Hogwarts Express Train and Wizard Space (Condensed Thread)

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Hogwarts Express Train and Wizard Space (Condensed Thread)

Post  Elanor on Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:41 am

Hogwarts Express Train and Wizard Space (Condensed Thread)

This topic serves as an archive of a thread from the Harry Potter Lexicon Forum as hosted on World Crossing which ceased operation on April 15, 2011. Elanor

shepherdess - Dec 3, 2003 1:30 am
Edited by Kip Carter Jan 12, 2006 11:31 pm
This was a discussion about how Wizard Space can fit inside muggle space.

Landman - Jan 8, 2003 12:57 pm
I realize the train is a magical device and that it would not be seen by Muggles and I accept the Lexicon explanation of why it looks like a train and uses train tracks. . .the question I have is what physical space does it occupy at the London Kings Cross station?

It's not just a question of Muggles not noticing the train or the track. We've seen other magical devices (like the Bus and the Car, etc.) but they all have a physical presence. In other words, the bus and car can't occupy the same space.

The only explanation I can think of is that when you step through the barrier at Platform 9-3/4 you are actually transported many miles away from the London station.

Any thoughts??
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Hogwarts Express Train and Wizard Space (Condensed Thread)

Post  Elanor on Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:42 am

Alianora - Jan 8, 2003 1:02 pm (#1 of 36)
But then how would Ron and Harry be able to find the train when they take the flying car? They wouldn't be able to find it.
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NCThomas - Jan 8, 2003 5:33 pm (#2 of 36)
It's at King's Cross, just hidden from muggles, just like Diagon Alley is hidden. Best example: the Weasley's car. Arthur was able to magically expand it so many people and things could fit; I imagine the alley and the platform work under similar principals.
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Lenka - Jan 8, 2003 9:55 pm (#3 of 36)
And Moody's trunk - it had a whole room in it.
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Rosariana - Feb 3, 2003 1:43 pm (#5 of 36)
It's called wizard space. I can't explain it well because it isn't real, but basically it makes matter take up little or no physical space. Like how Azkaban is unplottable. Only wizards can know it is there. Maybe the Hogwarts express is squeezed inside the barrier between platforms 9 and 10 until it exits the station, when it becomes full size.
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Wesley Montoya - Feb 3, 2003 2:18 pm (#6 of 36)
Remember the Weasley's tent? It looked small from the outside, but inside it was a house. The barrier looks small from the outside, but contains an entire platform.
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Lenka - Mar 13, 2003 12:18 pm (#7 of 36)
Yeah. I agree. That's how things are implotable. Maybe Hogwarts is really all fit into a space that would theoretically be like a centimeter squared to muggles.
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Penny L. - Mar 20, 2003 6:36 pm (#8 of 36)
Even more curious then the "magic space" phenomenon, is - How do they keep from all toppaling on top of each other when they get onto the platform? Is there a guard, telling people to get out of the way? Does he turn off the gate if someone trips and falls? Think about it simply this way... A wizard calmly walks into Platform 9 and 3/4. A witch follows him, by causully leaning agains the barrier. As she regains her balance, her brother runs through the barrier and crashes into her. Books, Cauldrons, and Pets go flying. It just doesn't seem very safe to me. I know, its magic, but there doesn't seem to be a magic explanation for this. The Platform it self can be explained away easily by saying that either the wall itself is a portkey, or its just hollow and the tower is magically expanded.
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honey dutchess - Mar 20, 2003 8:04 pm (#9 of 36)
I don't have any probable explanations other than the muggle trains jump out of the way when the magical train comes roaring through....
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Detail Seeker - Mar 21, 2003 12:29 pm (#12 of 36)
Please excuse the engineer still asking: How does magic function?
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Lenka - Mar 21, 2003 12:37 pm (#13 of 36)
"Magic" is all the things in the harry potter world that cannot be logically explained by our simple, muggle minds Smile
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Eloise Midgen - Mar 27, 2003 2:30 pm (#16 of 36)
It's Magic!(but I'd still like to know how it works)

I think the barrier is a shrinking machine. People walk through it, are shrunk to a centimeter tall(plus or minus a couple millimeters, depending on their original hight, everything is proportional, of course) board a minuscule train, ride out of the station in underground tracks, and then resume their normal size once they are outside the station.
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Gina R Snape - Mar 31, 2003 10:19 am (#20 of 36)
I don't know about the space issue. But, it would seem to me that most people might figure out to get out of the way once they go through the barrier. I'm guessing the one side of the barrier is narrow, but it opens into a wider space. So people don't necessarily land parallel to where they started. But the risk of winding up on top of someone is still there since it is a bit of a bottleneck. But we have that in the non-magical world. So, I don't see why it's such a big deal.
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Nine - Mar 31, 2003 1:11 pm (#22 of 36)
I think there's something about almost running into each other in PoA. *Goes to check* OK, got it. It's actually not what I thought, but anyway, Harry and Mr. Weasley go through the barrier by casually leaning against it. Apparently, they don't move after that (at least, not noticeably), but Percy and Ginny, who come through next "at a run" don't run into them. So that implies there is a safeguard against running into each other.
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Diagon Nilly - Mar 31, 2003 3:45 pm (#23 of 36)
Also, JK has said in interviews that she wrote the Kings Cross scenes while she was traveling and couldn't get there to reference the layout. So, she may have visualized that barrier being quite wide - wide enough for seveal people to walk abreast through it. Unfortunately, the actual barrier isn't that wide.
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Landman - Mar 31, 2003 7:41 pm (#25 of 36)
Why did JKR choose 9-3/4 as opposed to 9-1/2. The platform is described (and we've seen) as being between platforms 9 and 10 (implied equally between) -- we JKR doesn't do things by accident, so what did she have in mind??
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Denise S. - Mar 31, 2003 9:02 pm (#27 of 36)
I remember seeing an interview on A&E or a similar station where someone asked that question, Landman, and she said she picked it because it was her favorite fraction.
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Diagon Nilly - Apr 1, 2003 10:11 am (#28 of 36)
I was reading about wormholes last night (in “The Science of Harry Potter”) and here's what the book said about 9 3/4:

"cosmic wormholes provide shortcuts between two distinct points in space-time, separated by five miles or five million miles, five years or five-million years. (or in this case, a few yards - DN)....To understand wormholes, we must turn to Einstein's theory of gravity as warped space-time. Then we have to look at what happens as a result of the extreme space-time distortions cased by the biggest gravitational tug of all, that occuring around black holes...Einstein had discovered that the equations of relativity show that a black hole forms a bridge between two places/times (regions of space-time). For a wormhole to be held open (like the portal onto 9 3/4 -DN), it's throat would have to be threaded by some form of exotic matter, or some form of field, that would exert negative pressure and have antigravity associated with it (Or I guess otherwise everything, even light & muggles would get sucked onto platform 9 3/4 -DN)."

So there we go. In a non-direct way, Einstein is saying that the entrance onto 9 3/4 is a small black hole that leads to a platform some distance away from platforms 9 & 10 but still at Kings Cross. So platform 9 3/4 is probably nowhere near its entrance.
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Gina R Snape - Apr 2, 2003 4:57 pm (#29 of 36)
Oh, yeah. I read somewhere that Rowling chose 9 3/4 because she liked the sound of it.
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