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Other students of Hogwarts

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Other students of Hogwarts Empty Other students of Hogwarts

Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:42 am

Other students of Hogwarts

This topic serves as an archive of a thread from the Harry Potter Lexicon Forum as hosted on World Crossing which ceased operation on April 15, 2011.- Elanor

El Cronista de Salem - Sep 18, 2004 10:51 am
Edited by Kip Carter Nov 17, 2005 2:20 am
In this discussion we can speak about the secundary students of Hogwarts.

*******
In Harry's year, there is a boy called Stebbins (I don't know if he is Ravenclaw or Hufflepuff).

Curiusly, in the Marauder's year there was other Stebbins, but we don't know if witch or wizard.

Maybe they are related? It time to keep an eye in the Stebbins guy?



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Last edited by Elanor on Sat May 07, 2011 10:52 am; edited 2 times in total
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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:49 am

Czarina II - Sep 18, 2004 10:44 am (#1 of 270)
There's a Stebbins in Harry's year? Where did you find that?

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Matilda the Pygmy Puff - Sep 18, 2004 11:42 am (#2 of 270)

No day but Today
I don't see it anywhere in the sorting chapter of SS. Where did you find it?

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 18, 2004 12:01 pm (#3 of 270)

You can find it in [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] in the list of witches and wizards. You will find the Stebbins of Harry's year. I don't know where him appeared... But if the lexicon has, I believe them!

The Stebbins of the Marauder's year appears, of course, in OP28, in the memory of Snape. Stebbins was doing the OWL of DADA too.

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S.E. Jones - Sep 18, 2004 2:38 pm (#4 of 270)

Let it snow!
We don't know that Stebbins is in Harry's year. He's listed, as is the girl called Fawcett, as being present for the Dueling Club and is at the Yule Ball. That means that he and Fawcett can't be below Harry's year, unless one of them is a higher classman who took the other, but that doesn't mean they are in Harry's year. I'm sure there were mutliple years gathered for the Dueling Club, as it was open to the entire school. He could be just one year above Harry, explaining why we don't hear his, or Fawcett's, name during the Sorting in PS.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 18, 2004 3:19 pm (#5 of 270)

Ok, baybe Stebbins is not of Harry's year (very good report) but he can be related with the other stebbins, whatever his year is Wink

Maybe he is only a secundary character, and Jo has repeated his name by error. Or maybe he is a secundary family (who knows).

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Classicsquid592 - Sep 18, 2004 5:57 pm (#6 of 270)

Perhaps JKR wanted to do more with Stebbins in the series, but realized the family didn't fit as well as she would have hoped and had to cut them leaving the name but not the backstory. However, I would assume that a vast majority of the Hogwarts students share surnames with their parents. And a number of pure-blood families even share first names (the Crabbs and the Goyles).

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Neville Longbottom - Sep 19, 2004 4:58 pm (#7 of 270)


And a number of pure-blood families even share first names (the Crabbs and the Goyles).

Is this an assumption or is this officially confirmed?

Bye the way, I think Mr Stebbins is a Hufflepuff. Didn't Snape dock points from Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw, when he caught Stebbins and Fawcett kissing? And I'm sure Miss Fawcett is a Ravenclaw. Dumbledore mentions this when she wanted to throw her name in the Goblet.

I don't think Stebbins surname is a mistake. I guess JKR developed several wizard families. The question is how much of them will make big appereances.

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 3:43 am (#8 of 270)

Back in business
About Fawcett :

‘Dear, dear,’ said Lockhart, skittering through the crowd, looking at the aftermath of the duels. ‘Up you get Macmillan … careful there, Miss Fawcett … pinch it hard, it’ll stop bleeding in a second, Boot … (UK CoS p.144)

'Do you know whether we're waiting for any more, Amos?'
'No, the Lovegoods have been there for a week already and the Fawcetts couldn't get tickets,' said Diggory. 'There aren't any more of us in this area, are there?'
'Not that I know of,' said Mr Weasley. (UK GoF p.69)

'I suggest you both go up to Madam Pomfrey. She is already tending to Miss Fawcett, of Ravenclaw, and Mr Summers, of Hufflepuff, both of whom decided to age themselves up a little, too. Though I must say, neither of their beards is anything like as fine as yours.' (UK GoF p.229)

‘Ten points from Hufflepuff Fawcett!’ Snape snarled, as a girl ran past him. ‘And ten points from Ravenclaw, too, Stebbins!’ as a boy went rushing after her. (UK GoF ch.23 p.371)

I think there are two Fawcett girls, one from Hufflepuff and one from Ravenclaw. The Hufflepuff being older than the Ravenclaw. I also believe the Fawcett family will have more screen time, we met the Diggories in GoF, the Lovegoods in OoP, the Fawcett is the only family around Ottery St Catchpole we don't know of yet.

