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Does Snape Want to Be the DADA Teacher? (Condensed Thread)
Elanor Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:22 am
Does Snape Want to Be the DADA Teacher? (Condensed Thread)
Denise S. - Jan 14, 2004 1:43 pm
Why does Snape want to be the DADA teacher so badly?
riquelme - Dec 19, 2002
(I hate to abbreviate Defense Against the Dark Arts, but...)
I've always wondered that. Unless it's written in the novels and I forgot, why does Snape want to teach Defense Against the Dark Arts? He won't teach it in Order of Phoenix, and if he does get the job in the sixth book, he will probably die, (one year per teacher jinx).
This topic serves as an archive of a thread from the Harry Potter Lexicon Forum as hosted on World Crossing which ceased operation on April 15, 2011. Elanor
Denise S. - Jan 14, 2004 1:43 pm
Why does Snape want to be the DADA teacher so badly?
riquelme - Dec 19, 2002
(I hate to abbreviate Defense Against the Dark Arts, but...)
I've always wondered that. Unless it's written in the novels and I forgot, why does Snape want to teach Defense Against the Dark Arts? He won't teach it in Order of Phoenix, and if he does get the job in the sixth book, he will probably die, (one year per teacher jinx).
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Does Snape Want to Be the DADA Teacher? (Condensed Thread)
Elanor Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:23 am
Jami JoAnne Russell - Dec 19, 2002 (#1 of 116)
It's been talked about before. We've pretty much come to the conclusion he doesn't want it, he just hates the people teaching it. He knew Quirrel was working for Voldermort. Lockhart was a bloody idiot. He hated Lupin. And "Moody" kept making accusations and broke into his office.
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Alianora - Dec 20, 2002 (#3 of 116)
I'm not so sure of that- I think it says something to the idea of he wants the job because he knows about the dark arts; besides, he was happy (sort of) when he got the job when Lupin turned into a werewolf. I'm not sure why Dumbledore doesn't just let him teach it.
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NoVeil4Me - Dec 20, 2002 (#4 of 116)
Alianora, can you provide me anything at all from the books that shows SNAPE wants the job? There is student rumor that everyone knows he wants the job but where does the man himself ever show any interest in the job? If he was all fired up for the job, why would Lockhart have been the only one who applied for the job? Snape is a brilliant and capable Potions Master...why would he want to switch to DADA? There is absolutely nothing in the books, anywhere, that support Snape himself wanting the job.
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vdobbs - Dec 20, 2002 (#5 of 116)
When Lockhart got the job in the 2nd book, it is stated that Lockhart got the job because he's the only one who applied.
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dumblydore - Dec 20, 2002 (#6 of 116)
I agree with Denise P. While Snape would make a capable Dark Arts teacher, I don't think he wants anyone else to come NEAR his potions class. That's his baby.
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kimiraikkonen - Dec 20, 2002 (#7 of 116)
I get the feeling that Snape took Potions only as a substitute. I think Dumbledore wanted him around as his spy but he didn't want Snape to teach DADA because of his history as a Death Eater. Remember when Sirius said Snape knew more Dark Arts then all the seventh years when he entered Hogwarts? He would probably end up teaching them the Dark Arts instead of "the defence rubbish that we do," which is not what Dumbledore wants.
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phoenixeleven - Dec 20, 2002 (#8 of 116)
Seeing as how Snape is a former Death Eater and not dead, I'll bet none of the Death Eaters he was friends with caught on that he was a spy, which means he still has to keep up appearances. Basically, the man knows too much. If he taught Defense Against the Dark Arts, he could probably teach it very well, since he knows the inner workings of an organization of very evil wizards. But if any of his students caught on to that fact, for instance, Lucius Malfoy's son, the bad guys would be able to put two and two together and old Snape would be toast. There might be some truth to the rumor, Snape might want to teach DADA, especially if he knows that he could actually be an effective teacher, but for his safety's sake, I don't think he would.
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Sly Girl - Dec 20, 2002 (#9 of 116)
I think Snape is pretty happy as Potions "Master"- funny, everyone else is just a teacher but Snape is always referred to as "Master"...
I wouldn't take what Sirius says about Snape to be truth, anymore than what the students believe. Not only is Snape working against his own prejudices regarding Sirius, but Sirius is as well. The two disliked each other, and what Sirius may believe to be a mountain of knowledge about the Dark Arts may just have been Snape's know-it-all-ism at work. I picture Snape being very nerdy as a Hogwarts student and maybe he favored learning about Dark Arts.
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NoVeil4Me - Dec 20, 2002 (#10 of 116)
I am referring to Snape as a Master Potion maker since he is one of only a handful that can make the potion for werewolves.
It said Snape knew curses, not specifically Dark Arts, although he was clearly interested in DA.
From the Lexicon, here are some specifics on Snape...no where does it mention HE wants the DADA job
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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Sly Girl - Dec 21, 2002 (#11 of 116)
Actually, Denise, they refer to Snape as a MASTER in the books too. They do often refer to the different teachers as Prof so and so. Snape more often than not has the Master part after his title; I just noticed it and thought it was odd or significant. And this is way before the wolfsbane potion for Lupin.
Which brings up another point- why is that particular potion so hard to make?? Lupin makes a point of telling Harry that he's lucky to work with Snape because not many wizards are up to making the potion. SO what exactly goes into that thing?
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Molly Weasley - Dec 21, 2002 (#12 of 116)
If Snape got the DADA job in CoS, then who would be the potions teacher? Can you imagine Lockhart at that job? "And then you put in two cups of armadillo bile. I've done it countless times before (for full details see my published works). Then- oh, oops, it exploded. That can happen sometimes. Well, you guys can go up to the hospital wing while I go curl my hair. Next lesson, we learn how to make love potions. Signed copies of Magical Me to the best one!"
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W J - Dec 22, 2002 (#14 of 116)
Alianora, Snape was happy when he substituted for Lupin in DADA because he had the chance to criticize Lupin as a teacher and possibly expose him as a werewolf. He does not want the DADA job. It is only a student rumor and no other facts support it.
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zeuspro - Mar 2, 2003 (#15 of 116)
Mabe Snape does want the job, but Dumbledore won’t give it to him because there is no-one good enough to replace him as potions master. It happens in business: people miss promotions because there is nobody who could take over their old job and do it as well as they do.
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Istari Jones - Mar 2, 2003 (#17 of 116)
In CoS Hagrid reports Lockhart was the only one who applied for the DADA job. This statement tends to support the "student rumor" theory. If Snape wanted it badly enough, he could have at least applied for it. This would negate Harry's comment to Lupin that Snape would "do anything" to get the position. So, I believe he doesn't want as badly as some people believe he does.
But, zeuspro...that's a good question...would Snape concede his position as Potions Master to take the job? Would it be harder to find someone to take Snape's place than to get a new DADA teacher? I wonder, is the title “Potions Master” an advanced degree requiring additional education? Or is it an honorary title?
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Olivia Wood - Mar 2, 2003 (#18 of 116)
Or maybe it just sounds better. I don't think there is much truth to the rumor, but it can't be just that Snape hated Quirrel, Lockhart, Lupin and Moody, since I think it was common knowledge he wanted the job back in first year, and I don't think just not liking the current teacher makes people assume automatically you want their position. So unless he just happened to hate the previous DADA teachers too, then there has to be more to it then that. I'd like to think it has something to do with his being a vampire, but so far I see no possible connections.
