability to wain (Merope and Tonks) so it must be a similar reality that will make the erson who does magic late in life able to do so. I think that makes sense.
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Circe - Dec 31, 2005 2:49 am (#237 of 342)
How about Madame Pince?
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 31, 2005 5:55 am (#238 of 342)
In one of the books (Order of the Phoenix?) she made the books and bits attack Harry and Ginny because they were eating chocolate in the Library.
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Weeny Owl - Dec 31, 2005 9:19 pm (#239 of 342)
I think the main point of what JKR said was that someone would do magic late in life due to desperate circumstances. It's that "desperate" part that I feel is what is important.
Anger and revenge are much different emotions than the rush you get with fear, It's more of a spur-of-the-moment thing, such as what Harry h experienced before such as suddenly appearing on the roof when he's being chased. At any time in his life, he could have done something like that, but that was a difference circumstance than the usual things Dudley and his gang did, and for some reason, that time he ended up on the roof and out of danger.
I'm not saying I'm one hundred percent convinced it will be Filch, but that him doing something like that to save Mrs. Norris makes as much sense as anything else.
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Solitaire - Dec 31, 2005 10:43 pm (#240 of 342)
Perhaps it will be like the adrenalin flow that enables ordinary Muggles like us to perform feats we are not strong enough to do (like lift a car off someone who is being crushed) or for which we do not have the skills (like land a 747 even though we have never flown so much as a kite). Somehow, people manage to do these extraordinary things all of the time ... because they must! Perhaps our "late in life" magic doer will be someone caught in a situation in which he or she is the only hope.
Solitaire
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 1, 2006 12:23 am (#241 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
I like to make my case once again for Filch. It may be a bit dragged out but please bear with me.
This analogy maybe stretched a bit thin and it is a bit muggle-ly.
My husband is a lawyer, he chooses not to practice law however. He prefers working as a sign language interpreter. As an interpreter, he goes to court with clients, meeting, and all kinds of classes. He has taken students through accounting courses, history, and sociology and even medical classes, he took one student all the way through law school. The first time he took a student thru a course, he realized that his student, at the end of his studies was going to start working in his field of study and would start his job in a much high income category than he my husband (Mr Sirius) earned.
With his help interpreting and tutoring, the student would probably had much more trouble getting through the course, perhaps not even gotten through.
In some ways Filch is in the same position, Filch is a squib. He comes from a family of wizards, (he maybe be married to a witch, Madame Pince, HBP), but he is not himself able to use the powers all the people in his family are able to use.
He works in a wizarding school and cleans up after young wizards who although they are limited in when and where they may use their powers, they never-the-less have the powers. When the students graduate, they will be fully licensed, authorized wizards, able to use powers whenever and wherever they please. Yet he Filch, will continue to clean up after them. He has the power to punish them and give detentions, but when the graduate, they are able to use all their powers, but Filch will remain a squip.
JKR is not mean, she has inflicted Fred an George on Filch, among others. I think Jo will want do a little something to make up to Filches for subjecting him for so much.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Jan 1, 2006 1:03 am (#242 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
"Perhaps our "late in life" magic doer will be someone caught in a situation in which he or she is the only hope." Envisions Stan saving the WW.
Back to the real world of HP. I don't remember if we know if Stan is in fact a "full fledged wizard". Nevertheless, the question comes to mind... can a squib or a unqualified witch or wizard become a death-eater?
"young wizards who although they are limited in when and where they may use their powers, they never-the-less have the powers. When the students graduate, they will be fully licensed, authorized wizards, able to use powers whenever and wherever they please...." Reminds me of the "rewards" of growing up. Squibs and unqualified wizards seem to be stuck in an pre-adult phase if you will...
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Finn BV - Jan 3, 2006 8:57 am (#243 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Just from a while back, Choices mentioned Colonel Fubster, JKR ruled out him during her Mark Evans explanation, saying that he was a "nobody."
Also, the exact quote was made at the Edinburgh Book Festival 2004, which was well after PoA when Hagrid was made a teacher. It was only prior to HBP.
Is Aunt Petunia a Squib?
Good question. No, she is not, but—[Laughter]. No, she is not a Squib. She is a Muggle, but—[Laughter]. You will have to read the other books. You might have got the impression that there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia than meets the eye, and you will find out what it is. She is not a squib, although that is a very good guess. Oh, I am giving a lot away here. I am being shockingly indiscreet.
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Steve Newton - Jan 3, 2006 9:07 am (#244 of 342)
Librarian
"She is a Muggle but-" Could she be only part human? It seems ridiculous but she is often described as having horsy teeth.
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haymoni - Jan 3, 2006 9:21 am (#245 of 342)
I'm wondering if that quote doesn't have to do with her slip about Azkaban and then the Howler about "Remember my last". I think there is more to her than just being a child abuser.
She knows what is going on but hasn't let any more information slip to Vernon than what she absolutely has to.
Why didn't she explain why Harry had to stay in OotP?
She gave Vernon some lame excuse.
It's hard to go by JKR's quotes - do they apply to the book she is working on or to the whole series?
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Choices - Jan 3, 2006 12:04 pm (#246 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Whoa, did Steve really say she had horsy teeth? LOL
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Steve Newton - Jan 3, 2006 12:36 pm (#247 of 342)
Librarian
Its true!
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Gina R Snape - Jan 3, 2006 2:26 pm (#248 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Ha ha ha ha ha. Oh, I doubt Petunia is half human. But it would be funny if she dated a squib or something, awhile back. She definitely still knows more than she lets on.
She really was the best candidate for magic late in life. Such a pity she's not the one.
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Solitaire - Jan 4, 2006 1:50 am (#249 of 342)
Is it possible for her to be both a Muggle and half-human? Just wondering ...
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Eyeriver - Jan 4, 2006 5:04 am (#250 of 342)
Could Merope be the one who did magic under desperate circumstances late in life? I know she wasn't actually a squib but she was the nearest thing to it.
Just a suggestion...
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Wow, I guess we can eliminate Petunia from our speculations. Mrs. Figg and Filch are looking more likely by the minute. Even Vernon and Dudley don't seem to be such long shots anymore. LOL
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Solitaire - Dec 24, 2005 7:49 pm (#202 of 342)
Figgy has always been my favorite candidate! I hope she's the one ... although I must admit Filch is as likely a candidate as she is. I don't suppose she could mean Hagrid. He does not lack the ability to perform magic--he's just forbidden in most cases, right? Perhaps the status of things at Hogwarts might induce McGonagall to ask the Ministry to offially lift the ban and allow Hagrid to perform magic legally. Just an idle thought ...
Solitaire
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Circe - Dec 24, 2005 9:48 pm (#203 of 342)
My vote is Dudley
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Solitaire - Dec 24, 2005 11:34 pm (#204 of 342)
I thought Rowling had already said that, with Dudley, what you see is all there is. No?
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 25, 2005 6:16 am (#205 of 342)
Not Dudley and not Petunia - help! Forget roast turkey or duck, how about roast crow for those of us sure it would be Petunia. I still don't think it will be Figgy or Filch, because of previous comments about squibs of Jo's site. It can't be Vernon could it? Oh yes please, imagine Petunia's reaction, and also Vernon's (he he he) there is a nice ward waiting for him in St Mungo's if it is.
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Solitaire - Dec 25, 2005 8:12 am (#206 of 342)
Isn't the original comment that a character will "manage" to perform magic late in life? I am sorry ... I can't remember the exact wording. But if "manage" is part of the wording, then it sounds like the culprit might be someone who has tried unsuccessfully to perform magic in the past. This sounds a lot like Filch (who is taking the Kwikspell correspondence course) or Figgy (who has never transfigured so much as a tea bag), who have probably actually tried but never actually managed to do magic. JM2K, of course ...
Solitaire
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Troels Forchhammer - Dec 25, 2005 9:23 am (#207 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Rowling's original answer was to say that ‘however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life.’ B&N Chat 1999-03-19
My impression, based on this, is that she is talking about some Muggle or Squib managing to do magic once under some particularly desperate circumstances, but who does not suddenly gain permanent magical powers.
This would, IMO, fit well in continuation of the more general trend of strong emotions empowering (and sometimes even invoking) magic for wizards (such as all the accidental magic we've seen Harry do). This particular person has so little magic that it cannot be called upon consciously or with the normal emotional strength, but under extreme desperation they do manage to exceed the threshold.
As for whom it might be, I doubt that e.g. Mrs Figg or Mr Filch can work up the level of emotional commitment (in particular, for Mrs Figg, now that Dumbledore is dead) to manage this, and since Rowling has explicitly cut off Petunia (she's been hinting at it for a while, we just refused to pick up the hints), I think we have very little to go upon if we wish to keep guessing. For all we know, the person she thought of might even have been Mrs Weasley's Squib relative, the father of Mafalda, who was cut during the writing of GoF (I certainly think that JKR would still have been thought she was going to write the original version of the GoF plot-line at the time of the quoted chat).
Regards,
Troels
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haymoni - Dec 27, 2005 7:06 am (#208 of 342)
Poor Pet - I really thought we had given her a way to redeem herself.
Alas, earwax.
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Solitaire - Dec 27, 2005 9:54 am (#209 of 342)
I doubt that e.g. Mrs Figg or Mr Filch can work up the level of emotional commitment (in particular, for Mrs Figg, now that Dumbledore is dead) to manage this
Oddly, I felt just the opposite. I felt that this would probably be a time when the character in question knew it would take every ounce of hope and concentration within his or her being, because he or she is probably the only hope of survival for whomever is being threatened. JM2K ...
Solitaire
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haymoni - Dec 27, 2005 10:01 am (#210 of 342)
I just hope that it's a decent bit of magic, not folding socks or cleaning up a mess.
She does say "in desperate circumstances", so I'm hopeful.
Maybe Figgy needs to help out at Privet Drive.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 27, 2005 10:07 am (#211 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I agree, haymoni. Though I can think of a few college days in which dishes and laundry were desperate situations, somehow I am imagining something more along the lines of a life in danger on this one.
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Solitaire - Dec 27, 2005 10:27 am (#212 of 342)
Exactly! I figure it will be some life-saving gesture on the part of whomever does perform the magic.
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Troels Forchhammer - Dec 28, 2005 1:49 am (#213 of 342)
It is useless to meet revenge with revenge: it will heal nothing. - Frodo Baggins, /The Return of the King/ (J.R.R. Tolkien)
Life-saving, most likely, yes.
From all we know about ‘accidental’, or ‘unintentional’ magic it is triggered by strong emotions. Whether re-growing hair, shrinking a sweater, inflating your adopted aunt or bouncing down the garden-path, the common denominator is emotions: fear, anger, desperation etc. These are the situations under which wizards do their first magical feats: strong emotions.
Since we are speaking of someone who cannot normally do magic (and who will, I believe, not be able to do magic afterwards either), the various tricks that can be used to empower or trigger deliberate magic, however, cannot be used because the person will not expect the magic, and applying concentration etc. works against the strong emotions that trigger the accidental magic. The ‘happy thought’ of the Patronus Charm is precisely a very controlled emotion, not the kind of uncontrolled fear or anger that suddenly put Harry on the roof of the school kitchens.