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Jessalynn Quirky - Sep 22, 2004 5:27 am (#9 of 270)

That's a good point....I hadn't realized the Lovegoods were mentioned before Book 5 and I've re-read the Goblet several times.

goes off to insult Gilderoy in the Lockhart thread....*

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Kasse - Sep 22, 2004 9:10 am (#10 of 270)

Question: Lavender Brown is muggle born or halfblood? I as because in POA in Divination it was only her, Harry and Dean who did not know what a Grim was. Later in the same chaper Ron says that all wizards fear the grim.

We know Dean is half blood, as is Harry, I was curious as to why Lavender did not know what the grim was.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 9:39 am (#11 of 270)

Good point, Kasse... Maybe she is. It sounds very probable.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 9:56 am (#12 of 270)

About THEODORE NOTT: ====================

JKRowling.com says:

"Raised by a very elderly widower and Death Eater father"

But I have revised the spanish version, and it says:

"Criada por una anciana viuda y un padre mortífago" --> "Raised by a widower OLD WOMAN and a Death Eater father".

It says clearly to different persons, and one of them is a woman! What do you think?

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Matilda the Pygmy Puff - Sep 22, 2004 9:59 am (#13 of 270)

No day but Today
Well, El Cronista, widower typically refers to a man, so maybe there is a problem in the translation.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 10:01 am (#14 of 270)

Really? In my english dictionary, widower is for men and women! :-S

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Matilda the Pygmy Puff - Sep 22, 2004 10:05 am (#15 of 270)

No day but Today
Is it a British English dictionary or an American English dictionary? As far as I know we have always used widower for men and widow for women.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 10:06 am (#16 of 270)

British dictionary. As Jo.

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Matilda the Pygmy Puff - Sep 22, 2004 10:10 am (#17 of 270)

No day but Today
Ah. Well, I'm American so that might be the difference.

But to be back on topic.....If Theordore was raised by a single parent who was a DE, I'm not so sure if he could be "the good Slytherin".

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 10:37 am (#18 of 270)

Hmm... i correct! the dictionary differences between masculine and femenine. it was my error. depend if you are in the spanish pages or the english, it says one thing or other. it should be a translation mistake! Sad

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 11:37 am (#19 of 270)

Back in business
Lavander Brown, I think she's at least half-blood, because she doesn't strike me as the kind of 15 years old girl that subscribe to a newspaper (I don't know any 15 years old, boy or girl that subscribe to any newspaper). She did read the Daily Prophet over summer or she wouldn't mistrust Harry. There was just a article by Rita Steeker before they left Hogwarts, that wouldn't be enough. In PoA, she received a letter from home, I never heard of any muggle letter that make it to Hogwarts, all the mail Harry received from the Dursley came via Hedwig. That rules out the possibility of being muggle-born in my mind.

Now, Theo. Jo wrote : "Raised by a very elderly widower and Death Eater father". Are the widower and the DE two different persons or the same individual? A very elderly widower and Death Eater father, there's no article before Death Eater, wouldn't that means the father is Death Eater and very elderly widower? Wouldn't the correct way to phrase the sentence be a very elderly widower and a Death Eater father?

The different versions of Jo's website go like this :
English : "Raised by a very elderly widower and Death Eater father"
French : "Raised by a very old father, widower and Death Eater"
Italian : "Raised by a very old father, widower and Death Eater"
Spanish : "Raised by an very old widow and a Death Eater father"
Japanese : "Raised by a very old widower and Death Eater father"

Can anyone translate the German version? I most admit I'm clueless with that language. Anyway, as far as I can read, the Spanish translation stand alone with the "two different people" take.

Edit : I just saw your answer El Cronista, hoping my post was not a total waste of parchment ... ¬_¬

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 11:43 am (#20 of 270)

the spanish translator should know less english than me. s/he translated "half-blood prince" as "mudblood prince".

I am going to edit all this info in my site. thanks a lot.

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 11:47 am (#21 of 270)

Back in business
Maybe you should complain and apply for the post yourself. ^_^

Edit : I wonder what Theo will do this summer, all by himself. He's a loner, but does he like to be that lonely ...

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 11:53 am (#22 of 270)

Theo is a really interesting character. does anyone wants to post a discussion exclusive for Theodore?

I have tought that maybe Theodore is the opposite of Barty Crouch Jr. He is totally different to his father. Maybe, as a clever boy, he thinks that it hasn't sense to kill the muggle-born.