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Carina - Mar 2, 2003 (#19 of 116)
I disagree, Olivia. I think it CAN be that Snape just hates the DADA teachers. • Quirrel was a traitor, • Lockhart was a fraud, • Lupin was a childhood nemisis and • Moody knew his dark, Death Eater secret.
It may have been common knowledge among the STUDENTS way back in Harry's first year, but that doesn't mean it was anymore true then as it is now.
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Sly Girl - Mar 2, 2003 (#20 of 116)
How long had Quirrel had the DADA job prior to Harry Potter coming to Hogwarts?
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Gina R Snape - Mar 2, 2003 (#21 of 116)
I honestly don't think DADA teacher is necessarily a promotion over Potions Master. And, I don't think Snape can be promoted anymore anyway. I think he is 3rd in line after McGonogall and Dumbledore himself. Clearly the 3 of them work closest of all. I think Snape just wants someone good teaching the class. It is a very important part of their education. Snape is shocked and appalled when he replaces Lupin to learn how far behind the children are. And I don't think he's necessarily blaming that on Lupin. Even if he is underhandedly trying to get them to figure out that Lupin is a werewolf.
And Oliva, I admire your ability to sneak in references to Snape being a vampire into every Snape discussion. I don't agree, but I'm finding it very funny! :-)
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W J - Mar 2, 2003 (#22 of 116)
Hagrid said that Quirrel was the DADA teacher for a while and then took a year off to get some first hand experience. Hagrid said he was changed when he came back. Nervous. So Quirrell was there for more than one year.
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shepherdess - Mar 2, 2003 (#23 of 116)
Istari, How can the title "Potions Master" be an "advanced degree requiring additional education"? I've been told there are no wizard universities, and apprenticeships don't give "advanced degrees". How Snape became a potions MASTER and Pomfrey became a TRAINED nurse is apparently a mystery.
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#24 of 116)
Maybe Master is based on level of skill—we learn that the Wolfsbane potion that Lupin takes is extremely hard to make and not many wizards would be up to making it. Where he learned that other than Hogwarts is anyone's guess, but maybe how good you are at something leads to your "title"
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Istari Jones - Mar 3, 2003 (#25 of 116)
That's why I was questioning it. There has been no mention of other schools of learning also, but maybe JKR just hasn't mentioned them yet.
I find it hard to believe that furthering knowledge in some areas of expertise are left entirely up to the individual. I can't see someone graduating Hogwarts and being automatically proficient enough to become a nurse as Madame Pomfrey without having furthered her education in that specialty. While I admit the term "advanced degrees" was probably a poor choice of words, it was the only frame of reference I could come up with at the time I was typing. Perhaps there are mentorships to which wizards can apply?
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Prefect Marcus - Mar 3, 2003 (#26 of 116)
The Wizard world appears to have a system of mentoring set up. It could be a formal apprentice-journeyman-master arrangement, or they might just be assistants. Hagrid was assistant Gameskeeper for a while. Harry (after blowing up Aunt Marge) was thinking he might be the same.
There is also the ambiguity of the way the word "Master" is used. If I recall, the only time we see it is when Lockhart is offering to brew up a mandrake potion and Snape coldly interrupts him saying, "Excuse me, but I thought I was the potions master at this school." In all other cases that I remember, (and I certainly could be wrong here) Snape is referred to as "potions teacher" or "potions professor."
The use of the word "master" could mean a formal grade of skill, or it could mean that he is the head of the Potions Department, or that he was the potions teacher. Snape certainly would not hesitate to use the more prestigious title to put Lockhart in his place.
Is there any other use of the word "Master" referring to teachers in the books?
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Serena McD - Mar 3, 2003 (#27 of 116)
Reading Prefect Marcus' post is also interesting, it seems that Snape is suggesting that he is going to brew the Mandrake potion to unfreeze the victims of the basilisk. I thought Madame Pomfrey was mentioned as brewing it, though I can't find that reference anywhere right now.
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#28 of 116)
There's a whole chapter in SS called 'The Potions Master." In chapter 1 of CoS it says how Harry misses everything and everyone at Hogwarts except “Snape, the Potions master.” Almost every time Snape is mentioned he is described as the “Potions master.” I find it interesting that the 'master' isn't capitalized, I would think is should be if it were a formal title. I see 'Potions master' as just meaning he is the head of the department, even if he is the only one in it. JKR could just be referring to Snape as a Potions master instead of Potions teacher because
1) it sound better, more mysterious and spooky and all (you can't tell me it doesn't sound better),
2) It sets Snape apart from the other teachers,
3) It implies a mastery of his own subject, which we can be sure is pretty accurate, and
3) It sets up the “art of potion-making” as something of a specialization. I see Charms and Transfigurations as the 'mundane' Language Arts and Geographies and Algebras of the Wizarding World. Potions would be something more specific, like say Italian or Latin or Chemistry or Advanced Mathematics—something you don't actually use that often, but is really interesting and requires a lot of talent and skill to learn. I get the impression that just about any trained wizard can teach Charms or Transfiguration more or less effectively (not to say Minerva isn't good at what she does), but it takes a real “master” to teach Potions.
I understand that Snape is justified in hating all the DADA teachers on an individual basis. What I was getting at is that Snape was supposedly after the DADA job all the way back in SS, before Lupin, Lockhart, and Moody, and supposedly before Quirrel turned Evil. So I don't see what the basis of this rumor could be, someone wouldn't just come up with it at random. Can anyone remember when it was first mentioned?
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#29 of 116)
From Percy to Harry- SS/PS when Harry asks who is that man sitting next to Professor Quirrell because his scar is hurting and he (as well as we, the readers) thinks it's because Snape is staring at him- and Percy answers-
"Oh, you know Professor Quirrell already, do you? No wonder he's looking so nervous, that's Professor Snape. He teaches Potions but doesn't want to- everyone knows he's after Quirrell's job. Knows an awful lot about the Dark Arts, Snape."
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Gina R Snape - Mar 3, 2003 (#30 of 116)
I've seen mentioned somewhere else that not only does Snape not want to be the DADA teacher, but he may not even want to be the Potions teacher. Maybe he's at Hogwarts for safety and political reasons. Otherwise, why would someone so gifted at potions and clearly frustrated with most children want to teach rudimentary skills?
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#31 of 116)
Would just knowing a lot about the Dark Arts justify a rumor that you want the Defense Against the Dark Arts Job? Why didn't any of the previous teachers last long? Is the job really jinxed, and if so by whom? Why wouldn't Snape want to teach Potions? How reliable a source of information is Percy?
The new DADA teacher's going to be female; do you think Snape'll hate her too? Is it more likely for the new teacher to be someone Snape will hate? If so, Rita Skeeter sounds fitting... Although I suppose Snape could find it within himself to hate just about anyone...
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#32 of 116)
I think the students assume Snape is unhappy because he is acts unhappy. Maybe it's tough love, maybe it's a facade, who knows. But I can understand how the students would assume Snape wants the Dark Arts position. But I would say Snape does his job very well and doesn't seem to want to leave it.
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#33 of 116)
He'd still be teaching the same students if he was DADA professor, so that can't have anything to do with it...