Regards,
Troels
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 5:18 am (#214 of 342)
I suppose it could be a Muggle with a Wizard or Witch in the family, who may think that all he or she needs to do is pick up the wand--since it is magic--point it at the target, and say a spell. This just sounds more like something a Squib would do, since Squibs would probably be more likely than Muggles to have looked through the spell books and know some actual spells that might work in the given situation. Then again, I guess a curious Muggle could do the same ... although I have a hard time picturing Uncle Vernon even bothering. Dudley? A bit less trouble here, but ...
Solitaire
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Choices - Dec 28, 2005 12:08 pm (#215 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Well, we have so few Muggles that we know well in the books. Only two Squibs that we know of (Filch and Figg), so the choices are very limited. Petunia has been eliminated, so that leaves Dudley, Vernon, Aunt Marge, her friend the Colonel, the Grangers, Colin's father (the milkman) - are there any more that I've overlooked? The Colonel and Colin's father we've never even seen, so I don't think they are strong candidates. So, who will it be?
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Soul Search - Dec 28, 2005 12:34 pm (#216 of 342)
I have always thought that the "Magic Late In Life" would be, somehow, related to Harry. It doesn't have to be. It could be just something heard about or reported in the news. If not related to Harry, the person could be someone we haven't heard of.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 28, 2005 1:10 pm (#217 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I think Dudley and Vernon would sooner snap a wand in two than pick it up and try and use it. Choices is right, we have so few people to choose from. Since Petunia had my vote, I guess I'll have to say Figgy now. She might just linger around 4PD and do something at the beginning of book 7.
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haymoni - Dec 28, 2005 1:21 pm (#218 of 342)
I hope it is someone that we actually know.
I don't want it to be an article in The Prophet about some lone Squib who held off a Death Eater with a Jelly-Legs curse.
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 1:55 pm (#219 of 342)
I think Dudley and Vernon would sooner snap a wand in two than pick it up and try and use it.
I really have to agree, Gina ... although of the two, Dudley would be more likely to attempt it, IMO. I'm still holding out for Figgy, though ... she is my fave!
Solitaire
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Gina R Snape - Dec 28, 2005 2:13 pm (#220 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Solitaire! This is getting scary. We might be able to sit down to tea and agree quite often if not for a certain man in my life!
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Solitaire - Dec 28, 2005 2:47 pm (#221 of 342)
Perhaps we can meet at Hogwarts ... while he is, um, away.
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So Sirius - Dec 29, 2005 11:39 am (#222 of 342)
I think it's Hagrid. Although it's obvious that he never really gave up magic (as he keeps his wand in his umbrella) he's still not supposed to do it and he's not very good at it and doesn't know many spells and I think he'll be given back the rights to perform magic in his later years.
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Gina R Snape - Dec 29, 2005 1:26 pm (#223 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
So Sirius, sorry to burst your bubble. But Hagrid has performed magic and does so now. He regained the right to peform magic when he became a teacher.
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So Sirius - Dec 29, 2005 4:46 pm (#224 of 342)
But, Gina, not before the quote JKR made that someone was going to regain magic late in life. Hagrid wasn't teaching before she made that statement, was he? Also, he was performing magic only in secret for a long time and his knowledge of spells is quite limited, even now. Now that he's a teacher, now that he's able to perform magic perhaps his skills will increase and the quote she made will turn out to be him.
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timrew - Dec 29, 2005 4:54 pm (#225 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Although he has never been called a Squib, neither have we seen him performing any magic. Who am I talking about? Stan Shunpike.
He could use magic to escape from Azkaban, or Avada Kedavra Scrimgeour.
Don't knock it until book 7 comes out!
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Choices - Dec 29, 2005 6:14 pm (#226 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Tim - I have wondered if Stan was a Squib. What really made me think about it was the scene in the movie where he lifts Harry's trunk onto the Knight Bus. I know it is only in the movie, but even in the books he never does magic. Makes me wonder if he can?
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Gina R Snape - Dec 29, 2005 7:25 pm (#227 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
So Sirius, I believe the quote was in response to a question about someone non-magical performing magic. Can anyone here find the exact interview? I confess, your question has made me question my memory!
Tim, we unfortunately don't know enough about Stan Shunpike. JKR even sidestepped that question recently!
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Steve Newton - Dec 29, 2005 8:01 pm (#228 of 342)
Librarian
Choices, I also noted the scene with Stan and the trunk. It would seem to indicate that Stan is a squib, but, as a conductor he is also probably looking for tips. He may make things look more difficult than they are to earn a better tip. Of course, none of this means anything until JKR clears it up.
I recall no JKR quotation about someone regaining magic.
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Ana Cis - Dec 29, 2005 9:00 pm (#229 of 342)
Zen: After the Ecstasy, the laundry.
IMHO, I believe it's Filch. It's not a coincidence that JKR presented us with Filch's bitterness and pain about being a Squib. He may hate and resent the students, but I wouldn't be surprised if he loved Hogwarts as his home and would probably defend it to the death. His emotions will probably enable him to perform magic late in life.
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Solitaire - Dec 30, 2005 12:42 am (#230 of 342)
someone was going to regain magic late in life.
I thought Jo said that someone would manage to perform magic late in life, in desperate circumstances. This is much different than regaining magic. I did mention Hagrid as a possibility several posts back ... but as others have said, he already does perform magic. I simply suggested that he might have the legal right to perform it reinstated.
It sounds to me like the one who performs magic will be either a Squib or a Muggle--someone who has never been able to do it before but manages this time ... in desperate circumstances. BTW, I like the idea of Stan Shunpike. Perhaps Harry will help get him released from prison ... and he will, in turn, help Harry out of a jam in some magical way. I guess we'll have to wait and see!
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Dec 30, 2005 2:06 am (#231 of 342)
I could easily see Filch performing magic in desperate circumstances if said circumstances involved Mrs. Norris. If someone or something threatened her, I could see the emotional involvement necessary.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 30, 2005 2:15 am (#232 of 342)
Weeny, but there was no magic after Mrs Norris was petrified in book 2.
As to it being Dudley, hasn't Jo already said that there is nothing special about Dudley thereby ruling him out. It could still be Vernon though, as not all magic requires a wand. And does he know what a wand looks like? Yes he's seen Harry's and Dumbldedore's when it has been pointed at him but has he seen one close up? Or waht about one hidden like Hagrid's? Could Vernon pick up a hidden wand and suddenly do magic to everyone's horror?
But I am becoming more and more convinced it will be a squib - I just hope it isn't Filch.
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Weeny Owl - Dec 30, 2005 10:31 am (#233 of 342)
There wasn't a need for magic after Mrs. Norris was petrified. It had already happened. He thought she was dead and wanted someone punished.
That's different than someone threatening her, perhaps trying to cast a spell on her when Filch is present.
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DJ Evans - Dec 30, 2005 12:00 pm (#234 of 342)
Genealogy....Where you confuse the dead & irritate the living!
What about Prof. Trelawney? As far as I know, she is just a seer & not magical as a witch/wizard would be. I thought of her last night & didn't know if anyone else would think she might be someone to consider or not. If she has already been suggested & nixed, then I would have to go with Filch too.
Later, Deb
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Gina R Snape - Dec 30, 2005 1:11 pm (#235 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
No, we've seen Trelawney perform magic. Just minor things like the lights, but magic nonetheless.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 31, 2005 1:58 am (#236 of 342)
Weeny - but surely Filch was emotional enough to get revenge. He demanded Potter be punished. My guess was that Filch was so upset he could have done magic then if it was him JKR as talking about. Mrs Norris seems to be Filch's only firend so petrificaion could have been the catalyst to produce some form of spell, especially as Filch was using the quick spell course at the time.
But in HbP we see that emotions can cause magical ability to wain (Merope and Tonks) so it must be a similar reality that will make the erson who does magic late in life able to do so. I think that makes sense.
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Circe - Dec 31, 2005 2:49 am (#237 of 342)
How about Madame Pince?
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Phelim Mcintyre - Dec 31, 2005 5:55 am (#238 of 342)
In one of the books (Order of the Phoenix?) she made the books and bits attack Harry and Ginny because they were eating chocolate in the Library.
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Weeny Owl - Dec 31, 2005 9:19 pm (#239 of 342)
I think the main point of what JKR said was that someone would do magic late in life due to desperate circumstances. It's that "desperate" part that I feel is what is important.
Anger and revenge are much different emotions than the rush you get with fear, It's more of a spur-of-the-moment thing, such as what Harry h experienced before such as suddenly appearing on the roof when he's being chased. At any time in his life, he could have done something like that, but that was a difference circumstance than the usual things Dudley and his gang did, and for some reason, that time he ended up on the roof and out of danger.
I'm not saying I'm one hundred percent convinced it will be Filch, but that him doing something like that to save Mrs. Norris makes as much sense as anything else.
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Solitaire - Dec 31, 2005 10:43 pm (#240 of 342)
Perhaps it will be like the adrenalin flow that enables ordinary Muggles like us to perform feats we are not strong enough to do (like lift a car off someone who is being crushed) or for which we do not have the skills (like land a 747 even though we have never flown so much as a kite). Somehow, people manage to do these extraordinary things all of the time ... because they must! Perhaps our "late in life" magic doer will be someone caught in a situation in which he or she is the only hope.
Solitaire
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 1, 2006 12:23 am (#241 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
I like to make my case once again for Filch. It may be a bit dragged out but please bear with me.
This analogy maybe stretched a bit thin and it is a bit muggle-ly.
My husband is a lawyer, he chooses not to practice law however. He prefers working as a sign language interpreter. As an interpreter, he goes to court with clients, meeting, and all kinds of classes. He has taken students through accounting courses, history, and sociology and even medical classes, he took one student all the way through law school. The first time he took a student thru a course, he realized that his student, at the end of his studies was going to start working in his field of study and would start his job in a much high income category than he my husband (Mr Sirius) earned.
With his help interpreting and tutoring, the student would probably had much more trouble getting through the course, perhaps not even gotten through.
In some ways Filch is in the same position, Filch is a squib. He comes from a family of wizards, (he maybe be married to a witch, Madame Pince, HBP), but he is not himself able to use the powers all the people in his family are able to use.
He works in a wizarding school and cleans up after young wizards who although they are limited in when and where they may use their powers, they never-the-less have the powers. When the students graduate, they will be fully licensed, authorized wizards, able to use powers whenever and wherever they please. Yet he Filch, will continue to clean up after them. He has the power to punish them and give detentions, but when the graduate, they are able to use all their powers, but Filch will remain a squip.
JKR is not mean, she has inflicted Fred an George on Filch, among others. I think Jo will want do a little something to make up to Filches for subjecting him for so much.