It would desesperate "poor" Mr. Nott... :-p

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 11:59 am (#23 of 270)

Back in business
Theo already have a thread for himself, okay, he's sharing it with Blaise Zabini, but must of the thoughts about him are there, The Mystery Slytherin.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 12:19 pm (#24 of 270)

Ok... now all could have sense: Theodore Nott saw his mother dyieng, and for this reason he could be the Mysterius Slytherin. It 's correct?

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 12:27 pm (#25 of 270)

interesting the detail of Lavender.

About Theodore Nott: you should believe only in the english version, the original.
.......

I am wishing to know who are the two mysterius Gryffindor girls of Harry year. What explanation will give JKR?

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:49 am

Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 12:27 pm (#26 of 270)
Back in business
It could be, but that's for another thread. ^_^

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Kerstin - Sep 22, 2004 1:17 pm (#27 of 270)

Tomoe, maybe a bit late, but the German version says definitely that Theo's father is a DE.

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 1:30 pm (#28 of 270)

Back in business
Does it say that the Death Eater and the very old widower are the same person?

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Detail Seeker - Sep 22, 2004 1:59 pm (#29 of 270)

Quod tempus non sanat, sanat ferrum,... so prepare
Tomoé, in the german text it says: "..., der bei seinem recht betagten, verwitweten Vater, einem Todesser, aufwächst,..." which is very straightforward in stating, that his father is a widower as well as a Death Eater. Both adjectives ("betagt" meaning "elderly" and "verwitwet" meaning "being a widower") before the word "Vater", refer to this one as well as the apposition "..., einem Todesser,..." after it. On the other hand, it does not say, that Father Nott is "very old", only, that he is rather elderly"

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 2:12 pm (#30 of 270)

Back in business
Thanks Detail Seeker, so only the Spanish version state there's two adults in the Nott's house. A translation mistake, probably.

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El Cronista de Salem - Sep 22, 2004 2:30 pm (#31 of 270)

Yes, because there are not only two adults... one of them is a woman!

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Jessalynn Quirky - Sep 22, 2004 2:39 pm (#32 of 270)

That's very interesting.....where did you find this description? Is it in one of the books or an interview somewhere?

goes off to re-read all the interviews again*

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Tomoé - Sep 22, 2004 3:45 pm (#33 of 270)

Back in business
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] -> extra stuff (the cup) -> edits -> Malfoy and Nott -> second paragraph.

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Wendelin the Weird - Sep 25, 2004 4:25 am (#34 of 270)

burned at the stake 47 times and counting...
Ahhhh no idea where else to postie this, so here goes!

Has anyone else wondered if perhaps Fabian and Gideon Prewett were Molly's twin brothers? It would be fitting since she named Fred & George with the same letters and has such remorse after the Quidditch World Cup as though they might have died with her angry at them - could this parallel something that happened with equally precocious brothers? Twins run through the womans side of the family, I hear, although it usually skips a generation (but with all the baby-making they'd done it doesnt surprise me they had a set of twins *giggle*)

She also has that run-in with the boggart and is seeing dead family members right after Mad-Eye brings out the photo with Giddy and Fab in it... although she didnt know about the photo at the time. She says "I see them d-d-dead all the time!" about her family, probably because she lost cloe family members already - and I must say I find it interesting that she only sees the male members of the family dead and never Ginny.

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Wendelin the Weird - Sep 25, 2004 2:12 pm (#35 of 270)

burned at the stake 47 times and counting...
Ahhh woopsie! I just came across the Fred & George thread - it was hiding from me last night.

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rebecca dorgelo - Sep 28, 2004 5:18 pm (#36 of 270)

in regards to the earlier post suggesting that Theodore Nott couldn't be the 'good Slytherin' as he has a DE father, didn't Sirius have a whole DE family and he still turned out all right. There's nothing like a bit of son-father rebellion... he could be good just to spite his DE dad Smile

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Jessalynn Quirky - Sep 28, 2004 5:20 pm (#37 of 270)

Didn't JKR say on her website somewhere that she had a conversation between Draco and Theodore Nott? How I would love to see that! Maybe it is a reward on the site?

* excited, Jessalynn rushes to the JKR website thread *

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Paulus Maximus - Sep 29, 2004 7:52 am (#38 of 270)

"didn't Sirius have a whole DE family and he still turned out all right."

Only his brother was an actual DE; the rest of his family agreed with Voldie but did little else to fight for him. And Sirius went to Gryffindor (although I'm sure that, like Harry, he was considered for Slytherin), whereas Nott was a Slytherin.