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umbrella - Mar 3, 2003 (#34 of 116)
Just a thought on the "master" thing: I thought that was just another term for teacher or professor. Of course, I don't know much about British boarding schools. But, just as Dumbledore is headmaster, the teachers would be "masters." Maybe he was saying it as *a* master of the school.
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W J - Mar 3, 2003 (#35 of 116)
The British education system is different from what we are used to in America. For example, I think nurses live in dorms next to hospitals and must start at the bottom and master each skill at that level before they are moved to the next level up.
It is not the same as going to college in the U.S. to become a Registered Nurse. I have a friend who was head nurse in a maternity ward at a large London hospital for almost a decade. She married someone from the U.S. and came here to live. In the U.S., they do not accept her credentials to be a nurse, but Canada will. To become a Registered Nurse in the U.S., she would have to go to nursing college even though she was considered a master level nurse in the U.K..
JKR may have similar ideas about mastering skill levels in different fields of study. I think in "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them," the author says he became an expert in the field because he was asked to write a book on the subject and had to research it. It would seem that post-Hogwarts students must pursue their own education through research and perhaps mentorship from established masters in their field of study.
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Istari Jones - Mar 4, 2003 (#38 of 116)
That was exactly the point I was trying to make in post #17. One cannot just graduate Hogwarts and be immediately proficient in a chosen profession. Not only would the new graduate lack the complete body of knowledge needed for a specialty, but the maturity and experience needed to make rational judgments would also be lacking. (Because of this, the idea Fleur Delacour becoming the next DADA teacher to me is totally ridiculous.)
While no mention has been made about the availability of wizarding universities, it could be there has been no reason to mention then in the series yet. But, in keeping with the medieval atmosphere of the JKR's wizarding world, they actually may not exist.
Madame Pomfrey may be a nurse, but her methods demonstrate diagnosing medical problems and conditions AND prescribing medications and treatment for those issues. Again, this may be in keeping with the medieval setting of the wizarding world. I do not know how it is in the UK, but as an RN myself with a BSN, and certification in my specialty field, I do not have the ability to diagnose and prescribe here in the US. That is done by the physicians and to a limited extent by nurses with advanced practice degrees (nurse practitioners).
Yet to be a Potions Master…that could come with personal research and proficiency, &/or mentorship &/or could be an Honorific bestowed upon someone demonstrating proficiency in a chosen field.
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Lenka - Mar 13, 2003 (#39 of 116) I think it said in PoA that the NEWTs were the highest qualification Hogwarts offered. Therefore, there must be schools that offer a higher one. Or JK would just say "the highest qualifications possible".
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Meg L. - Mar 13, 2003 (#40 of 116)
Ellen, I do not want to sound rude at all, but I think that your idea comes down to semantics. I have a feeling that JKR just wrote the sentence and didn’t purposefully phrase it vaguely to let us analyze it. I agree with Istari that wizards have to go through some kind of apprenticeship in order to get their "higher education." It makes sense, considering the rest of the way that wizarding society works.
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NoVeil4Me - Mar 14, 2003 (#42 of 116) I believe JKR said in one of the Scholastic interviews that there is *no* wizarding universities. I would have to go look on the Lexicon for the specific interview but she was clear on it.
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Hedwig - Mar 17, 2003 (#43 of 116)
Maybe Dumbledore won't let Snape become the DADA teacher. If Snape knew Dumbledore wouldn't hire him, he might just not have applied to begin with. Maybe Dumbledore doesn't want him teaching it because of his background as a Death Eater. I know Dumbledore completely trusts him now, but maybe he is afraid Snape will unconsciously teach things he's not supposed to.
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Denise S. - Mar 17, 2003 (#44 of 116)
I think it's more a matter of politics like. I figure Dumbledore has picked up a lot of flack for hiring a former Death Eater, altho’ people put up with that. Yet, especially with VWII beginning, there would be a fair uproar if he put this former Death Eater into the position of DADA teacher. Dumbledore is not one concerned over what other people think, but considering that Snape is already good at potions and there's already a lot on his plate, I think he knows which battles are better to fight than others.
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PaulPatil - Mar 23, 2003 (#45 of 116)
I think the rumor that Snape wants the DADA position is simply another red herring set up by JKR to paint him in a suspicious light. Thinking back to the first time I read SS, I was sure Snape was up to something unsavory! The rumor gave reason for the animosity between Snape and Quirrel. On re-reading, we know what happens and may lose sight of the rumor's original purpose. It continues throughout the next books with no substantial evidence to support it—as always the case with student rumors.
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Sly Girl - Mar 23, 2003 (#46 of 116)
What I want to know is how and why and WHEN did Snape start to suspect Quirrel? Did Dumbledore clue him in? Did Snape start picking up on changes in Quirrel? Did his dark mark start to itch? It's never really explained in the book. Quirrel just says, Snape already suspected me.
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Gina R Snape - Mar 24, 2003 (#48 of 116)
I think Snape started to suspect Quirrell the first time Harry's scar hurts in the Great Hall. He puts it together as only Snape can. Then his suspicion was furthered on Halloween with the troll incident.
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Marie E. - Mar 24, 2003 (#49 of 116)
I wonder if Snape already knew that Quirrell was good with trolls. Wasn't the troll Quirrell's contribution to the protection of the stone? If Snape knew already, he would have easily put 2 and 2 together at the Halloween party.
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Kathy Lynch - Mar 25, 2003 (#51 of 116)
HUH? A cool sense of logic? SNAPE? Are you forgetting the scene in the Shrieking Shack when he refused to listen to reason because of his own prejudices? Or the time he almost became dinner for Fluffy because he acted so rashly to head off Quirrell? I mean, maybe the guy has some deductive reasoning skills, but he is much too hot-headed for me too agree that he's LOGICAL.
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Nine - Mar 25, 2003 (#52 of 116)
It wasn't rash, but necessary, to head off Quirrel. And I personally say we can't assume anything about any of the characters from that scene in PoA. We were seeing the worst in more than just Snape.
However, Snape didn't know that Harry's scar hurt in that scene in PS/SS.
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Tangent - Apr 12, 2003 (#77 of 116)
Snape supposedly wanting the DADA position could just be something *students* came up with to account for his hating Quirrel...
Scenario: Quirrel comes back, acting oddly. Snape suspects or deduces something, starts being very unfriendly towards him, possibly trying to find out what *exactly* is going on. Students notice, of course:
"Did you see that? Snape must really hate Professor Quirrel."
"I bet he's jealous, and after Quirrel's job!"
Thus is the rumor born. Resentment towards Snape for being sort of nasty and cruel adds weight to this; students on the receiving end of this will be willing to believe anything bad about him.
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Rotchell - Apr 15, 2003 (#81 of 116)
If Snape does want the D.A.D.A. job, then why didn't he take it in HRH's second year instead of Lockhart? Lockhart was only offered the job as a last resort. Personally I can't imagine that decent potion professors are that hard to find, which leaves us with either Snape doesn't actually want the job, or Dumbledore won't let him have it. Personally I think it's the latter, and there's more history to come that will explain all of this.
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Renea - May 12, 2003 (#82 of 116)
Maybe “Why does Dumbledore not allow Snape to be the DADA teacher?” is a better question.