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TwinklingBlueEyes - Jan 1, 2006 1:03 am (#242 of 342)
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
"Perhaps our "late in life" magic doer will be someone caught in a situation in which he or she is the only hope." Envisions Stan saving the WW.
Back to the real world of HP. I don't remember if we know if Stan is in fact a "full fledged wizard". Nevertheless, the question comes to mind... can a squib or a unqualified witch or wizard become a death-eater?
"young wizards who although they are limited in when and where they may use their powers, they never-the-less have the powers. When the students graduate, they will be fully licensed, authorized wizards, able to use powers whenever and wherever they please...." Reminds me of the "rewards" of growing up. Squibs and unqualified wizards seem to be stuck in an pre-adult phase if you will...
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Finn BV - Jan 3, 2006 8:57 am (#243 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Just from a while back, Choices mentioned Colonel Fubster, JKR ruled out him during her Mark Evans explanation, saying that he was a "nobody."
Also, the exact quote was made at the Edinburgh Book Festival 2004, which was well after PoA when Hagrid was made a teacher. It was only prior to HBP.
Is Aunt Petunia a Squib?
Good question. No, she is not, but—[Laughter]. No, she is not a Squib. She is a Muggle, but—[Laughter]. You will have to read the other books. You might have got the impression that there is a little bit more to Aunt Petunia than meets the eye, and you will find out what it is. She is not a squib, although that is a very good guess. Oh, I am giving a lot away here. I am being shockingly indiscreet.
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Steve Newton - Jan 3, 2006 9:07 am (#244 of 342)
Librarian
"She is a Muggle but-" Could she be only part human? It seems ridiculous but she is often described as having horsy teeth.
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haymoni - Jan 3, 2006 9:21 am (#245 of 342)
I'm wondering if that quote doesn't have to do with her slip about Azkaban and then the Howler about "Remember my last". I think there is more to her than just being a child abuser.
She knows what is going on but hasn't let any more information slip to Vernon than what she absolutely has to.
Why didn't she explain why Harry had to stay in OotP?
She gave Vernon some lame excuse.
It's hard to go by JKR's quotes - do they apply to the book she is working on or to the whole series?
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Choices - Jan 3, 2006 12:04 pm (#246 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Whoa, did Steve really say she had horsy teeth? LOL
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Steve Newton - Jan 3, 2006 12:36 pm (#247 of 342)
Librarian
Its true!
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Gina R Snape - Jan 3, 2006 2:26 pm (#248 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Ha ha ha ha ha. Oh, I doubt Petunia is half human. But it would be funny if she dated a squib or something, awhile back. She definitely still knows more than she lets on.
She really was the best candidate for magic late in life. Such a pity she's not the one.
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Solitaire - Jan 4, 2006 1:50 am (#249 of 342)
Is it possible for her to be both a Muggle and half-human? Just wondering ...
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Eyeriver - Jan 4, 2006 5:04 am (#250 of 342)
Could Merope be the one who did magic under desperate circumstances late in life? I know she wasn't actually a squib but she was the nearest thing to it.
Just a suggestion...
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Magic late in life (Post 251 to 300)
Elanor Wed May 18, 2011 8:55 am
haymoni - Jan 4, 2006 6:21 am (#251 of 342)
That could very well be.
Although, I think JKR wouldn't have addressed the issue if we had already seen it.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 4, 2006 11:01 am (#252 of 342)
Merope didn't live long enough to be doing anything late in life.
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Choices - Jan 4, 2006 11:37 am (#253 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Very true Weeny and she sort of gave up doing magic voluntarily. She could do it, but she didn't want to do it. Now she is dead and it would be sort of impossible for her to do magic in desperate circumstances in book 7.
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Eyeriver - Jan 4, 2006 3:26 pm (#254 of 342)
That's not really what I meant Choices and Weeny Owl. After all, the quote says, "quite late in life", and 18 or so probably qualifies as that since most witches and wizards are using magic at 11. The love potion does seem kind of advanced for someone who couldn't handle a Summoning Charm, after all. And doesn't escaping her family qualify as, "desperate circumstances"?
I can't explain the fact that she gave up using magic though. Still, the quote doesn't make it impossible that she could have used magic under desperate circumstances and then given magic up.
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Soul Search - Jan 4, 2006 5:43 pm (#255 of 342)
What Eyeriver is suggesting, in general, has some merit. I have been thinking that the magic "performed late in life" would be done in the current storyline. It could well be, however, that we learn of in the current storyline, but the magic was performed some time in the past.
Does this open up any possible candidates?
As an example, Mrs. Figg did something in the past to protect Harry, before the story started.
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Solitaire - Jan 4, 2006 9:07 pm (#256 of 342)
The love potion does seem kind of advanced for someone who couldn't handle a Summoning Charm
Not necessarily. Consider how poorly Harry does in Snape's potions class, with Snape continually needling him, criticizing him, taking away points unfairly, etc. Yet he manages to get an E in his Potions OWL with an examiner who treats him with respect and consideration.
Likewise, Merope was continually badgered and belittled by her father, so it is no wonder she felt inept, stupid, and probably terrified in his presence. Away from her father's bullying and criticism, however, she may have been quite capable of doing the magic she felt was necessary to achieve her ends.
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 12:44 am (#257 of 342)
I understand now what you're saying, Eyeriver, but along with Solitair's example, you might consider Tonks's situation being somewhat similar, albeit not nearly as strong. Tonks lost her Metamorph abilities because of a broken heart, and that seems to be what happened with Merope when Tom Riddle the Elder left her. If she had lived, she would probably have recovered her magic just as Tonks did. I just don't see anything involving her as being "magic late in life."
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Solitaire - Jan 5, 2006 1:52 am (#258 of 342)
You give another good reason, Weeny. In our Muggle world, people who have been beaten down by life often lose the battle to live even in the face of illnesses or injuries that, technically, they could have survived. If the mind and heart will not help the body mend itself, well ...
It seems to me that Merope had lost hope. Alone and unloved in a Muggle hospital, probably weakened following a difficult birth, faced with the prospect of raising a child alone in difficult circumstances ... even her love for her child may not have been enough to sustain her. She may have felt that her child had a better chance at a decent life without her. Given the life she'd had thus far, can you really blame her?
Solitaire
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Eyeriver - Jan 5, 2006 4:29 am (#259 of 342)
Yeah, I know it's just speculation since Merope didn't live too long. I'm sticking with my speculation though.
Likewise, Merope was continually badgered and belittled by her father, so it is no wonder she felt inept, stupid, and probably terrified in his presence. Away from her father's bullying and criticism, however, she may have been quite capable of doing the magic she felt was necessary to achieve her ends. That's kind of my point in that her father's bullying qualifies as desperate circumstances, which hamper her ability to use magic.
I know that's not the best argument. I'm probably digging myself in deeper there!
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 6:38 am (#260 of 342)
But the fact remains that she COULD do magic. Tonks got her abilities back, but she always had them just as Merope could always do magic but let circumstances beat her down.
If, on the day we visited the Gaunt house the first time, Merope had hexed her father when he was nearly strangling her, then I would say that was desperate. Brewing a love potion just to get a guy to fall in love with her is desperate in its own way, but is really more pathetic than anything. Plus, Merope died young, so I just don't see how JKR could use her brewing a potion as being "magic late in life."
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haymoni - Jan 5, 2006 10:50 am (#261 of 342)
Why would Merope have to brew the potion? I'm guessing she could have purchased it.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 11:29 am (#262 of 342)
Because brewing the potion herself would be using magic, and either she gave Tom Sr. a potion or cast a charm, but Dumbledore thought it was a potion. Since we're discussing her using magic late in life, that's why I thought she would do it herself. P
lus, I thought she would brew it herself only because of the state of the hovel she lived in. It didn't seem as if the Gaunts would have the money to purchase potions.
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Kerfuffle - Jan 5, 2006 11:48 am (#263 of 342)
Eyeriver, this is the same conclusion I came to regarding Merope. See posts #146 to about 154 of this thread. I too feel that magic late in life could refer to magic just before death and Merope certainly seems to have had her most magical period shortly (within a year )before her death.
Also, we do see this in the Pensieve and in story, so it doesnt necessarily have to happen in Harrys present day.
Anyway, its fun to speculate
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Choices - Jan 5, 2006 12:14 pm (#264 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Solitaire - "It seems to me that Merope had lost hope. Alone and unloved in a Muggle hospital, probably weakened following a difficult birth..."
Soli - I think Merope gave birth to Tom in the Muggle orphanage... or am I remembering incorrectly?
If it is Merope doing the magic late in life, then it has already happened. I get the impression that it hasn't happened yet and we will see it happen in book 7. I just don't think it is Merope.
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Solitaire - Jan 5, 2006 11:04 pm (#265 of 342)
Wherever she gave birth--hospital or orphanage--there were no healers there to weave their magical miracles, as Poppy Pomfrey might have done. Merope was alone and at the mercy of Muggle doctors and their limited resources. And while women may not die in childbirth very often these days, they did die more often back in the earlier part of the century.
The important thing, though, is what you said in your last post, Choices. I, too, believe that the "magic late in life" has yet to happen. Kerfuffle mentions "her most magical period" ... but Jo has not said that the character in question ever has done magic before. The wording of her quote leads me to believe that whoever does it has never done it before ... and we know Merope had used magic in her lifetime. She may not have been as gifted as her father had hoped, but she had used magic. "Late in life" also leads me to think the character will be older ... like Filch or Figgy.
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Jan 6, 2006 12:32 am (#266 of 342)
I agree with that, Solitaire.
"Late in life" is much different than "not long before this person dies."
Between "desperate circumstances" and "late in life," it seems to me that it will be Filch or Figg or someone else we haven't met who fits the same type of scenario.
One of my reasons for thinking it might be Filch if Mrs. Norris were to be on the verge of being cursed is that she seems to be the only thing he truly cares about.
On the other hand, Mrs. Figg does seem to care about Harry, and with his protection ending on his birthday, she could very easily be there and save someone.
I can see either of those two fitting JKR's statement, but not Merope.
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Eyeriver - Jan 6, 2006 5:18 am (#267 of 342)
Eyeriver, this is the same conclusion I came to regarding Merope.
Sorry, I didn't know someone else had already suggested Merope. I'm not trying to take credit for your ideas anyway! On the plus side it's good to have someone who agrees with me, I do think she fits better than anyone else.
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Solitaire - Jan 6, 2006 6:39 am (#268 of 342)
I suppose what makes me feel that Merope is not the person who will perform magic late in life is that, if she is, then this event is over and it seems to have happened without a witness. Jo's statement, to me, seems to indicate that this magic will be something that is really extraordinary--something that either we the readers or one or more characters will "witness" when it happens. Merope's magic was hardly extraordinary, and it is something we find out about from Dumbledore.
Solitaire
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Kerfuffle - Jan 6, 2006 11:28 am (#269 of 342)
Eyeriver, I do not think you are trying to take credit for anything, I am just happy to have someone else consider the idea. I have felt like a lone voice in the wilderness about this idea many times.