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Czarina II - Sep 29, 2004 8:20 am (#39 of 270)

"The world is not divided into good people and Death Eaters." -- JKR, OoP

Theodore Nott may not be as far agone as Draco, while still preferring to shy away from Harry and the DA. Being put in Slytherin has more to do with having a selfish (not necessarily negatively) personality. The typical Slytherin probably prefers to be alone, think independently, follow the status quo (or whatever the more powerful are doing), and do what suits them. They would probably do what they wanted, when they wanted. The difference between them and Ravenclaw is that they tend to side with the more powerful, always trying to get ahead and be seen in a positive light. They always care about what others think of them, whereas Ravenclaws less so. They also value intelligence less than Ravenclaws. That is how I see Theodore Nott and the other Slytherins. Only Malfoy, Crabbe, Goyle, Pansy, and Millicent seem to have a direct vendetta against Harry. Pansy and Millicent might just be following the crowd, anyhow, and we can't even be too sure about Crabbe and Goyle. That is the problem with trusting Slytherins -- they tend to be shifty. Snape, anyone?

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Phoenix song - Sep 29, 2004 8:28 am (#40 of 270)

Dumbledore did not speak for a moment; he looked as though he was trying to make up his mind about something. At last he said, "I am sure. I trust Severus Snape completely." (HbP, p. 549)
Czarina II: I agree with your assessment of Ravenclaws and Slytherins. We need to be able to recognize that the qualities that the different houses value most aren't exclusive to their house alone. The difference may be in the extent that they are willing to use those traits and the importance that they place upon them. Ravenclaw and Slytherin can both be seen to have high value placed upon them for knowledge. Slytherin would seek to take this knowledge to become more powerful, talented, and combine this knowledge with their ambition to "get ahead". The Ravenclaw house seems to me to be more concerned with the academic side of life simply for the self-improvement of the knowledge itself. They may be more talented or more knowledgeable, but they lack the drive to use it to get ahead. I see them as more the quiet, introverted, academic type.

Barbie

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Nathan Zimmermann - Oct 13, 2004 7:54 pm (#41 of 270)

Phoenix Song I like the idewa of ravenclaws being interoverted it would certainly fit with Luna's character in a way.

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eggplant - Oct 17, 2004 10:30 pm (#42 of 270)

In book 2 Ernie MacMillan was one of the first to unjustly accuse Harry of attacking other students, although he later apologized. In book 5 Ernie MacMillan was one of the first to publicly say he believed Harry completely and even helped stop Malfoy, Crabbe, and Goyle from ambushing Harry on the train home. I like that, we all make mistakes but unlike many Ernie learns from them.

Eggplant

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Nathan Zimmermann - Oct 18, 2004 6:08 pm (#43 of 270)

Yes, I forsee a larger role for Ernie in books 6 and &.

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Solitaire - Oct 18, 2004 8:48 pm (#44 of 270)

Ernie, Justin, and Seamus have all apologized to Harry over the course of the series for doubting him.

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Czarina II - Oct 19, 2004 9:13 pm (#45 of 270)

In many literary works, those who initially doubt the sincerity of the hero end up becoming his or her most fervent defenders. I don't think Ernie, Justin, or Seamus will be turning evil on us.

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Solitaire - Oct 21, 2004 7:14 am (#46 of 270)

Nor do I. I believe they will all become important members of the DA, if it continues to exist in the same fashion. And I really do believe Dumbledore supports it, not just because of Umbridge, but because it is practical and it has provided a forum for Harry to work on leadership skills.

Solitaire

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Tomoé - Nov 4, 2004 2:02 am (#47 of 270)

Back in business
I'd like to take a look at the borrowers list in QtA.

O. Wood 9 April
B. Dunstar 16 May
M. Flint 22 June
C. Diggory 3 July
A. Johnson 19 July
E. Macmillan 12 August
T. Boot 21 August
S. Fawcett 16 September
K. Brundy 10 October
K. Bell 19 October
C. Warrington 13 November
J. Dorny 5 December
T. Nott 22 January
S. Capper 31 January
M. Bulstrode 6 February
F. Weasley 15 February
H. Granger 2 March
H. Potter 11 March

There's 18 names, four of them are yet to be named in the books (Dunstar, Bundy, Dorny and Capper), 8 of them are Quidditch players (Wood, Flint, Diggory, Johnson, Bell, Warrington, Weasley and Potter) and the six other are either in Harry's year or possibly in Harry's year (Macmillan, Boot, Fawcett, Nott, Bulstrode and Granger).

Interestingly, all the captains are within the 5 first positions, which would point that Dunstar was/is/will be captain at a time of the series. Then we have Macmillan, Boot and Fawcett, the three of them were close by in the Dueling club, the three of them injuried and Lockhart give them advices in the exactly same order. Then we have a new name, two Quidditch players, another new name, Theodore Nott, another new name yet, Millicent, Fred, Hermione and Harry.

If you remove the quidditch player and the unknown borrowers, you have : Macmillan, Boot, Fawcett, Nott, Bulstrode, Granger, three boys and three girls all from three different houses. You add Harry in the picture and get one boy of each house.