My theory is he knew Harry would need to be well versed in this class. He has learned something different from every teacher. Lupin was more practical, hands on. Quirrell seems to me to be more from the book type of teacher and everyone loved Moody because he knew so much. Lockhart is the only questionable choice but I believe Dumbledore chose him for the same reason Harry has to stay at the Dursleys—a lesson to not let fame go to his head.
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timrew - May 12, 2003 (#83 of 116)
I don't think Snape wants the position of DADA teacher so badly. I think it's just a rumour that's been spread amongst the students. I mean, Snape or Lockhart as DADA teacher...it's no contest. Or perhaps Dumbledore regards Snape as the best Potions teacher the school has ever had, and is reluctant to transfer him.
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Olivia Wood - May 15, 2003 (#86 of 116)
If Snape really does want the DADA job, why would everyone know about it? He seems like a pretty private person to me. It's nothing more than a baseless student rumor.
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Wednesday Weasley - May 19, 2003 (#90 of 116)
It's kind of interesting that the "everyone knows [Snape's] after Quirrell's job" comment comes from Percy, since Percy seems to know so much about what's going on at Hogwarts.
JKR said in the CoS DVD interview that Hermione and Dumbledore were the best characters for setting up background information, since Dumbledore knows just about everything, and Hermione is reliable since she reads so much. But it wouldn't really work to have Dumbledore or Hermione provide the info about Snape & DADA during the first book, so maybe Percy was the next best thing, being kind of authoritative and older?
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Wednesday Weasley - May 21, 2003 (#96 of 116)
Snape and DADA. I'm a little bit conflicted on this one. I don't know why JKR would have Percy saying that Snape wanted Quirrell's job if this were patently untrue... on the other hand, Snape doesn't seem to have actively gone after the job.
Maybe Snape's just been too preoccupied since Harry came to Hogwarts to bother with going after the DADA job?
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Jackie !Fast - May 21, 2003 (#97 of 116)
Perhaps the DADA job is jinxed because Voldemort or one of his supporters is trying to prevent Harry from getting a good Dark Arts education. In the few years prior to Harry's entrance at Hogwarts, Quirrel had been the teacher, and then he left to get some first-hand experience. It's possible that the actual jinx didn't come into play until Harry's first year. Snape would do too good of a job teaching, so no matter how much he wants the job, magical forces are preventing him from trying.
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Sly Girl - May 21, 2003 9:56 pm (#98 of 116) I don't know though, Harry going up against the Dark Lord (in one form or another) each year is pretty much hands on Dark Arts experience, you know? I'd say that if that is the plan, then it's failing
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Nine - May 22, 2003 (#99 of 116)
…And Harry is directly or indirectly responsible for each DADA teacher that left, except Moody/Crouch, who would have left anyway. I don't think Moldy Voldie had any opportunity to cast such a jinx on the position.
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Gina R Snape - May 22, 2003 (#100 of 116)
I don't know, Nine. Something tells me Lockhart would've been leaving even without the memory charm.
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timrew - Jun 15, 2003 (#108 of 116)
Okay, there's only a week to go before we discover who the new DADA teacher is going to be, and I think we should be asking ourselves the question, 'Why has this rumour spread throughout the books that Snape REALLY wants the job for himself?'
It's obvious that he doesn't. I mean, in COS Gilderoy Lockhart gets the job before Snape? Come on!
He (Snape) may be an odious creep (for reasons that have yet to be made apparent), but he comes across as a brilliant potions master. There has never been a scene in the books where he is desperate to become the DADA teacher, so why has this rumour spread about him?
I have no idea - unless he becomes it in book Six. We already know that he doesn't get it in book Five - it's a female.
Does Snape really want this job? I think we should be told.
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Carina - Jun 16, 2003 (#110 of 116)
I think it's a red herring. We're told this in book one, when we're supposed to assume Snape is the bad guy, and it's re-iterated in book three when we're still not sure about his loyalties. Even now, there's still that inkling of doubt: is he, isn't he. I think JKR is just trying to keep us on our toes. :-D
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Marie E. - Jun 17, 2003 (#112 of 116)
I always thought the kids were misunderstanding Snape's great knowledge of Dark Arty stuff as a wish to be teaching the class.
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azi - Jun 18, 2003 (#113 of 116)
Snape doesn't exactly have the knowledge in everything to do with DADA though, does he? Either that or he was deliberately trying to mess Lupin's class up by saying the Kappa was found more commonly in whichever county it was. I would say Snape knows more about curses and dark potions than dark creatures. Teachers need to be good at everything in their subject really.
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timrew - Jun 18, 2003 (#114 of 116)
You might be right there, Marie E. I think rumours about Snape and the Dark Arts have been circling Hogwarts for years. Maybe not all the pupils know that he used to be a Death Eater - but there's no smoke without fire, as they say. The rumours about Snape wanting the DADA job could have come about by someone saying, "I heard Professor Snape knows all about the Dark Arts".
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Jackie !Fast - Jun 18, 2003 (#115 of 116)
Azi, I'd say it's more likely that he was trying to mess up Lupin's class. I mean, the guy knew more curses in first year than most sixth years, and as Moody says, you've got to know about Dark Arts to know defense. Since Snape knows a thing or twp about the Dart Arts, I'd say he could be a very knowledgeable DADA teacher. Which is why he just COULDN'T have applied before Harry's second year, because he would have gotten the job.
Unless the potions job is a lot harder to fill than DADA. If Snape was the DADA teacher, they'd have trouble finding a potions master.
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(A tangent April Fools adventure that, unlike the other April Fool’s posts, actually kinda fit in with its thread)
TOM MARVOLO RIDDLEY - Apr 1, 2003 (#64 of 116)
YO PIENSO QUE SNAPE QUIERE EL PUESTO PORQUE QUIERE SEGUIR APARENTANDEO SER PERVERSO, PERO NO ES ASI YA QUE EL SALVA LA VIDA DE HARRY EN SS, Y ADEMAS DEBE APARENTAR QUE ES PERVERSO PARA DEMOSTRAR QUE NUNCA AVANDONO A VOLDEMORT
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Meg L. - Apr 1, 2003 (#66 of 116)
Um, anyone speak Spanish?
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NoVeil4Me - Apr 1, 2003 (#67 of 116)
Hmm, this is what I got when I plugged it into a translator
I THINK THAT SNAPE WANTS The POSITION BECAUSE IT WANTS TO FOLLOW APARENTANDEO TO BE PERVERSE, BUT IS NOT ASI SINCE SAFE The LIFE DE HARRY IN SS, And ADEMAS MUST PRETEND THAT SHE IS PERVERSE TO NEVER DEMONSTRATE THAT AVANDONO To VOLDEMORT
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W J - Apr 1, 2003 (#68 of 116) TOM MARVOLO RIDDLEY
#1 - Please do not shout. All capital letters equals shouting on the internet. It might be helpful for you to read the "Philosophy of this Forum" thread.
#2 - Please speak English.
Thank you.
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Sly Girl - Apr 1, 2003 (#69 of 116)
Oh come on guys, can't you recognize Alfonso Cuaron when you see him.
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Carina - Apr 1, 2003 (#70 of 116)
Loosly translated (my Spanish is not the best), I believe Tom is saying:
I believe that Snape wants the job because he wants to continue pretending to be evil, but this is not really so since he saved Harry's life in SS and now he needs to pretend that he is evil to show he never abandoned Voldemort.
TOM, Hable por favor inglés. Nosotros no lo entendemos cuando usted habla el español.