Way to go for coming up with another point of view!
I have to disagree with Solitare saying that Meropes magic wasn't extraordinary enough. I would like to propose that someone left alone, possibly for the first time in her life, after being constantly belittled and degraded would be in desperate circumstances. She found a way to help herself and get out. She did it by magic, but also found the personal strength to stop the magic and face the music. It would have been much easier to continue her magic because it was providing her her hearts desire.
Whether or not Merope is the person Jo was referring to, she does fit the criteria and also fits one of the themes of the books, It is our choices that determine our lives more than our birth or heritage.
She chose to use magic to make her life better in a desperate situation and then to stop and take the consequences, even though by doing so, she doomed her child to living with those consequences.
Anyway, its good to speculate and explore ideas, as JKR said, sometimes you get to an interesting place that way.
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 12:21 pm (#270 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
KERFUFFLE and eyeriver, it's nice to see the lone dissenting theories out there and the rationals.
I, like you have one too, mine however, is for Filch. (I think it might be JKR' reward to Filch, for how he suffers living in world that doesn't permit him full access, and the humiliation he suffered in COS when Harry learned he was a squib). That is what makes it so good to come here, we can go out on our limbs on theories and still talk nice.
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So Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 6:54 pm (#271 of 342)
If it's not Hagrid, which I personally think it is, look how he stood outside openly dowsing the flames of his hut, where in the beginning of the series he would never have done that, then I think it'll be someone remarkable like a squib or someone we thought was a muggle. I also feel for her to mention it at all, to me, says that it's a character that we're familiar with.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 6, 2006 9:57 pm (#272 of 342)
It really can't be Hagrid because we've already seen him doing magic. When he was putting out the fire, all he had to do was ask Harry what the incantation was. He had no problems performing the spell, but just needed a nudge. He's done quite a bit of magic, and he was at Hogwarts as a student, so he's obviously not a Squib.
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So Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 10:58 pm (#273 of 342)
Did JKR specifically say that the person would start to do magic late in life or that they'd do magic late in life. The word start, being important. Hagrid, because he quit school, doesn't know much magic and doesn't do it well. He also wasn't able to publicly do magic, as his wand was snapped in two. Now, however, he's been cleared and can do magic. Thus, he does fit into the category, unless the word start was in the mix.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 1:57 am (#274 of 342)
Exactly So Sirius, especially when Harry had to teach him the correct spell, and since Hagrid is using magic for the first time (quite publicly) in over fifty years, which would make Hagrid age-wise 64-65? that's pretty "late in life" to me?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 3:45 am (#275 of 342)
We don't know how much magic Hagrid can do because he has to hide it. He might be much better at magic than he lets on.
Also, Harry didn't teach Hagrid the spell. All Harry did was tell Hagrid the incantation, and considering what had just happened, Hagrid not remembering it isn't a big surprise.
Hagrid isn't using magic for the first time in over fifty years. He used magic to propel the boat when he first got Harry off the rock.
This is the quote: In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
I believe that the two most important parts of that statement are "magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11," and "does manage in desperate circumstances."
Since Hagrid was at Hogwarts for three years, his magic obviously showed itself before age eleven. He's still a magical person even if his wand was broken. Having his wand broken didn't remove the magic from him.
I just don't see how Hagrid fits the criteria for this.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 4:37 am (#276 of 342)
No, we don't know how much magic Hagrid knows, but we do know that he could not remember the "incantation", maybe he was in shock or maybe this was because he only had 3 years of formal magical education, compared to Harry's almost 6 years. Telling/teaching, whatever ...
I didn't know that the quote was specific in that the person had to be using magic "for the first time" - totally missed that one!
Where is Finn when you need him, I need to be directed to the "Magic in Life" guote, my interpretation of it is starting to get a little fuzzy can someone give me a link up?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 4:28 pm (#277 of 342)
Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999... the pertinent part is near the end. The quote doesn't say a person has to be doing magic for the first time, but if a person has been doing magic all along, then it wouldn't be a big thing, as in the character doing magic late in life, especially under desperate circumstances.
Hagrid has been doing magic since at least his first year at Hogwarts. When his wand was broken, he had to sneak around and hide the pieces in his umbrella, but he was still doing magic. He did it when he got Harry off the rock, and has been doing it from time to time ever since. Him doing magic, late in life or not, desperate circumstances or not, doesn't seem to apply to what the person was asking about. Hagrid isn't "late blooming." He isn't a fully qualified wizard because he didn't finish school, but technically you could say that about Fred and George since they didn't finish either. Granted, they did finish a few more years than Hagrid did, and their wands weren't broken, but all of them can do magic. Hagrid might not be that good at it, but it is something he's already doing, so I just don't see how he could be considered to be the character JKR is talking about.
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Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
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Steve Newton - Jan 7, 2006 4:55 pm (#278 of 342)
Librarian
After rereading the quote I can see no way that this person could have performed magic before this occurrence.
Weeny, thanks for going back to the source.
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Solitaire - Jan 7, 2006 6:10 pm (#279 of 342)
Yes ... I just do not see how that quote could apply to Merope. "... quite late in life" makes me think the person is probably older, as well. JM2K, of course ...
Solitaire
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So Sirius - Jan 7, 2006 9:25 pm (#280 of 342)
Thanks for supplying this quote:
"In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about." JKR
She says, magic ALMOST always shows itself before age 11. Almost always, there are times it's apparently dormant. So, it might be a squib or muggle.
Although the 2nd part could also apply to Hagrid, as he does magic, by putting out the fire on his hut, in desperate circumstances. I know, I know, he does magic throughout the books, BUT, he's not supposed to and doesn't do it well. So, I still think, when she said this quote, a long time ago, she might have been thinking of him, later on in the books. But, I will concede that it's more likely someone like Filch or Figg that will come to fit this quote. I hope it's Figg.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 9:41 pm (#281 of 342)
When I read the question, my first thought was that the person was thinking of Neville, specifically since he asked about students. The interview was in 1999, so much of what we've learned about Neville has been since then.
JKR could mean almost anyone, really, but the "quite late in life" part makes me think more of Filch or Figg than of Hagrid. Hagrid is about the same age as McGonagall, and I don't think of her as being that old. JKR said she was about seventy-five, and while that may be late in life for us, I don't believe it is for magical people.
There are believable scenarios for Filch and Figg, between things possibly going on at the school or on Privet Drive, pretty much anything could happen.
There could be an attack on Harry's birthday so that Figg saves the day, or perhaps Harry will be searching for Horcruxes at the school and the hero will be Filch.
Perhaps it's Ernie the bus driver and he zaps a Death Eater or two before running over them.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 9:57 pm (#282 of 342)
Thank you for that Weeny Owl, hmmmn very interesting
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Solitaire - Jan 8, 2006 1:02 am (#283 of 342)
The way Ernie drives that bus, he seems to have some magic up his sleeve! LOL
Solitaire
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Circe - Jan 8, 2006 1:24 am (#284 of 342)
how do we know hagrid and mcgonagall are about the same age?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 8, 2006 2:30 am (#285 of 342)
The Lexicon states that McGonagall was born around 1925 and Hagrid was born around 1928. My ideas are about a year off either way.
Even without The Lexicon, it stems from dates in the Chamber of Secrets and from an interview when JKR gave McGonagall's age at about seventy.
Nick's Deathday party was 1992. He died in 1492 and it was his 500th. The Chamber was opened fifty years before 1992 or in 1942. Hagrid was thirteen/fourteen then.
So there is an age difference of five years or less. My calculations have McG's birthday in 1924 and Hagrid's in 1929, or a difference of five years, while The Lexicon's calculations have the difference at about three years.
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Finn BV - Jan 8, 2006 11:55 am (#286 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Sorry, I'm here Honour, but Weeny's got the quote for you!
Okay, the reason I think it's not Hagrid is because it's not a student of Hogwarts. The questions asks if any adults, who were not magical at age 11, but have shown signs of magic at a later age, will come to the school and travel with students of the correct age. Hagrid showed magic before age 11; the magic quill definitely wrote his name down when he was born and therefore he was accepted at Hogwarts.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 8, 2006 3:12 pm (#287 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I'm thinking that Figg will have to do some magic to save Harry during he final trip to #4. We have been told that Harry will spend more time there in book 7 than he did in book 6 and I can't think of any reason other than the DE's or demeantor's attacking the house now that DD is gone. They may not know how little Harry cares for the residents of that house. My vote is for "FIGGY". She will be protecting her cats after all. JM2K's
Mickey
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Steve Newton - Jan 10, 2006 7:57 am (#288 of 342)
Librarian
While it looks like Figg and Filch are the leading candidates for magic late in life I would suggest that Stan Shunpike may also be a candidate. We have yet to see him perform magic, he is certainly in desperate circumstances and I like him.
Of course, I had been a supporter of Petunia so my guesses may not be the best.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 10, 2006 10:28 am (#289 of 342)
That's possible, Steve, but it depends on what JKR means by "magic late in life." Stan Shunpike is in his late teens or early twenties.
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Steve Newton - Jan 10, 2006 11:59 am (#290 of 342)
Librarian
Agreed. I also think that the original quotation said 'quite late' in life which would further weaken the case of Stan. I'm still pulling for him, though.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 13, 2006 10:47 pm (#291 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I believe Stan performs magic he certainly has a wand and uses it to load and unload the luggage from the bus, doesn't he.
Mickey
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Solitaire - Jan 14, 2006 2:01 am (#292 of 342)
Mickey, I think that was one of the reasons people thought he might be a Squib ... didn't he pick up the trunks physically rather than magically? I can't remember, but I've seen someone mention it before.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Jan 14, 2006 5:25 am (#293 of 342)
In PoA Stan and Ernie carry Harry's trunk into the Leaky Cauldron.
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Derek Robertson - Jan 23, 2006 6:24 pm (#294 of 342)
My new two cents worth, after JKR took Petunia from the equation.
Argus Filch will pick up a dropped wand from the sidelines of a fight between good guys and bad guys in Hogwarts, he will perform magic using his fear, love and anger to save his sweetheart Madame Pince who is being attacked.
Ta-daaa!
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 24, 2006 12:05 am (#295 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
Yes, Derek I like that one! But I would say instead of his sweetheart Madame Pince, his true love Mrs. Norris.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 11:48 am (#296 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
LOL Mrs. Sirius - that is exactly what I thought, too.
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Gina R Snape - Jan 24, 2006 3:50 pm (#297 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Maybe it'll be Tobias Snape! Unfortunately we don't know much about him. But we know he is (or was) a muggle.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 6:43 pm (#298 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I wonder if he's still living?
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Gina R Snape - Jan 24, 2006 6:55 pm (#299 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I certainly hope we find out! And of course, I hope we find out more about Snape's parents and childhood.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 6:58 pm (#300 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
LOL I will seriously start a riot if we don't!!!!
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That could very well be.
Although, I think JKR wouldn't have addressed the issue if we had already seen it.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 4, 2006 11:01 am (#252 of 342)
Merope didn't live long enough to be doing anything late in life.