Any thought?

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Czarina II - Nov 29, 2004 7:56 pm (#48 of 270)

It's interesting that two of the students on that list were just names when QttA was released, but took a more prominent role in OoP: T. Boot and T. Nott. Terry Boot, we find out, is on the Ravenclaw team and then becomes a part of the DA. By the end of the book, he seems to have joined the Hufflepuff Quartet. Theodore Nott gets introduced by name, but we hardly get any information about him. His father is a Death Eater, he is thin, and we think he is in Slytherin. He might see thestrals, but we can't be certain. Certainly, Theodore should become more prominent in the books -- at least a line or two.

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El Cronista de Salem - Dec 4, 2004 6:08 am (#49 of 270)

Hello,

I am speaking with a friend about Lavender Brown.

She has said that the Browns should live in a farm, because a fox attacked Binky the Rabbit. But my question is:

-time ago, I read for the Forum that Lavender should be half-blood or muggle-born by a reason, BUT I don't remember that reason. The reason was published in the forum. can you say me which reason was it? I remember something about the Daily Prophet, but I am not sure.

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Quidam - Dec 4, 2004 8:46 pm (#50 of 270)

Czarina II, there is no mention of Terry Boot being on the Ravenclaw Quidditch team.

El Cronista de Salem, the reason for Lavender being muggle born could be that she didn't know what a Grim was in the first divination lesson. Everyone else in the class, except Harry and Dean, knew what it was.

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:51 am

librarian314 - Dec 7, 2004 2:26 pm (#51 of 270)
Hey all!
I just finished re-reading the series and something struck me as interesting.

In one of the books (I think OotP) Justin Finch-Fletchley says that he was down for Eton and that got me thinking (and researching). Eton is an expensive and prestigious private school (or public if you’re British) much frequented by royals. If Justin had attended he would have been a couple of years ahead of HRH Prince William.

Are the Finch-Fletchleys new or old money? Are they nobility? (Not that I think JFF is the HBP, though what a concept!)

This would seem to put him in a similar socio-economic level as the Malfoys. Perhaps, JFF is supposed to be Draco’s opposite in that JFF is the nice, open-minded, rich aristocrat.

Just something that made me go, “Hmmm…”

*michelle the librarian**

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Solitaire - Dec 8, 2004 8:54 pm (#52 of 270)

I thought Justin was a Muggle-born. Wouldn't one of his parents or grandparents have to be a Wizard or Witch for him to be a HBP candidate? Just wondering ... It would be an interesting idea, though.

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librarian314 - Dec 9, 2004 9:01 am (#53 of 270)

Hey all!

Justin speaks of going to Eton with such confidence that it made me feel as though his family had both the money and correct social connections that his going was assured. Knowing that Eton is one of the most prestigious schools in all of England, if not the world (I can't think of an American private school with a similar cachet) and that it is a favorite with the royals of England (and elsewhere), just made me think that of all of the current students that we know anything about, JFF was the only one that came close to being of the right social strata to be a "prince".

The half-blood bit though does through a spanner into works. He's definitely Muggle-born. It'll be interesting to see how it works out.

I just found it interesting that Justin, of Hufflepuff, may not only be an equal to but possibly outrank the Malfoys socio-economically. Justin's background definitely makes it possible that he is of noble birth. We know the Malfoys are rich, but are they titled? Probably not, as that is something we would have heard about before now. (If Lucius Malfoy was entitled to use an honorific, would he really let people get away with calling him Mr. Malfoy. >-))

Anyway, it was just something that caught my eye on my most recent read through.

*michelle the librarian**

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Steve Newton - Dec 9, 2004 11:21 am (#54 of 270)

Librarian
MTL, well reasoned with good evidence. We don't usually allow this on the forum.

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librarian314 - Dec 10, 2004 8:08 am (#55 of 270)

Thanks Steve!

You made me laugh out loud!

*michelle the librarian**

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Quidam - Dec 12, 2004 11:12 pm (#56 of 270)

I'd like to know why so many people want to know more about Blaise Zabini. I've never read a post saying "I'd like to find out more about Mandy Brocklehurst or Lisa Turpin (or any other character who hasn't been mentioned since the first book)" so what is the big deal with Zabini?

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Steve Newton - Dec 13, 2004 7:42 am (#57 of 270)

Librarian
Good question, Q. I think that curiosity was aroused early since people could not figure out if Blaise was a boy's or girl's name. Knowing how JKR plants clues folks seemed to think that this was one. Just my opinion.

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Eponine - Dec 13, 2004 12:30 pm (#58 of 270)

I think another reason people wanted to know about Blaise was because of the mystery Slytherin in the thestral scene. A lot of people thought it could be Blaise and were wondering about him because of that.