Don't be too impressed. I got the Spanish to Tom from a translator site.
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Denise S. - Apr 2, 2003 (#73 of 116)
(Shh, Carina, you were impressing people!)
It's probably an April Fool's thing someone did, I don't think it was a regular post.
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Nine - Apr 4, 2003 (#74 of 116)
That's probable, Denise, since I don't think Tom Marvolo Riddle was Voldie's other name in the Spanish version of the books.
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Marè - Apr 4, 2003 (#75 of 116)
And because the person seemed to be able to read English quite perfectly. He did post to the right thread.
Why do I have the feeling someone is laughing at us right now....
It's been talked about before. We've pretty much come to the conclusion he doesn't want it, he just hates the people teaching it. He knew Quirrel was working for Voldermort. Lockhart was a bloody idiot. He hated Lupin. And "Moody" kept making accusations and broke into his office.
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Alianora - Dec 20, 2002 (#3 of 116)
I'm not so sure of that- I think it says something to the idea of he wants the job because he knows about the dark arts; besides, he was happy (sort of) when he got the job when Lupin turned into a werewolf. I'm not sure why Dumbledore doesn't just let him teach it.
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NoVeil4Me - Dec 20, 2002 (#4 of 116)
Alianora, can you provide me anything at all from the books that shows SNAPE wants the job? There is student rumor that everyone knows he wants the job but where does the man himself ever show any interest in the job? If he was all fired up for the job, why would Lockhart have been the only one who applied for the job? Snape is a brilliant and capable Potions Master...why would he want to switch to DADA? There is absolutely nothing in the books, anywhere, that support Snape himself wanting the job.
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vdobbs - Dec 20, 2002 (#5 of 116)
When Lockhart got the job in the 2nd book, it is stated that Lockhart got the job because he's the only one who applied.
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dumblydore - Dec 20, 2002 (#6 of 116)
I agree with Denise P. While Snape would make a capable Dark Arts teacher, I don't think he wants anyone else to come NEAR his potions class. That's his baby.
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kimiraikkonen - Dec 20, 2002 (#7 of 116)
I get the feeling that Snape took Potions only as a substitute. I think Dumbledore wanted him around as his spy but he didn't want Snape to teach DADA because of his history as a Death Eater. Remember when Sirius said Snape knew more Dark Arts then all the seventh years when he entered Hogwarts? He would probably end up teaching them the Dark Arts instead of "the defence rubbish that we do," which is not what Dumbledore wants.
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phoenixeleven - Dec 20, 2002 (#8 of 116)
Seeing as how Snape is a former Death Eater and not dead, I'll bet none of the Death Eaters he was friends with caught on that he was a spy, which means he still has to keep up appearances. Basically, the man knows too much. If he taught Defense Against the Dark Arts, he could probably teach it very well, since he knows the inner workings of an organization of very evil wizards. But if any of his students caught on to that fact, for instance, Lucius Malfoy's son, the bad guys would be able to put two and two together and old Snape would be toast. There might be some truth to the rumor, Snape might want to teach DADA, especially if he knows that he could actually be an effective teacher, but for his safety's sake, I don't think he would.
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Sly Girl - Dec 20, 2002 (#9 of 116)
I think Snape is pretty happy as Potions "Master"- funny, everyone else is just a teacher but Snape is always referred to as "Master"...
I wouldn't take what Sirius says about Snape to be truth, anymore than what the students believe. Not only is Snape working against his own prejudices regarding Sirius, but Sirius is as well. The two disliked each other, and what Sirius may believe to be a mountain of knowledge about the Dark Arts may just have been Snape's know-it-all-ism at work. I picture Snape being very nerdy as a Hogwarts student and maybe he favored learning about Dark Arts.
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NoVeil4Me - Dec 20, 2002 (#10 of 116)
I am referring to Snape as a Master Potion maker since he is one of only a handful that can make the potion for werewolves.
It said Snape knew curses, not specifically Dark Arts, although he was clearly interested in DA.
From the Lexicon, here are some specifics on Snape...no where does it mention HE wants the DADA job
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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Sly Girl - Dec 21, 2002 (#11 of 116)
Actually, Denise, they refer to Snape as a MASTER in the books too. They do often refer to the different teachers as Prof so and so. Snape more often than not has the Master part after his title; I just noticed it and thought it was odd or significant. And this is way before the wolfsbane potion for Lupin.
Which brings up another point- why is that particular potion so hard to make?? Lupin makes a point of telling Harry that he's lucky to work with Snape because not many wizards are up to making the potion. SO what exactly goes into that thing? --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Molly Weasley - Dec 21, 2002 (#12 of 116)
If Snape got the DADA job in CoS, then who would be the potions teacher? Can you imagine Lockhart at that job? "And then you put in two cups of armadillo bile. I've done it countless times before (for full details see my published works). Then- oh, oops, it exploded. That can happen sometimes. Well, you guys can go up to the hospital wing while I go curl my hair. Next lesson, we learn how to make love potions. Signed copies of Magical Me to the best one!"
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W J - Dec 22, 2002 (#14 of 116)
Alianora, Snape was happy when he substituted for Lupin in DADA because he had the chance to criticize Lupin as a teacher and possibly expose him as a werewolf. He does not want the DADA job. It is only a student rumor and no other facts support it.
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zeuspro - Mar 2, 2003 (#15 of 116)
Mabe Snape does want the job, but Dumbledore won’t give it to him because there is no-one good enough to replace him as potions master. It happens in business: people miss promotions because there is nobody who could take over their old job and do it as well as they do.
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Istari Jones - Mar 2, 2003 (#17 of 116)
In CoS Hagrid reports Lockhart was the only one who applied for the DADA job. This statement tends to support the "student rumor" theory. If Snape wanted it badly enough, he could have at least applied for it. This would negate Harry's comment to Lupin that Snape would "do anything" to get the position. So, I believe he doesn't want as badly as some people believe he does.
But, zeuspro...that's a good question...would Snape concede his position as Potions Master to take the job? Would it be harder to find someone to take Snape's place than to get a new DADA teacher? I wonder, is the title “Potions Master” an advanced degree requiring additional education? Or is it an honorary title?
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Olivia Wood - Mar 2, 2003 (#18 of 116)
Or maybe it just sounds better.
I don't think there is much truth to the rumor, but it can't be just that Snape hated Quirrel, Lockhart, Lupin and Moody, since I think it was common knowledge he wanted the job back in first year, and I don't think just not liking the current teacher makes people assume automatically you want their position. So unless he just happened to hate the previous DADA teachers too, then there has to be more to it then that. I'd like to think it has something to do with his being a vampire, but so far I see no possible connections. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carina - Mar 2, 2003 (#19 of 116)
I disagree, Olivia. I think it CAN be that Snape just hates the DADA teachers. • Quirrel was a traitor, • Lockhart was a fraud, • Lupin was a childhood nemisis and • Moody knew his dark, Death Eater secret.
It may have been common knowledge among the STUDENTS way back in Harry's first year, but that doesn't mean it was anymore true then as it is now.
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Sly Girl - Mar 2, 2003 (#20 of 116)
How long had Quirrel had the DADA job prior to Harry Potter coming to Hogwarts?