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Choices - Jan 4, 2006 11:37 am (#253 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Very true Weeny and she sort of gave up doing magic voluntarily. She could do it, but she didn't want to do it. Now she is dead and it would be sort of impossible for her to do magic in desperate circumstances in book 7.
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Eyeriver - Jan 4, 2006 3:26 pm (#254 of 342)
That's not really what I meant Choices and Weeny Owl. After all, the quote says, "quite late in life", and 18 or so probably qualifies as that since most witches and wizards are using magic at 11. The love potion does seem kind of advanced for someone who couldn't handle a Summoning Charm, after all. And doesn't escaping her family qualify as, "desperate circumstances"?
I can't explain the fact that she gave up using magic though. Still, the quote doesn't make it impossible that she could have used magic under desperate circumstances and then given magic up.
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Soul Search - Jan 4, 2006 5:43 pm (#255 of 342)
What Eyeriver is suggesting, in general, has some merit. I have been thinking that the magic "performed late in life" would be done in the current storyline. It could well be, however, that we learn of in the current storyline, but the magic was performed some time in the past.
Does this open up any possible candidates?
As an example, Mrs. Figg did something in the past to protect Harry, before the story started.
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Solitaire - Jan 4, 2006 9:07 pm (#256 of 342)
The love potion does seem kind of advanced for someone who couldn't handle a Summoning Charm
Not necessarily. Consider how poorly Harry does in Snape's potions class, with Snape continually needling him, criticizing him, taking away points unfairly, etc. Yet he manages to get an E in his Potions OWL with an examiner who treats him with respect and consideration.
Likewise, Merope was continually badgered and belittled by her father, so it is no wonder she felt inept, stupid, and probably terrified in his presence. Away from her father's bullying and criticism, however, she may have been quite capable of doing the magic she felt was necessary to achieve her ends.
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 12:44 am (#257 of 342)
I understand now what you're saying, Eyeriver, but along with Solitair's example, you might consider Tonks's situation being somewhat similar, albeit not nearly as strong. Tonks lost her Metamorph abilities because of a broken heart, and that seems to be what happened with Merope when Tom Riddle the Elder left her. If she had lived, she would probably have recovered her magic just as Tonks did. I just don't see anything involving her as being "magic late in life."
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Solitaire - Jan 5, 2006 1:52 am (#258 of 342)
You give another good reason, Weeny. In our Muggle world, people who have been beaten down by life often lose the battle to live even in the face of illnesses or injuries that, technically, they could have survived. If the mind and heart will not help the body mend itself, well ...
It seems to me that Merope had lost hope. Alone and unloved in a Muggle hospital, probably weakened following a difficult birth, faced with the prospect of raising a child alone in difficult circumstances ... even her love for her child may not have been enough to sustain her. She may have felt that her child had a better chance at a decent life without her. Given the life she'd had thus far, can you really blame her?
Solitaire
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Eyeriver - Jan 5, 2006 4:29 am (#259 of 342)
Yeah, I know it's just speculation since Merope didn't live too long. I'm sticking with my speculation though.
Likewise, Merope was continually badgered and belittled by her father, so it is no wonder she felt inept, stupid, and probably terrified in his presence. Away from her father's bullying and criticism, however, she may have been quite capable of doing the magic she felt was necessary to achieve her ends. That's kind of my point in that her father's bullying qualifies as desperate circumstances, which hamper her ability to use magic.
I know that's not the best argument. I'm probably digging myself in deeper there!
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 6:38 am (#260 of 342)
But the fact remains that she COULD do magic. Tonks got her abilities back, but she always had them just as Merope could always do magic but let circumstances beat her down.
If, on the day we visited the Gaunt house the first time, Merope had hexed her father when he was nearly strangling her, then I would say that was desperate. Brewing a love potion just to get a guy to fall in love with her is desperate in its own way, but is really more pathetic than anything. Plus, Merope died young, so I just don't see how JKR could use her brewing a potion as being "magic late in life."
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haymoni - Jan 5, 2006 10:50 am (#261 of 342)
Why would Merope have to brew the potion? I'm guessing she could have purchased it.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 5, 2006 11:29 am (#262 of 342)
Because brewing the potion herself would be using magic, and either she gave Tom Sr. a potion or cast a charm, but Dumbledore thought it was a potion. Since we're discussing her using magic late in life, that's why I thought she would do it herself. P
lus, I thought she would brew it herself only because of the state of the hovel she lived in. It didn't seem as if the Gaunts would have the money to purchase potions.
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Kerfuffle - Jan 5, 2006 11:48 am (#263 of 342)
Eyeriver, this is the same conclusion I came to regarding Merope. See posts #146 to about 154 of this thread. I too feel that magic late in life could refer to magic just before death and Merope certainly seems to have had her most magical period shortly (within a year )before her death.
Also, we do see this in the Pensieve and in story, so it doesnt necessarily have to happen in Harrys present day.
Anyway, its fun to speculate
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Choices - Jan 5, 2006 12:14 pm (#264 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Solitaire - "It seems to me that Merope had lost hope. Alone and unloved in a Muggle hospital, probably weakened following a difficult birth..."
Soli - I think Merope gave birth to Tom in the Muggle orphanage... or am I remembering incorrectly?
If it is Merope doing the magic late in life, then it has already happened. I get the impression that it hasn't happened yet and we will see it happen in book 7. I just don't think it is Merope.
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Solitaire - Jan 5, 2006 11:04 pm (#265 of 342)
Wherever she gave birth--hospital or orphanage--there were no healers there to weave their magical miracles, as Poppy Pomfrey might have done. Merope was alone and at the mercy of Muggle doctors and their limited resources. And while women may not die in childbirth very often these days, they did die more often back in the earlier part of the century.
The important thing, though, is what you said in your last post, Choices. I, too, believe that the "magic late in life" has yet to happen. Kerfuffle mentions "her most magical period" ... but Jo has not said that the character in question ever has done magic before. The wording of her quote leads me to believe that whoever does it has never done it before ... and we know Merope had used magic in her lifetime. She may not have been as gifted as her father had hoped, but she had used magic. "Late in life" also leads me to think the character will be older ... like Filch or Figgy.
Solitaire
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Weeny Owl - Jan 6, 2006 12:32 am (#266 of 342)
I agree with that, Solitaire.
"Late in life" is much different than "not long before this person dies."
Between "desperate circumstances" and "late in life," it seems to me that it will be Filch or Figg or someone else we haven't met who fits the same type of scenario.
One of my reasons for thinking it might be Filch if Mrs. Norris were to be on the verge of being cursed is that she seems to be the only thing he truly cares about.
On the other hand, Mrs. Figg does seem to care about Harry, and with his protection ending on his birthday, she could very easily be there and save someone.
I can see either of those two fitting JKR's statement, but not Merope.
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Eyeriver - Jan 6, 2006 5:18 am (#267 of 342)
Eyeriver, this is the same conclusion I came to regarding Merope.
Sorry, I didn't know someone else had already suggested Merope. I'm not trying to take credit for your ideas anyway! On the plus side it's good to have someone who agrees with me, I do think she fits better than anyone else.
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Solitaire - Jan 6, 2006 6:39 am (#268 of 342)
I suppose what makes me feel that Merope is not the person who will perform magic late in life is that, if she is, then this event is over and it seems to have happened without a witness. Jo's statement, to me, seems to indicate that this magic will be something that is really extraordinary--something that either we the readers or one or more characters will "witness" when it happens. Merope's magic was hardly extraordinary, and it is something we find out about from Dumbledore.
Solitaire
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Kerfuffle - Jan 6, 2006 11:28 am (#269 of 342)
Eyeriver, I do not think you are trying to take credit for anything, I am just happy to have someone else consider the idea. I have felt like a lone voice in the wilderness about this idea many times.
Way to go for coming up with another point of view!
I have to disagree with Solitare saying that Meropes magic wasn't extraordinary enough. I would like to propose that someone left alone, possibly for the first time in her life, after being constantly belittled and degraded would be in desperate circumstances. She found a way to help herself and get out. She did it by magic, but also found the personal strength to stop the magic and face the music. It would have been much easier to continue her magic because it was providing her her hearts desire.
Whether or not Merope is the person Jo was referring to, she does fit the criteria and also fits one of the themes of the books, It is our choices that determine our lives more than our birth or heritage.
She chose to use magic to make her life better in a desperate situation and then to stop and take the consequences, even though by doing so, she doomed her child to living with those consequences.
Anyway, its good to speculate and explore ideas, as JKR said, sometimes you get to an interesting place that way.
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 12:21 pm (#270 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
KERFUFFLE and eyeriver, it's nice to see the lone dissenting theories out there and the rationals.
I, like you have one too, mine however, is for Filch. (I think it might be JKR' reward to Filch, for how he suffers living in world that doesn't permit him full access, and the humiliation he suffered in COS when Harry learned he was a squib). That is what makes it so good to come here, we can go out on our limbs on theories and still talk nice.
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So Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 6:54 pm (#271 of 342)
If it's not Hagrid, which I personally think it is, look how he stood outside openly dowsing the flames of his hut, where in the beginning of the series he would never have done that, then I think it'll be someone remarkable like a squib or someone we thought was a muggle. I also feel for her to mention it at all, to me, says that it's a character that we're familiar with.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 6, 2006 9:57 pm (#272 of 342)
It really can't be Hagrid because we've already seen him doing magic. When he was putting out the fire, all he had to do was ask Harry what the incantation was. He had no problems performing the spell, but just needed a nudge. He's done quite a bit of magic, and he was at Hogwarts as a student, so he's obviously not a Squib.
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So Sirius - Jan 6, 2006 10:58 pm (#273 of 342)
Did JKR specifically say that the person would start to do magic late in life or that they'd do magic late in life. The word start, being important. Hagrid, because he quit school, doesn't know much magic and doesn't do it well. He also wasn't able to publicly do magic, as his wand was snapped in two. Now, however, he's been cleared and can do magic. Thus, he does fit into the category, unless the word start was in the mix.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 1:57 am (#274 of 342)
Exactly So Sirius, especially when Harry had to teach him the correct spell, and since Hagrid is using magic for the first time (quite publicly) in over fifty years, which would make Hagrid age-wise 64-65? that's pretty "late in life" to me?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 3:45 am (#275 of 342)
We don't know how much magic Hagrid can do because he has to hide it. He might be much better at magic than he lets on.
Also, Harry didn't teach Hagrid the spell. All Harry did was tell Hagrid the incantation, and considering what had just happened, Hagrid not remembering it isn't a big surprise.
Hagrid isn't using magic for the first time in over fifty years. He used magic to propel the boat when he first got Harry off the rock.
This is the quote: In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
I believe that the two most important parts of that statement are "magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11," and "does manage in desperate circumstances."
Since Hagrid was at Hogwarts for three years, his magic obviously showed itself before age eleven. He's still a magical person even if his wand was broken. Having his wand broken didn't remove the magic from him.