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Elanor - Dec 13, 2004 1:17 pm (#59 of 270)

Blaise is not a very common name in French but it does exist. In fact, the only Blaise I ever heard about are two very famous writers, both of them were men. The most famous one is Blaise Pascal, the scientist, who lived in the 17th century and was one of the brightest minds of his time. The other one is Blaise Cendrars, a famous writer and poet who died in 1961 who was another great mind. Could this mean that Blaise Zabini could be THE Slytherin with a brain which works?

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wwtMask - Dec 13, 2004 2:17 pm (#60 of 270)

A few remarks on Blaise's name (thanks to google!):

From the Latin word for lisp (blasius), can also mean one who stammers or stutters. There is a saint named Blaise who was a doctor/healer and is the patron saint of throat ailments and colds. St. Blaise's feast day is February 3rd. I have no clue what Zabini means. This all may have been mentioned at one time, but it doesn't hurt to refresh the memory Very Happy

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Tomoé - Dec 14, 2004 3:53 pm (#61 of 270)

Back in business
Quidam -> I've never read a post saying "I'd like to find out more about Mandy Brocklehurst or Lisa Turpin (or any other character who hasn't been mentioned since the first book)" so what is the big deal with Zabini?

1) I like the way his name sounds. (pretty silly, but I can't deny it)
2) He still the only Slytherin boy in Harry's year whose parents aren't know as DE (that can still change).
3) We never heard of him since PS though Harry have been with him for 5 years in Potions and maybe in CoMC. Maybe there's something more about him.
4) There are already 4 pure-blood Slytherin boys in Harry's year, the odds are good to make him half-blood.
5) He doesn't hang around with MCG that much as they are see alone in most of the time.
6) Jo said we'll see more of him.

Now, why not Mandy Brocklehurst or Lisa Turpin? Because we don't know enough of the Ravenclaw girls. There are Lisa Turpin, Mandy Brocklehurst, Morag McDougal, Padma Patil and Su Li. The only one we know a little of is Padma Patil and we don't know much.
The only other students I feel the same kind of interest based only on name and house is a Hufflepuff girl named Megan Jones, because there's a Order member named Hestia Jones. She's not even named in the books, only on the movie list and Jo's notebook.

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Ronan - Dec 16, 2004 8:57 am (#62 of 270)

What exactly is the movie list? Where can I see it? People talk about it all the time and I feel a bit disconnected Wink

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Tomoé - Dec 16, 2004 9:07 am (#63 of 270)

Back in business
I really don't know, Lexicon Steve have screen shots of it, it seems to match the screen shots of Jo's notebook, without the muggle-born/half-blood/pure-blood section. I asked once on the not covered on other threads thread but only Choices answered (or was it Kip?) to tell me he have no idea.

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Saralinda Again - Dec 17, 2004 4:53 pm (#64 of 270)

My Patronus is a Crumple-Horn Snorkack
If Blaise Zabini is the Half-Blood Prince, maybe I'll consistently remember his name. I keep calling him "Zamboni," and now I picture Voldie slippin' and a-slidin' while chasing this kid across the ice at a hockey rink.

(sigh)

Saralinda/Kayte

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Solitaire - Dec 17, 2004 7:23 pm (#65 of 270)

LOL Saralinda! I've called him Zamboni a few times, as well. I wondered why I always thought of ice skating when I thought of him! Now it makes sense!

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rambkowalczyk - Dec 20, 2004 8:35 am (#66 of 270)

My interest in Blaise Zabini is that I am looking for that elusive good slytherin.

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Essidji - Jan 4, 2005 7:05 am (#67 of 270)

To me, Blaise Zabini sounds like the name of a circus artist.

"Aaaand nooow, ladies ans gentlemen, Blaise and Bozo, the Zabini brothers!" Silly, no? :p

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Tomoé - Jan 12, 2005 1:19 pm (#68 of 270)

Back in business
‘Ten points from Hufflepuff Fawcett!’ Snape snarled, as a girl ran past him. ‘And ten points from Ravenclaw, too, Stebbins!’ as a boy went rushing after her. (UK GoF ch.23 p.371)

‘Quill down, please!’ squeaked Professor Flitwick. ‘That means you too Stebbins! Please remain seated while I collect your parchement! Accio!’ (UK OoP ch.38 p.566)

Even if the first quote refer to the 1990s Stebbins student and the second one to the 1970s Stebbins student, could the Stebbins family become important later?

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scoop2172000 - Jan 12, 2005 2:22 pm (#69 of 270)

Good catch, Tomoe. Take ten points.

It's interesting that the elder Stebbins was a classmate of MWPP (and Snape).