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Gina R Snape - Mar 2, 2003 (#21 of 116)
I honestly don't think DADA teacher is necessarily a promotion over Potions Master. And, I don't think Snape can be promoted anymore anyway. I think he is 3rd in line after McGonogall and Dumbledore himself. Clearly the 3 of them work closest of all. I think Snape just wants someone good teaching the class. It is a very important part of their education. Snape is shocked and appalled when he replaces Lupin to learn how far behind the children are. And I don't think he's necessarily blaming that on Lupin. Even if he is underhandedly trying to get them to figure out that Lupin is a werewolf.
And Oliva, I admire your ability to sneak in references to Snape being a vampire into every Snape discussion. I don't agree, but I'm finding it very funny! :-)
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W J - Mar 2, 2003 (#22 of 116)
Hagrid said that Quirrel was the DADA teacher for a while and then took a year off to get some first hand experience. Hagrid said he was changed when he came back. Nervous. So Quirrell was there for more than one year.
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shepherdess - Mar 2, 2003 (#23 of 116)
Istari, How can the title "Potions Master" be an "advanced degree requiring additional education"? I've been told there are no wizard universities, and apprenticeships don't give "advanced degrees". How Snape became a potions MASTER and Pomfrey became a TRAINED nurse is apparently a mystery.
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#24 of 116)
Maybe Master is based on level of skill—we learn that the Wolfsbane potion that Lupin takes is extremely hard to make and not many wizards would be up to making it. Where he learned that other than Hogwarts is anyone's guess, but maybe how good you are at something leads to your "title"
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Istari Jones - Mar 3, 2003 (#25 of 116)
That's why I was questioning it. There has been no mention of other schools of learning also, but maybe JKR just hasn't mentioned them yet.
I find it hard to believe that furthering knowledge in some areas of expertise are left entirely up to the individual. I can't see someone graduating Hogwarts and being automatically proficient enough to become a nurse as Madame Pomfrey without having furthered her education in that specialty. While I admit the term "advanced degrees" was probably a poor choice of words, it was the only frame of reference I could come up with at the time I was typing. Perhaps there are mentorships to which wizards can apply?
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Prefect Marcus - Mar 3, 2003 (#26 of 116)
The Wizard world appears to have a system of mentoring set up. It could be a formal apprentice-journeyman-master arrangement, or they might just be assistants. Hagrid was assistant Gameskeeper for a while. Harry (after blowing up Aunt Marge) was thinking he might be the same.
There is also the ambiguity of the way the word "Master" is used. If I recall, the only time we see it is when Lockhart is offering to brew up a mandrake potion and Snape coldly interrupts him saying, "Excuse me, but I thought I was the potions master at this school." In all other cases that I remember, (and I certainly could be wrong here) Snape is referred to as "potions teacher" or "potions professor."
The use of the word "master" could mean a formal grade of skill, or it could mean that he is the head of the Potions Department, or that he was the potions teacher. Snape certainly would not hesitate to use the more prestigious title to put Lockhart in his place.
Is there any other use of the word "Master" referring to teachers in the books?
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Serena McD - Mar 3, 2003 (#27 of 116)
Reading Prefect Marcus' post is also interesting, it seems that Snape is suggesting that he is going to brew the Mandrake potion to unfreeze the victims of the basilisk. I thought Madame Pomfrey was mentioned as brewing it, though I can't find that reference anywhere right now.
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#28 of 116)
There's a whole chapter in SS called 'The Potions Master." In chapter 1 of CoS it says how Harry misses everything and everyone at Hogwarts except “Snape, the Potions master.” Almost every time Snape is mentioned he is described as the “Potions master.” I find it interesting that the 'master' isn't capitalized, I would think is should be if it were a formal title. I see 'Potions master' as just meaning he is the head of the department, even if he is the only one in it. JKR could just be referring to Snape as a Potions master instead of Potions teacher because
1) it sound better, more mysterious and spooky and all (you can't tell me it doesn't sound better),
2) It sets Snape apart from the other teachers,
3) It implies a mastery of his own subject, which we can be sure is pretty accurate, and
3) It sets up the “art of potion-making” as something of a specialization. I see Charms and Transfigurations as the 'mundane' Language Arts and Geographies and Algebras of the Wizarding World. Potions would be something more specific, like say Italian or Latin or Chemistry or Advanced Mathematics—something you don't actually use that often, but is really interesting and requires a lot of talent and skill to learn. I get the impression that just about any trained wizard can teach Charms or Transfiguration more or less effectively (not to say Minerva isn't good at what she does), but it takes a real “master” to teach Potions.
I understand that Snape is justified in hating all the DADA teachers on an individual basis. What I was getting at is that Snape was supposedly after the DADA job all the way back in SS, before Lupin, Lockhart, and Moody, and supposedly before Quirrel turned Evil. So I don't see what the basis of this rumor could be, someone wouldn't just come up with it at random. Can anyone remember when it was first mentioned?
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#29 of 116)
From Percy to Harry- SS/PS when Harry asks who is that man sitting next to Professor Quirrell because his scar is hurting and he (as well as we, the readers) thinks it's because Snape is staring at him- and Percy answers-
"Oh, you know Professor Quirrell already, do you? No wonder he's looking so nervous, that's Professor Snape. He teaches Potions but doesn't want to- everyone knows he's after Quirrell's job. Knows an awful lot about the Dark Arts, Snape."
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Gina R Snape - Mar 3, 2003 (#30 of 116)
I've seen mentioned somewhere else that not only does Snape not want to be the DADA teacher, but he may not even want to be the Potions teacher. Maybe he's at Hogwarts for safety and political reasons. Otherwise, why would someone so gifted at potions and clearly frustrated with most children want to teach rudimentary skills?
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#31 of 116)
Would just knowing a lot about the Dark Arts justify a rumor that you want the Defense Against the Dark Arts Job? Why didn't any of the previous teachers last long? Is the job really jinxed, and if so by whom? Why wouldn't Snape want to teach Potions? How reliable a source of information is Percy?
The new DADA teacher's going to be female; do you think Snape'll hate her too? Is it more likely for the new teacher to be someone Snape will hate? If so, Rita Skeeter sounds fitting... Although I suppose Snape could find it within himself to hate just about anyone...
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Sly Girl - Mar 3, 2003 (#32 of 116)
I think the students assume Snape is unhappy because he is acts unhappy. Maybe it's tough love, maybe it's a facade, who knows. But I can understand how the students would assume Snape wants the Dark Arts position. But I would say Snape does his job very well and doesn't seem to want to leave it.
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Olivia Wood - Mar 3, 2003 (#33 of 116)
He'd still be teaching the same students if he was DADA professor, so that can't have anything to do with it...
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umbrella - Mar 3, 2003 (#34 of 116)
Just a thought on the "master" thing: I thought that was just another term for teacher or professor. Of course, I don't know much about British boarding schools. But, just as Dumbledore is headmaster, the teachers would be "masters." Maybe he was saying it as *a* master of the school.
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W J - Mar 3, 2003 (#35 of 116)
The British education system is different from what we are used to in America. For example, I think nurses live in dorms next to hospitals and must start at the bottom and master each skill at that level before they are moved to the next level up.
It is not the same as going to college in the U.S. to become a Registered Nurse. I have a friend who was head nurse in a maternity ward at a large London hospital for almost a decade. She married someone from the U.S. and came here to live. In the U.S., they do not accept her credentials to be a nurse, but Canada will. To become a Registered Nurse in the U.S., she would have to go to nursing college even though she was considered a master level nurse in the U.K..