I just don't see how Hagrid fits the criteria for this.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 4:37 am (#276 of 342)
No, we don't know how much magic Hagrid knows, but we do know that he could not remember the "incantation", maybe he was in shock or maybe this was because he only had 3 years of formal magical education, compared to Harry's almost 6 years. Telling/teaching, whatever ...
I didn't know that the quote was specific in that the person had to be using magic "for the first time" - totally missed that one!
Where is Finn when you need him, I need to be directed to the "Magic in Life" guote, my interpretation of it is starting to get a little fuzzy can someone give me a link up?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 4:28 pm (#277 of 342)
Barnes and Noble interview, March 19, 1999... the pertinent part is near the end. The quote doesn't say a person has to be doing magic for the first time, but if a person has been doing magic all along, then it wouldn't be a big thing, as in the character doing magic late in life, especially under desperate circumstances.
Hagrid has been doing magic since at least his first year at Hogwarts. When his wand was broken, he had to sneak around and hide the pieces in his umbrella, but he was still doing magic. He did it when he got Harry off the rock, and has been doing it from time to time ever since. Him doing magic, late in life or not, desperate circumstances or not, doesn't seem to apply to what the person was asking about. Hagrid isn't "late blooming." He isn't a fully qualified wizard because he didn't finish school, but technically you could say that about Fred and George since they didn't finish either. Granted, they did finish a few more years than Hagrid did, and their wands weren't broken, but all of them can do magic. Hagrid might not be that good at it, but it is something he's already doing, so I just don't see how he could be considered to be the character JKR is talking about.
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Will there be, or have there been, any "late blooming" students in the school who come into their magic potential as adults, rather than as children? By the way, I loved meeting you, and hearing you speak, when you came to Anderson's in Naperville. I can hardly wait until you tour again.
Ahhh! I loved the event at Anderson's. It was one of my favorites. That is completely true. No, is the answer. In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about.
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Steve Newton - Jan 7, 2006 4:55 pm (#278 of 342)
Librarian
After rereading the quote I can see no way that this person could have performed magic before this occurrence.
Weeny, thanks for going back to the source.
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Solitaire - Jan 7, 2006 6:10 pm (#279 of 342)
Yes ... I just do not see how that quote could apply to Merope. "... quite late in life" makes me think the person is probably older, as well. JM2K, of course ...
Solitaire
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So Sirius - Jan 7, 2006 9:25 pm (#280 of 342)
Thanks for supplying this quote:
"In my books, magic almost always shows itself in a person before age 11; however, there is a character who does manage in desperate circumstances to do magic quite late in life, but that is very rare in the world I am writing about." JKR
She says, magic ALMOST always shows itself before age 11. Almost always, there are times it's apparently dormant. So, it might be a squib or muggle.
Although the 2nd part could also apply to Hagrid, as he does magic, by putting out the fire on his hut, in desperate circumstances. I know, I know, he does magic throughout the books, BUT, he's not supposed to and doesn't do it well. So, I still think, when she said this quote, a long time ago, she might have been thinking of him, later on in the books. But, I will concede that it's more likely someone like Filch or Figg that will come to fit this quote. I hope it's Figg.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 7, 2006 9:41 pm (#281 of 342)
When I read the question, my first thought was that the person was thinking of Neville, specifically since he asked about students. The interview was in 1999, so much of what we've learned about Neville has been since then.
JKR could mean almost anyone, really, but the "quite late in life" part makes me think more of Filch or Figg than of Hagrid. Hagrid is about the same age as McGonagall, and I don't think of her as being that old. JKR said she was about seventy-five, and while that may be late in life for us, I don't believe it is for magical people.
There are believable scenarios for Filch and Figg, between things possibly going on at the school or on Privet Drive, pretty much anything could happen.
There could be an attack on Harry's birthday so that Figg saves the day, or perhaps Harry will be searching for Horcruxes at the school and the hero will be Filch.
Perhaps it's Ernie the bus driver and he zaps a Death Eater or two before running over them.
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Honour - Jan 7, 2006 9:57 pm (#282 of 342)
Thank you for that Weeny Owl, hmmmn very interesting
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Solitaire - Jan 8, 2006 1:02 am (#283 of 342)
The way Ernie drives that bus, he seems to have some magic up his sleeve! LOL
Solitaire
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Circe - Jan 8, 2006 1:24 am (#284 of 342)
how do we know hagrid and mcgonagall are about the same age?
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Weeny Owl - Jan 8, 2006 2:30 am (#285 of 342)
The Lexicon states that McGonagall was born around 1925 and Hagrid was born around 1928. My ideas are about a year off either way.
Even without The Lexicon, it stems from dates in the Chamber of Secrets and from an interview when JKR gave McGonagall's age at about seventy.
Nick's Deathday party was 1992. He died in 1492 and it was his 500th. The Chamber was opened fifty years before 1992 or in 1942. Hagrid was thirteen/fourteen then.
So there is an age difference of five years or less. My calculations have McG's birthday in 1924 and Hagrid's in 1929, or a difference of five years, while The Lexicon's calculations have the difference at about three years.
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Finn BV - Jan 8, 2006 11:55 am (#286 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Sorry, I'm here Honour, but Weeny's got the quote for you!
Okay, the reason I think it's not Hagrid is because it's not a student of Hogwarts. The questions asks if any adults, who were not magical at age 11, but have shown signs of magic at a later age, will come to the school and travel with students of the correct age. Hagrid showed magic before age 11; the magic quill definitely wrote his name down when he was born and therefore he was accepted at Hogwarts.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 8, 2006 3:12 pm (#287 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I'm thinking that Figg will have to do some magic to save Harry during he final trip to #4. We have been told that Harry will spend more time there in book 7 than he did in book 6 and I can't think of any reason other than the DE's or demeantor's attacking the house now that DD is gone. They may not know how little Harry cares for the residents of that house. My vote is for "FIGGY". She will be protecting her cats after all. JM2K's
Mickey
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Steve Newton - Jan 10, 2006 7:57 am (#288 of 342)
Librarian
While it looks like Figg and Filch are the leading candidates for magic late in life I would suggest that Stan Shunpike may also be a candidate. We have yet to see him perform magic, he is certainly in desperate circumstances and I like him.
Of course, I had been a supporter of Petunia so my guesses may not be the best.
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Weeny Owl - Jan 10, 2006 10:28 am (#289 of 342)
That's possible, Steve, but it depends on what JKR means by "magic late in life." Stan Shunpike is in his late teens or early twenties.
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Steve Newton - Jan 10, 2006 11:59 am (#290 of 342)
Librarian
Agreed. I also think that the original quotation said 'quite late' in life which would further weaken the case of Stan. I'm still pulling for him, though.
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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 13, 2006 10:47 pm (#291 of 342)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I believe Stan performs magic he certainly has a wand and uses it to load and unload the luggage from the bus, doesn't he.
Mickey
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Solitaire - Jan 14, 2006 2:01 am (#292 of 342)
Mickey, I think that was one of the reasons people thought he might be a Squib ... didn't he pick up the trunks physically rather than magically? I can't remember, but I've seen someone mention it before.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Jan 14, 2006 5:25 am (#293 of 342)
In PoA Stan and Ernie carry Harry's trunk into the Leaky Cauldron.
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Derek Robertson - Jan 23, 2006 6:24 pm (#294 of 342)
My new two cents worth, after JKR took Petunia from the equation.
Argus Filch will pick up a dropped wand from the sidelines of a fight between good guys and bad guys in Hogwarts, he will perform magic using his fear, love and anger to save his sweetheart Madame Pince who is being attacked.
Ta-daaa!
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Mrs. Sirius - Jan 24, 2006 12:05 am (#295 of 342)
Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
Yes, Derek I like that one! But I would say instead of his sweetheart Madame Pince, his true love Mrs. Norris.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 11:48 am (#296 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
LOL Mrs. Sirius - that is exactly what I thought, too.
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Gina R Snape - Jan 24, 2006 3:50 pm (#297 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Maybe it'll be Tobias Snape! Unfortunately we don't know much about him. But we know he is (or was) a muggle.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 6:43 pm (#298 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I wonder if he's still living?
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Gina R Snape - Jan 24, 2006 6:55 pm (#299 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I certainly hope we find out! And of course, I hope we find out more about Snape's parents and childhood.
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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 6:58 pm (#300 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
LOL I will seriously start a riot if we don't!!!!
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Magic late in life (Post 301 to 342)
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Steve Newton - Jan 24, 2006 7:57 pm (#301 of 342)
Librarian
Could Tobias Snape be underground as Filch? Filch did seem to be hanging out with Pince who may be related.
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Derek Robertson - Jan 25, 2006 12:18 pm (#302 of 342)
Steve Newton, I like your idea, the only problem being we know Filch is definatley confirmed as a Squib and Tobias Snape was/is a muggle.
But it'd be great to find out Filch is Severus's father and Madame Pince is his mother, both hidden by Dumbledore from the Dark forces!
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Steve Newton - Jan 25, 2006 6:58 pm (#303 of 342)
Librarian
I recall students saying that Filch is a Squib. I'm not sure that that is convincing evidence.
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Choices - Jan 25, 2006 7:30 pm (#304 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
The Lexicon definitely states that Filch is a Squib - a person born of magical parents, but who possess such a low level of magical power that they are virtually unable to do magic at all. They can see magical creatures and beings, but can not see dementors - according to JKR. Only two Squibs are listed for the HP books - Filch and Mrs. Figg.
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Gina R Snape - Jan 25, 2006 8:26 pm (#305 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I thought Filch says himself that he's a squib, not that the students gossip about him saying he is one.
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Good Evans - Jan 26, 2006 12:53 am (#306 of 342)
Practically perfect in every way
Gina - you are right - in COS when Mrs Norris is petrified Filch accuses harry saying that he did it because he knew he was a squib, or words to that effect. Filch makes the announcement, unless he is lying it is quite open thereafter that Filch is a squib.
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Steve Newton - Jan 26, 2006 6:44 am (#307 of 342)
Librarian
I stand corrected. Thanks for the information.
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Choices - Jan 26, 2006 12:18 pm (#308 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Thanks for that info Good Evans - I thought I remembered Filch saying that, but couldn't remember where, so I just checked the Lexicon.
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bigearl - Feb 7, 2006 3:17 pm (#309 of 342)
From JKR's website, "No, she won't. Aunt Petunia has never performed magic, nor will she ever be able to do so."
I am in the Figg or Filch camp on this one,
but I also think it may be Dudley,
if a wizards name is put down at Hogwarts at birth, than "magic late in life" could mean that age 17 is 'late', (Great Uncle Algie was concerned about Neville not showing magical ability at a young age) 17 would be rather old to start doing magic for the 1st time
JKR also said "Harry will, in the long term, get back at Dudley."