It wouldn't be the first time that Jo mentions in passing the name of someone who becomes key later on. The prime example that comes to mind is Sirius, mentioned only in passing by Hagrid in PS/SS (as having lent Hagrid the flying motorcycle.) As we all know, Sirius went on to be the title character in PoA.

Could the HBP be named Stebbins?

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Tomoé - Jan 12, 2005 7:34 pm (#70 of 270)

Back in business
Stebbins, the half-blood prince? There's certainly a possibility ...

Anyway, it seems both Stebbins are rule brakers.

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Choices - Jan 13, 2005 11:10 am (#71 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Yes, but we are properly introduced to "young Sirius Black".....we are told his first name and his age status - young. With Stebbins, we are not even told his first name, so I just don't see him becoming important. I think he's just a minor character - just one of the many students at Hogwarts.

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Tomoé - Jan 13, 2005 11:28 am (#72 of 270)

Back in business
Well, Theodore Nott was only "Nott" in PS, then he became "T. Nott" in FB and finally get a full name in OoP. It doesn't mean he won't be important because of it.

All we heard of the Lovegood in GoF was they were at the QWC for a week already, it didn't prevent Luna to became major in OoP.

We are introduced to a guy named Montague in PoA, a quidditch player from Slytherin, we don't know his frist name and we never expected to heard much of him beside the Quidditch pitch, but he make the occasion for Harry to peek into Snape's Pensieve.

Sure, even if she's mentionned twice, Mme Marsh is still nobody and Jo said it will stay that way, so I don't expect any of the Stebbins to become Harry's best friend or the Ministry of Magic, but one could become a major secondary character.

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Choices - Jan 13, 2005 11:31 am (#73 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
You're right Tomoe' - it's always a possibility.

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Tomoé - Jan 13, 2005 11:50 am (#74 of 270)

Back in business
Well, I didn't expect anything from Stebbins before I saw the OoP mention. A lot of people are mentioned only once and are never seen after (I'm thinking mainly of the sortings, but there other occasion as well). The Stebbins name is mentionned twice, and the 1990s Stebbins is mentioned around the Fawcett girl, this girl is mentionned twice around Ernie and Terry. We have known Ernie since CoS and Terry was mentioned here and there since the first book, so I'll say Stebbins's odds are good.

So he's one of my prime candidate to became DA member, at the very least.

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Eponine - Jan 21, 2005 9:44 am (#75 of 270)

I read an article about someone who dresses up the gargoyles in their front yard, and the headline shortened it to 'goyle'. I never realized that his name could be a play on gargoyle. It's fitting, I think.

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:52 am

Solitaire - Jan 21, 2005 2:10 pm (#76 of 270)
I agree, Eponine. I have frequently referred to Crabbe and Goyle as the gargoyles. I wonder if Millicent is related to them, since she seems rather like a female version of C&G.

Solitaire

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Bathilda - Jan 26, 2005 8:21 am (#77 of 270)

SAHM (of two wee ones)
Wormtail is said to be a mediocre wizard who worshiped James, Lupin and Sirius. (by McGonagal in the Three Broomsticks) I wonder if any parallel will be drawn with the obvious worship of Harry by Colin Creevey. We don't know what kind of wizard he is. We know that he's small. Very small. We also know that he is muggle born, and has a younger brother at Hogwarts. We also know that Harry treats him like crap. He's very impatient, and in a photo taken with Colin, his photographic self is seen trying to get away. Or was that photo taken with Lockhart? oops. well anyway, Colin drives Harry bonkers. Will Colin ever resent this? Resent it to the point of betrayal? The war has begun. I believe that in Book 6 sides will be taken. People will be acting under spells, and some will turn to the dark side for power. Who will it be? Colin has something in him, or he wouldn't be a Gryfindor.

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Choices - Jan 26, 2005 10:28 am (#78 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I think Colin will remain loyal to Harry. Harry may treat him like a pest, but I don't think Colin notices. He is much like any fanatic, he is so glad to be near his idol he doesn't even notice that Harry is irritated with being pestered and followed and photographed. He and Dennis are brave and adventurous and I think they will be loyal to Harry and fight for the good side.

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Weeny Owl - Jan 26, 2005 10:41 am (#79 of 270)

When Colin was in his first year, he was a pest, but I don't think Harry treated him that horridly because he did take the time to explain Quidditch, for example.

Harry worked with both Creeveys in the DA, so I doubt if he would have been any worse with them than he was with everyone that year.

Any character could choose the wrong side, but I don't see the Creeveys switching to Voldemort simply because of Harry.

Wormtail was actually part of the Marauders, and the Creeveys aren't part of Harry's core group, so there's a big difference in dynamics.