JKR may have similar ideas about mastering skill levels in different fields of study. I think in "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them," the author says he became an expert in the field because he was asked to write a book on the subject and had to research it. It would seem that post-Hogwarts students must pursue their own education through research and perhaps mentorship from established masters in their field of study.
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Istari Jones - Mar 4, 2003 (#38 of 116)
That was exactly the point I was trying to make in post #17. One cannot just graduate Hogwarts and be immediately proficient in a chosen profession. Not only would the new graduate lack the complete body of knowledge needed for a specialty, but the maturity and experience needed to make rational judgments would also be lacking. (Because of this, the idea Fleur Delacour becoming the next DADA teacher to me is totally ridiculous.)
While no mention has been made about the availability of wizarding universities, it could be there has been no reason to mention then in the series yet. But, in keeping with the medieval atmosphere of the JKR's wizarding world, they actually may not exist.
Madame Pomfrey may be a nurse, but her methods demonstrate diagnosing medical problems and conditions AND prescribing medications and treatment for those issues. Again, this may be in keeping with the medieval setting of the wizarding world. I do not know how it is in the UK, but as an RN myself with a BSN, and certification in my specialty field, I do not have the ability to diagnose and prescribe here in the US. That is done by the physicians and to a limited extent by nurses with advanced practice degrees (nurse practitioners).
Yet to be a Potions Master…that could come with personal research and proficiency, &/or mentorship &/or could be an Honorific bestowed upon someone demonstrating proficiency in a chosen field.
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Lenka - Mar 13, 2003 (#39 of 116) I think it said in PoA that the NEWTs were the highest qualification Hogwarts offered. Therefore, there must be schools that offer a higher one. Or JK would just say "the highest qualifications possible".
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Meg L. - Mar 13, 2003 (#40 of 116)
Ellen, I do not want to sound rude at all, but I think that your idea comes down to semantics. I have a feeling that JKR just wrote the sentence and didn’t purposefully phrase it vaguely to let us analyze it. I agree with Istari that wizards have to go through some kind of apprenticeship in order to get their "higher education." It makes sense, considering the rest of the way that wizarding society works.
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NoVeil4Me - Mar 14, 2003 (#42 of 116) I believe JKR said in one of the Scholastic interviews that there is *no* wizarding universities. I would have to go look on the Lexicon for the specific interview but she was clear on it.
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Hedwig - Mar 17, 2003 (#43 of 116)
Maybe Dumbledore won't let Snape become the DADA teacher. If Snape knew Dumbledore wouldn't hire him, he might just not have applied to begin with. Maybe Dumbledore doesn't want him teaching it because of his background as a Death Eater. I know Dumbledore completely trusts him now, but maybe he is afraid Snape will unconsciously teach things he's not supposed to.
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Denise S. - Mar 17, 2003 (#44 of 116)
I think it's more a matter of politics like. I figure Dumbledore has picked up a lot of flack for hiring a former Death Eater, altho’ people put up with that. Yet, especially with VWII beginning, there would be a fair uproar if he put this former Death Eater into the position of DADA teacher. Dumbledore is not one concerned over what other people think, but considering that Snape is already good at potions and there's already a lot on his plate, I think he knows which battles are better to fight than others.
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PaulPatil - Mar 23, 2003 (#45 of 116)
I think the rumor that Snape wants the DADA position is simply another red herring set up by JKR to paint him in a suspicious light. Thinking back to the first time I read SS, I was sure Snape was up to something unsavory! The rumor gave reason for the animosity between Snape and Quirrel. On re-reading, we know what happens and may lose sight of the rumor's original purpose. It continues throughout the next books with no substantial evidence to support it—as always the case with student rumors.
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Sly Girl - Mar 23, 2003 (#46 of 116)
What I want to know is how and why and WHEN did Snape start to suspect Quirrel? Did Dumbledore clue him in? Did Snape start picking up on changes in Quirrel? Did his dark mark start to itch? It's never really explained in the book. Quirrel just says, Snape already suspected me.
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Gina R Snape - Mar 24, 2003 (#48 of 116)
I think Snape started to suspect Quirrell the first time Harry's scar hurts in the Great Hall. He puts it together as only Snape can. Then his suspicion was furthered on Halloween with the troll incident.
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Marie E. - Mar 24, 2003 (#49 of 116)
I wonder if Snape already knew that Quirrell was good with trolls. Wasn't the troll Quirrell's contribution to the protection of the stone? If Snape knew already, he would have easily put 2 and 2 together at the Halloween party.
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Kathy Lynch - Mar 25, 2003 (#51 of 116)
HUH? A cool sense of logic? SNAPE? Are you forgetting the scene in the Shrieking Shack when he refused to listen to reason because of his own prejudices? Or the time he almost became dinner for Fluffy because he acted so rashly to head off Quirrell? I mean, maybe the guy has some deductive reasoning skills, but he is much too hot-headed for me too agree that he's LOGICAL.
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Nine - Mar 25, 2003 (#52 of 116)
It wasn't rash, but necessary, to head off Quirrel. And I personally say we can't assume anything about any of the characters from that scene in PoA. We were seeing the worst in more than just Snape.
However, Snape didn't know that Harry's scar hurt in that scene in PS/SS.
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Tangent - Apr 12, 2003 (#77 of 116)
Snape supposedly wanting the DADA position could just be something *students* came up with to account for his hating Quirrel...
Scenario: Quirrel comes back, acting oddly. Snape suspects or deduces something, starts being very unfriendly towards him, possibly trying to find out what *exactly* is going on. Students notice, of course:
"Did you see that? Snape must really hate Professor Quirrel."
"I bet he's jealous, and after Quirrel's job!"
Thus is the rumor born. Resentment towards Snape for being sort of nasty and cruel adds weight to this; students on the receiving end of this will be willing to believe anything bad about him.
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Rotchell - Apr 15, 2003 (#81 of 116)
If Snape does want the D.A.D.A. job, then why didn't he take it in HRH's second year instead of Lockhart? Lockhart was only offered the job as a last resort. Personally I can't imagine that decent potion professors are that hard to find, which leaves us with either Snape doesn't actually want the job, or Dumbledore won't let him have it. Personally I think it's the latter, and there's more history to come that will explain all of this.
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Renea - May 12, 2003 (#82 of 116)
Maybe “Why does Dumbledore not allow Snape to be the DADA teacher?” is a better question.
My theory is he knew Harry would need to be well versed in this class. He has learned something different from every teacher. Lupin was more practical, hands on. Quirrell seems to me to be more from the book type of teacher and everyone loved Moody because he knew so much. Lockhart is the only questionable choice but I believe Dumbledore chose him for the same reason Harry has to stay at the Dursleys—a lesson to not let fame go to his head.
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timrew - May 12, 2003 (#83 of 116)
I don't think Snape wants the position of DADA teacher so badly. I think it's just a rumour that's been spread amongst the students. I mean, Snape or Lockhart as DADA teacher...it's no contest. Or perhaps Dumbledore regards Snape as the best Potions teacher the school has ever had, and is reluctant to transfer him.
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Olivia Wood - May 15, 2003 (#86 of 116)
If Snape really does want the DADA job, why would everyone know about it? He seems like a pretty private person to me. It's nothing more than a baseless student rumor.