""Did Harry ever use magic on Dudley in the real world?"" JKR: "Not so far (hint)"
JKR: "You should keep an eye on Dudley. It’s probably too late for Aunt Petunia and Uncle Vernon. I feel sorry for Dudley. I might joke about him, but I feel truly sorry for him because I see him as just as abused as Harry. Though, in possibly a less obvious way."
perhaps something (like Harry or a Death Eater)provokes Dudders, and magic will happen.
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Steve Newton - Feb 7, 2006 3:22 pm (#310 of 342)
Librarian
Someone did this recently but here is a list of all of the contenders that I can think of: Vernon, Figg, Filch, Stan(maybe). Are there any other recurring muggles who it could be? Aunt Marge, one of the Masons? JKR has said, somewhere, that with Dudley what you see is what you get. I think that rules him out. Piers? Ernie Prang?
Vernon would be the most ironic. Filch might also. Figg would be the one I am rooting for.
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Solitaire - Feb 7, 2006 6:14 pm (#311 of 342)
Figgy is my choice ... I really want it to be her!
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Caius Iulius - Feb 14, 2006 12:18 pm (#312 of 342)
One of Dudders friends perhaps?
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Finn BV - Feb 19, 2006 3:44 pm (#313 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Caius, JKR has said that the magic would happen late in life. So unless some of Dudley's school friends were held back about 70 times too many, I'm not seeing that!
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Solitaire - Feb 19, 2006 4:09 pm (#314 of 342)
The expression "late in life" makes me think the one to which Jo refers will be older, like Filch or Figgy ... or someone else who is in that general age group.
Solitaire
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timrew - Feb 19, 2006 5:52 pm (#315 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Magic Late In Life....................Hmmmmm, it will probably be someone who's ancient, on the point of death, and hasn't performed any magic before......................
I think that narrows it down to Professor Trelawney or Mrs. Filch, or, as an outsider, Trevor the Toad. But no-one knows how long a toad lives, or indeed, how old Trevor is!
Which has me favouring Frodo.................Ooops, sorry. Wrong book!
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Gina R Snape - Feb 20, 2006 8:09 pm (#316 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Professor Trelawney has performed magic though. And so has Frodo, in his own way.
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Die Zimtzicke - Feb 27, 2006 8:22 pm (#317 of 342)
I think Petunia, Filch and Figg are all good guesses, but my money's on Filch. I think something drastic will happen and he'll pull it together. Petunia knows more than she lets on, but I'll be VERY disappointed if it's her. And Figg is just too peripheral a character, unless there's a BIG to-do at Number 4 when the protection ends. If dementors couldn't scare some magic out of her, I'm betting nothing else will.
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Chemyst - Feb 28, 2006 7:28 am (#318 of 342)
"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
I would like for it to be Mrs. Figg in a sort of "her karma deserves it" way, but she seems too resigned to her squib-hood to even make an attempt at magic. Filch, on the other hand, orders Kwickspell courses and still keeps his dream of someday doing magic alive. I think this "won't stop trying" makes him the better candidate. I could see him intimidating someone with a wand, just on attitude alone, and then, zappo! it works.
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Solitaire - Feb 28, 2006 11:44 am (#319 of 342)
Petunia knows more than she lets on, but I'll be VERY disappointed if it's her.
In the Rumors section on her site, Rowling squelches the rumor that Aunt Petunia will start exhibiting magical tendencies. No, she won't. Aunt Petunia has never performed magic, nor will she ever be able to do so.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Mar 2, 2006 2:06 am (#320 of 342)
Chemyst - I like your thoughts about Filch but may be that's why it wont be him. he tries too hard. While Figgy may do something without thinking, she gets angry or a dementor attacks Mr Tibbles and then she does something. But having read the extras on JKR's site I'm not sure either Filch or Figgy are realistic candidates.
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Die Zimtzicke - Mar 2, 2006 8:43 pm (#321 of 342)
If Mrs. Figg was going to react to a dementor attack, she already had her chance and muffed it.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Mar 3, 2006 2:14 am (#322 of 342)
I agree Die Zimtzicke, though she wasn't in the front line. She arrived during the attack when things were happening. But as she didn't see the dementors, just felt their effect, and Filch's Quick Spell Course was a failure I doubt either of them. This is why I thought it was Petunia, so am now short of ideas - unless it is Vernon.
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Choices - Mar 3, 2006 11:46 am (#323 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
How about Hermione's parents. Sometimes those dentists can work magic - I've got the fillings to prove it. LOL
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Gina R Snape - Mar 3, 2006 1:25 pm (#324 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I still have my hopes set on Tobias Snape, and that we'll get to "meet" him and see Snape's reaction to his father suddenly doing magic.
And now I'm going to be wondering if a dementor woudl ever attack a cat!
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Magic Words - Mar 13, 2006 11:43 am (#325 of 342)
I was dead certain it would be Aunt Petunia... there just don't seem to be any other characters who are important enough and have never performed magic before. I guess Uncle Vernon is a possibility, though I would also rule out Dudley because of that quote saying what you see is what you get with him. Uncle Vernon seems like a stretch, to me- what are the chances that someone so obsessed with normality has had suppressed magical ability all this time? And that he would marry into Harry Potter's family?
Gina has brought up something I didn't think of. What if it's a historical character, met in a Pensieve, for instance. I think Tobias Snape is probably too minor a character, but what about, say, one of the founders? Dumbledore?
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Choices - Mar 13, 2006 7:33 pm (#326 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Magic Words, the person who will do magic late in life is someone who has previously not done magic. One of the founders or Dumbledore surely have done magic. JKR hints that it is a non-magical person who manages to do magic in a desperate situation.
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Magic Words - Mar 13, 2006 8:45 pm (#327 of 342)
Yes, I meant in the past. Maybe one of those people didn't do magic until after age 11.
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TheSaint - Mar 14, 2006 5:19 am (#328 of 342)
How about Dudley? LOL Maybe he does magic during a DE attack at 4 Privet during a midnight July 31 attack. His parents would just die!!!!
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Aimee Shawn - Mar 14, 2006 12:09 pm (#329 of 342)
Actually, our choices are limited by the amount of people we "know" who don't have magical powers. It wouldn't surprise me if The Saint was right. He fits the bill. And it has the power to drive Auntie Pet and Uncle Vernon absolutely mad! It could be the trade off DD made with Petunia so she'd take in Harry. My memory is fuzzy and I don't have access to my books, but didn't DD allude to a bargain?
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Finn BV - Mar 14, 2006 2:39 pm (#330 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Actually, Magic Words, I have been thinking along your lines for a while now, and if you look way back on this thread, you'll see I was in my own camp campaigning for somebody who does magic now, who couldn't do it before.
However, I doubt Dumbledore specifically because we know that he was in Gryffindor House, and thus went to Hogwarts (presumably at the right age, but then again...).
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Steve Newton - Mar 14, 2006 2:44 pm (#331 of 342)
Librarian
I don't have the citation right now but in one of her interviews JKR said that with Dudley what you see is what you get. This would seem to rule out any magical surprises for us or Vernon in this regard.
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haymoni - Mar 14, 2006 3:00 pm (#332 of 342)
I really hope it wasn't Merope. She did BETTER magic later in life.
What if Merope started out to be a Squib when JKR first wrote the books??? At least everyone THOUGHT she was a Squib when she couldn't perform under the heavy hand of her father. Once he was out of the picture, everything was fine.
I don't want that to be the answer.
I want it to be someone that does something dramatic.
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Steve Newton - Mar 14, 2006 3:03 pm (#333 of 342)
Librarian
I figure that at this point it would be cheating for it to be a new character. To me that leaves Figg, Vernon, and Filch as the only viable candidates. Unless, of course, it really is all about the Rot fang conspiracy. In that case Hermione's parents, both dentists, will root out both the dark magic and the gum disease.
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timrew - Mar 14, 2006 4:24 pm (#334 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
To go totally off the ball, how about Hermione's parents? One of the dentists does magic, and floors Voldy with a "Sectumsempra Root Canal!" spell..............
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Magic Words - Mar 14, 2006 6:22 pm (#335 of 342)
Finn BV, this could be the answer to the apparent dilemma over how Dumbledore seems to be incredibly old, yet one of Harry's O.W.L. instructors remembers him at Hogwarts. She could have tested him when he was older than fifteen.
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Miss Black - May 15, 2006 1:41 pm (#336 of 342)
I'm pretty sure that Jo stated that Pertunia would not show magic late in life. Lets go through our list of non-magic people... Filch perhaps?
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 16, 2006 3:18 am (#337 of 342)
Ys, on her site on the rumours page, JKR states that there is nothing special (magical) about Pet.
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Die Zimtzicke - May 16, 2006 4:52 pm (#338 of 342)
My money is still on Filch, or perhaps Mrs. Figg.
Mrs. Figg could fit in nicely, if there is an attack on Privet Drive when Harry turns 17 and the protection wears off. If it happens at Hogwarts, then I think it will be Filch.
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Solitaire - May 20, 2006 12:57 pm (#339 of 342)
Mrs. Figg is the one I hope gets to perform magic late in life, but I think Filch is also an excellent candidate. In fact, given his position in the school, I can see him making an attempt to save one or more students and managing to do so with his first-ever successful spell.
Solitaire
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Miss Black - May 20, 2006 3:24 pm (#340 of 342)
Filch saving a student willingly? Perhaps saving Mrs. Norris but I don't thnk he'd trouble himself for a student.
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Die Zimtzicke - May 20, 2006 6:56 pm (#341 of 342)
Filch loves the school. I really think he does. It's his home, as it is for Harry. I think it would galvanize him if there were another attack on it.
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Choices - May 20, 2006 7:45 pm (#342 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Maybe Filch could perform a little magic to save his "girlfriend" Madam Pince from danger. LOL
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Librarian
Could Tobias Snape be underground as Filch? Filch did seem to be hanging out with Pince who may be related.
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Derek Robertson - Jan 25, 2006 12:18 pm (#302 of 342)
Steve Newton, I like your idea, the only problem being we know Filch is definatley confirmed as a Squib and Tobias Snape was/is a muggle.
But it'd be great to find out Filch is Severus's father and Madame Pince is his mother, both hidden by Dumbledore from the Dark forces!
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Steve Newton - Jan 25, 2006 6:58 pm (#303 of 342)
Librarian
I recall students saying that Filch is a Squib. I'm not sure that that is convincing evidence.
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Choices - Jan 25, 2006 7:30 pm (#304 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
The Lexicon definitely states that Filch is a Squib - a person born of magical parents, but who possess such a low level of magical power that they are virtually unable to do magic at all. They can see magical creatures and beings, but can not see dementors - according to JKR. Only two Squibs are listed for the HP books - Filch and Mrs. Figg.
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Gina R Snape - Jan 25, 2006 8:26 pm (#305 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I thought Filch says himself that he's a squib, not that the students gossip about him saying he is one.
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Good Evans - Jan 26, 2006 12:53 am (#306 of 342)
Practically perfect in every way
Gina - you are right - in COS when Mrs Norris is petrified Filch accuses harry saying that he did it because he knew he was a squib, or words to that effect. Filch makes the announcement, unless he is lying it is quite open thereafter that Filch is a squib.
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Steve Newton - Jan 26, 2006 6:44 am (#307 of 342)
Librarian
I stand corrected. Thanks for the information.
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Choices - Jan 26, 2006 12:18 pm (#308 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Thanks for that info Good Evans - I thought I remembered Filch saying that, but couldn't remember where, so I just checked the Lexicon.
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bigearl - Feb 7, 2006 3:17 pm (#309 of 342)
From JKR's website, "No, she won't. Aunt Petunia has never performed magic, nor will she ever be able to do so."
I am in the Figg or Filch camp on this one,
but I also think it may be Dudley,
if a wizards name is put down at Hogwarts at birth, than "magic late in life" could mean that age 17 is 'late', (Great Uncle Algie was concerned about Neville not showing magical ability at a young age) 17 would be rather old to start doing magic for the 1st time
JKR also said "Harry will, in the long term, get back at Dudley."
""Did Harry ever use magic on Dudley in the real world?"" JKR: "Not so far (hint)"
JKR: "You should keep an eye on Dudley. It’s probably too late for Aunt Petunia and Uncle Vernon. I feel sorry for Dudley. I might joke about him, but I feel truly sorry for him because I see him as just as abused as Harry. Though, in possibly a less obvious way."
perhaps something (like Harry or a Death Eater)provokes Dudders, and magic will happen.
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Steve Newton - Feb 7, 2006 3:22 pm (#310 of 342)
Librarian
Someone did this recently but here is a list of all of the contenders that I can think of: Vernon, Figg, Filch, Stan(maybe). Are there any other recurring muggles who it could be? Aunt Marge, one of the Masons? JKR has said, somewhere, that with Dudley what you see is what you get. I think that rules him out. Piers? Ernie Prang?
Vernon would be the most ironic. Filch might also. Figg would be the one I am rooting for.
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Solitaire - Feb 7, 2006 6:14 pm (#311 of 342)
Figgy is my choice ... I really want it to be her!
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Caius Iulius - Feb 14, 2006 12:18 pm (#312 of 342)
One of Dudders friends perhaps?
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Finn BV - Feb 19, 2006 3:44 pm (#313 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Caius, JKR has said that the magic would happen late in life. So unless some of Dudley's school friends were held back about 70 times too many, I'm not seeing that!
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Solitaire - Feb 19, 2006 4:09 pm (#314 of 342)
The expression "late in life" makes me think the one to which Jo refers will be older, like Filch or Figgy ... or someone else who is in that general age group.
Solitaire
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timrew - Feb 19, 2006 5:52 pm (#315 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
Magic Late In Life....................Hmmmmm, it will probably be someone who's ancient, on the point of death, and hasn't performed any magic before......................
I think that narrows it down to Professor Trelawney or Mrs. Filch, or, as an outsider, Trevor the Toad. But no-one knows how long a toad lives, or indeed, how old Trevor is!
Which has me favouring Frodo.................Ooops, sorry. Wrong book!
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Gina R Snape - Feb 20, 2006 8:09 pm (#316 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
Professor Trelawney has performed magic though. And so has Frodo, in his own way.
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Die Zimtzicke - Feb 27, 2006 8:22 pm (#317 of 342)
I think Petunia, Filch and Figg are all good guesses, but my money's on Filch. I think something drastic will happen and he'll pull it together. Petunia knows more than she lets on, but I'll be VERY disappointed if it's her. And Figg is just too peripheral a character, unless there's a BIG to-do at Number 4 when the protection ends. If dementors couldn't scare some magic out of her, I'm betting nothing else will.
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Chemyst - Feb 28, 2006 7:28 am (#318 of 342)
"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
I would like for it to be Mrs. Figg in a sort of "her karma deserves it" way, but she seems too resigned to her squib-hood to even make an attempt at magic. Filch, on the other hand, orders Kwickspell courses and still keeps his dream of someday doing magic alive. I think this "won't stop trying" makes him the better candidate. I could see him intimidating someone with a wand, just on attitude alone, and then, zappo! it works.
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Solitaire - Feb 28, 2006 11:44 am (#319 of 342)
Petunia knows more than she lets on, but I'll be VERY disappointed if it's her.
In the Rumors section on her site, Rowling squelches the rumor that Aunt Petunia will start exhibiting magical tendencies. No, she won't. Aunt Petunia has never performed magic, nor will she ever be able to do so.
Solitaire
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Phelim Mcintyre - Mar 2, 2006 2:06 am (#320 of 342)
Chemyst - I like your thoughts about Filch but may be that's why it wont be him. he tries too hard. While Figgy may do something without thinking, she gets angry or a dementor attacks Mr Tibbles and then she does something. But having read the extras on JKR's site I'm not sure either Filch or Figgy are realistic candidates.
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Die Zimtzicke - Mar 2, 2006 8:43 pm (#321 of 342)
If Mrs. Figg was going to react to a dementor attack, she already had her chance and muffed it.
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Phelim Mcintyre - Mar 3, 2006 2:14 am (#322 of 342)
I agree Die Zimtzicke, though she wasn't in the front line. She arrived during the attack when things were happening. But as she didn't see the dementors, just felt their effect, and Filch's Quick Spell Course was a failure I doubt either of them. This is why I thought it was Petunia, so am now short of ideas - unless it is Vernon.
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Choices - Mar 3, 2006 11:46 am (#323 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
How about Hermione's parents. Sometimes those dentists can work magic - I've got the fillings to prove it. LOL
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Gina R Snape - Mar 3, 2006 1:25 pm (#324 of 342)
"The world isn't split into good people and death eaters"
I still have my hopes set on Tobias Snape, and that we'll get to "meet" him and see Snape's reaction to his father suddenly doing magic.
And now I'm going to be wondering if a dementor woudl ever attack a cat!
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Magic Words - Mar 13, 2006 11:43 am (#325 of 342)
I was dead certain it would be Aunt Petunia... there just don't seem to be any other characters who are important enough and have never performed magic before. I guess Uncle Vernon is a possibility, though I would also rule out Dudley because of that quote saying what you see is what you get with him. Uncle Vernon seems like a stretch, to me- what are the chances that someone so obsessed with normality has had suppressed magical ability all this time? And that he would marry into Harry Potter's family?
Gina has brought up something I didn't think of. What if it's a historical character, met in a Pensieve, for instance. I think Tobias Snape is probably too minor a character, but what about, say, one of the founders? Dumbledore?
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Choices - Mar 13, 2006 7:33 pm (#326 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Magic Words, the person who will do magic late in life is someone who has previously not done magic. One of the founders or Dumbledore surely have done magic. JKR hints that it is a non-magical person who manages to do magic in a desperate situation.
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Magic Words - Mar 13, 2006 8:45 pm (#327 of 342)
Yes, I meant in the past. Maybe one of those people didn't do magic until after age 11.
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TheSaint - Mar 14, 2006 5:19 am (#328 of 342)
How about Dudley? LOL Maybe he does magic during a DE attack at 4 Privet during a midnight July 31 attack. His parents would just die!!!!
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Aimee Shawn - Mar 14, 2006 12:09 pm (#329 of 342)
Actually, our choices are limited by the amount of people we "know" who don't have magical powers. It wouldn't surprise me if The Saint was right. He fits the bill. And it has the power to drive Auntie Pet and Uncle Vernon absolutely mad! It could be the trade off DD made with Petunia so she'd take in Harry. My memory is fuzzy and I don't have access to my books, but didn't DD allude to a bargain?
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Finn BV - Mar 14, 2006 2:39 pm (#330 of 342)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Actually, Magic Words, I have been thinking along your lines for a while now, and if you look way back on this thread, you'll see I was in my own camp campaigning for somebody who does magic now, who couldn't do it before.
However, I doubt Dumbledore specifically because we know that he was in Gryffindor House, and thus went to Hogwarts (presumably at the right age, but then again...).
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Steve Newton - Mar 14, 2006 2:44 pm (#331 of 342)
Librarian
I don't have the citation right now but in one of her interviews JKR said that with Dudley what you see is what you get. This would seem to rule out any magical surprises for us or Vernon in this regard.
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haymoni - Mar 14, 2006 3:00 pm (#332 of 342)
I really hope it wasn't Merope. She did BETTER magic later in life.
What if Merope started out to be a Squib when JKR first wrote the books??? At least everyone THOUGHT she was a Squib when she couldn't perform under the heavy hand of her father. Once he was out of the picture, everything was fine.
I don't want that to be the answer.
I want it to be someone that does something dramatic.
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Steve Newton - Mar 14, 2006 3:03 pm (#333 of 342)
Librarian
I figure that at this point it would be cheating for it to be a new character. To me that leaves Figg, Vernon, and Filch as the only viable candidates. Unless, of course, it really is all about the Rot fang conspiracy. In that case Hermione's parents, both dentists, will root out both the dark magic and the gum disease.
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timrew - Mar 14, 2006 4:24 pm (#334 of 342)
Middle-aged Harry Potter fan
To go totally off the ball, how about Hermione's parents? One of the dentists does magic, and floors Voldy with a "Sectumsempra Root Canal!" spell..............
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Magic Words - Mar 14, 2006 6:22 pm (#335 of 342)
Finn BV, this could be the answer to the apparent dilemma over how Dumbledore seems to be incredibly old, yet one of Harry's O.W.L. instructors remembers him at Hogwarts. She could have tested him when he was older than fifteen.
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Miss Black - May 15, 2006 1:41 pm (#336 of 342)
I'm pretty sure that Jo stated that Pertunia would not show magic late in life. Lets go through our list of non-magic people... Filch perhaps?
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Phelim Mcintyre - May 16, 2006 3:18 am (#337 of 342)
Ys, on her site on the rumours page, JKR states that there is nothing special (magical) about Pet.
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Die Zimtzicke - May 16, 2006 4:52 pm (#338 of 342)
My money is still on Filch, or perhaps Mrs. Figg.
Mrs. Figg could fit in nicely, if there is an attack on Privet Drive when Harry turns 17 and the protection wears off. If it happens at Hogwarts, then I think it will be Filch.
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Solitaire - May 20, 2006 12:57 pm (#339 of 342)
Mrs. Figg is the one I hope gets to perform magic late in life, but I think Filch is also an excellent candidate. In fact, given his position in the school, I can see him making an attempt to save one or more students and managing to do so with his first-ever successful spell.
Solitaire
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Miss Black - May 20, 2006 3:24 pm (#340 of 342)
Filch saving a student willingly? Perhaps saving Mrs. Norris but I don't thnk he'd trouble himself for a student.
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Die Zimtzicke - May 20, 2006 6:56 pm (#341 of 342)
Filch loves the school. I really think he does. It's his home, as it is for Harry. I think it would galvanize him if there were another attack on it.
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Choices - May 20, 2006 7:45 pm (#342 of 342)
*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Maybe Filch could perform a little magic to save his "girlfriend" Madam Pince from danger. LOL
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