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Wednesday Weasley - May 19, 2003 (#90 of 116)
It's kind of interesting that the "everyone knows [Snape's] after Quirrell's job" comment comes from Percy, since Percy seems to know so much about what's going on at Hogwarts.
JKR said in the CoS DVD interview that Hermione and Dumbledore were the best characters for setting up background information, since Dumbledore knows just about everything, and Hermione is reliable since she reads so much. But it wouldn't really work to have Dumbledore or Hermione provide the info about Snape & DADA during the first book, so maybe Percy was the next best thing, being kind of authoritative and older?
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Wednesday Weasley - May 21, 2003 (#96 of 116)
Snape and DADA. I'm a little bit conflicted on this one. I don't know why JKR would have Percy saying that Snape wanted Quirrell's job if this were patently untrue... on the other hand, Snape doesn't seem to have actively gone after the job.
Maybe Snape's just been too preoccupied since Harry came to Hogwarts to bother with going after the DADA job?
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Jackie !Fast - May 21, 2003 (#97 of 116)
Perhaps the DADA job is jinxed because Voldemort or one of his supporters is trying to prevent Harry from getting a good Dark Arts education. In the few years prior to Harry's entrance at Hogwarts, Quirrel had been the teacher, and then he left to get some first-hand experience. It's possible that the actual jinx didn't come into play until Harry's first year. Snape would do too good of a job teaching, so no matter how much he wants the job, magical forces are preventing him from trying.
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Sly Girl - May 21, 2003 9:56 pm (#98 of 116) I don't know though, Harry going up against the Dark Lord (in one form or another) each year is pretty much hands on Dark Arts experience, you know? I'd say that if that is the plan, then it's failing
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Nine - May 22, 2003 (#99 of 116)
…And Harry is directly or indirectly responsible for each DADA teacher that left, except Moody/Crouch, who would have left anyway. I don't think Moldy Voldie had any opportunity to cast such a jinx on the position.
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Gina R Snape - May 22, 2003 (#100 of 116)
I don't know, Nine. Something tells me Lockhart would've been leaving even without the memory charm.
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timrew - Jun 15, 2003 (#108 of 116)
Okay, there's only a week to go before we discover who the new DADA teacher is going to be, and I think we should be asking ourselves the question, 'Why has this rumour spread throughout the books that Snape REALLY wants the job for himself?'
It's obvious that he doesn't. I mean, in COS Gilderoy Lockhart gets the job before Snape? Come on!
He (Snape) may be an odious creep (for reasons that have yet to be made apparent), but he comes across as a brilliant potions master. There has never been a scene in the books where he is desperate to become the DADA teacher, so why has this rumour spread about him?
I have no idea - unless he becomes it in book Six. We already know that he doesn't get it in book Five - it's a female.
Does Snape really want this job? I think we should be told.
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Carina - Jun 16, 2003 (#110 of 116)
I think it's a red herring. We're told this in book one, when we're supposed to assume Snape is the bad guy, and it's re-iterated in book three when we're still not sure about his loyalties. Even now, there's still that inkling of doubt: is he, isn't he. I think JKR is just trying to keep us on our toes. :-D
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Marie E. - Jun 17, 2003 (#112 of 116)
I always thought the kids were misunderstanding Snape's great knowledge of Dark Arty stuff as a wish to be teaching the class.
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azi - Jun 18, 2003 (#113 of 116)
Snape doesn't exactly have the knowledge in everything to do with DADA though, does he? Either that or he was deliberately trying to mess Lupin's class up by saying the Kappa was found more commonly in whichever county it was. I would say Snape knows more about curses and dark potions than dark creatures. Teachers need to be good at everything in their subject really.
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timrew - Jun 18, 2003 (#114 of 116)
You might be right there, Marie E. I think rumours about Snape and the Dark Arts have been circling Hogwarts for years. Maybe not all the pupils know that he used to be a Death Eater - but there's no smoke without fire, as they say. The rumours about Snape wanting the DADA job could have come about by someone saying, "I heard Professor Snape knows all about the Dark Arts".
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Jackie !Fast - Jun 18, 2003 (#115 of 116)
Azi, I'd say it's more likely that he was trying to mess up Lupin's class. I mean, the guy knew more curses in first year than most sixth years, and as Moody says, you've got to know about Dark Arts to know defense. Since Snape knows a thing or twp about the Dart Arts, I'd say he could be a very knowledgeable DADA teacher. Which is why he just COULDN'T have applied before Harry's second year, because he would have gotten the job.
Unless the potions job is a lot harder to fill than DADA. If Snape was the DADA teacher, they'd have trouble finding a potions master.
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(A tangent April Fools adventure that, unlike the other April Fool’s posts, actually kinda fit in with its thread)
TOM MARVOLO RIDDLEY - Apr 1, 2003 (#64 of 116)
YO PIENSO QUE SNAPE QUIERE EL PUESTO PORQUE QUIERE SEGUIR APARENTANDEO SER PERVERSO, PERO NO ES ASI YA QUE EL SALVA LA VIDA DE HARRY EN SS, Y ADEMAS DEBE APARENTAR QUE ES PERVERSO PARA DEMOSTRAR QUE NUNCA AVANDONO A VOLDEMORT
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Meg L. - Apr 1, 2003 (#66 of 116)
Um, anyone speak Spanish?
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NoVeil4Me - Apr 1, 2003 (#67 of 116)
Hmm, this is what I got when I plugged it into a translator
I THINK THAT SNAPE WANTS The POSITION BECAUSE IT WANTS TO FOLLOW APARENTANDEO TO BE PERVERSE, BUT IS NOT ASI SINCE SAFE The LIFE DE HARRY IN SS, And ADEMAS MUST PRETEND THAT SHE IS PERVERSE TO NEVER DEMONSTRATE THAT AVANDONO To VOLDEMORT
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W J - Apr 1, 2003 (#68 of 116) TOM MARVOLO RIDDLEY
#1 - Please do not shout. All capital letters equals shouting on the internet. It might be helpful for you to read the "Philosophy of this Forum" thread.
#2 - Please speak English.
Thank you.
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Sly Girl - Apr 1, 2003 (#69 of 116)
Oh come on guys, can't you recognize Alfonso Cuaron when you see him.
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Carina - Apr 1, 2003 (#70 of 116)
Loosly translated (my Spanish is not the best), I believe Tom is saying:
I believe that Snape wants the job because he wants to continue pretending to be evil, but this is not really so since he saved Harry's life in SS and now he needs to pretend that he is evil to show he never abandoned Voldemort.
TOM, Hable por favor inglés. Nosotros no lo entendemos cuando usted habla el español.
Don't be too impressed. I got the Spanish to Tom from a translator site.
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Denise S. - Apr 2, 2003 (#73 of 116)
(Shh, Carina, you were impressing people!)
It's probably an April Fool's thing someone did, I don't think it was a regular post.
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Nine - Apr 4, 2003 (#74 of 116)
That's probable, Denise, since I don't think Tom Marvolo Riddle was Voldie's other name in the Spanish version of the books.
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Marè - Apr 4, 2003 (#75 of 116)
And because the person seemed to be able to read English quite perfectly. He did post to the right thread.
Why do I have the feeling someone is laughing at us right now....
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