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Bathilda - Jan 26, 2005 11:50 am (#80 of 270)

SAHM (of two wee ones)
True enough about the Dynamics part, Weeney. I still think that the Creeveys are going to play into this more and more, and I'm just not sure they are going to be "loyal". I need to read up on their part in PoA. I haven't read it in awhile. (I read classics all Summer/Fall)

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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 26, 2005 12:03 pm (#81 of 270)

Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I think Colin and his brother both seemed far less pesty in OotP. They were in the DA, did there practice and probably feel quite happy with themselves. I imagine both of them getting excellant marks on their DADA exams.

Mikie

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Choices - Jan 26, 2005 6:31 pm (#82 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
"I read classics all Summer/Fall" - Ginerva

Well....I think HP is going to fall into that catagory, if it doesn't already. It's classic for me.


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Bathilda - Jan 27, 2005 8:36 am (#83 of 270)

SAHM (of two wee ones)
Well, I meant classics from that other "Canon"....you know, Moby Dick, War and Peace and the like. It's amazing what you can get away with not ever reading and still get an English degree. HP is classic in it's own right.

but anyway...maybe the Creevey's will grow out of their apparent dorkiness. I love the name Creevey though.

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Jak Frank - Jan 28, 2005 8:52 pm (#84 of 270)

Student
Panzy. Yeah, she is Slytherin to the core, but now that Malfoy and his thugs are obviously going to the evil side, I wonder if Panzy will do the same. Somehow I have a feeling that she is (while a... you know what) inherently good.

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Choices - Jan 29, 2005 10:09 am (#85 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
"but now that Malfoy and his thugs are obviously going to the evil side" - Jak

Funny, I thought they had been on the evil side from day one.

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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 29, 2005 12:27 pm (#86 of 270)

Avatar courtesy of Gwen
I agree Choices, Malfoy has always seemed to be on the wrong side from the tailor shop forward.

Mikie

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Jak Frank - Jan 29, 2005 7:18 pm (#87 of 270)

Student
Now there is a line, though. Before Malfoy was evil, but technically still on the "good" side. That isn't so anymore.

So, what do you think about Panzy?

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Choices - Jan 29, 2005 8:29 pm (#88 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Jak - When do you think Malfoy crossed the "line" from good to bad? Was there a particular event that caused you to no longer view him as good? Just curious.

Pansy? To be honest, I rarely ever think about Pansy. She is just a typical Slytherin girl who hangs around with Malfoy's gang.

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Solitaire - Jan 29, 2005 8:51 pm (#89 of 270)

I don't see Draco as having changed much at all. I think he is probably nastier, but I think he has been pretty awful the whole time. When Harry and Ron take the Polyjuice potion and impersonate Crabbe and Goyle, they get a taste of his nastiness firsthand.

Ron--as Crabbe--just about decks him more than once during the exchange and has to struggle to maintain control. When Draco asks him what is wrong, Ron pleads a stomach ache--at which point Draco suggests he "go up to the hospital wing and give all those Mudbloods a kick from me."

Draco goes on to say "with relish" that "the last time the Chamber of Secrets was opened, a Mudblood died. So I bet it's a matter of time before one of them's killed this time ... I hope it's Granger." I think this shows pretty well the extent of the evil within him.

During PoA, Draco and his cronies dress up as Dementors, intending to frighten Harry. Since such an action could have had deadly consequences for Harry, I think it is yet another illustration of the evil that seems to be taking hold and growing stronger in Draco.

I've often thought that he was too wimpy and cowardly to become a full-fledged DE ... but upon rethinking it, perhaps he might manage it. He couldn't be any more cowardly than Peter P. After all, no one ever said that Slytherins were brave--just self-serving and ambitious. I suppose Draco could serve Voldemort even as a cowardly toad watching out for his own skin.

Solitaire

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Weeny Owl - Jan 29, 2005 9:43 pm (#90 of 270)

I agree with all who have said Draco was rotten from the first moment we encountered him.

He started off with his prejudices, and hasn't stopped since. I see no difference in him except that he's getting older, a bit more cautious perhaps, and much nastier.

Draco is a carbon copy of Lucius, after all, and we know what HE'S like.

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Wand Maker - Jan 29, 2005 9:56 pm (#91 of 270)

Yes. Draco is one dimensional. Everyone who he is jelous about, he tries to publically put them down in order to make his position appear elevated.

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MickeyCee3948 - Jan 29, 2005 9:59 pm (#92 of 270)

Avatar courtesy of Gwen
Draco was probably a nasty, spoiled little brat as a baby and has grown up to be a nasty, spoiled little git as a teenager and if he survives, he will be a nasty, possibly spoiled old man. Depending on how much money he inherits from his mum and dad. He definitely isn't going to go out and work(lord forbid)for a living.

Mikie

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Steve Newton - Jan 30, 2005 8:28 am (#93 of 270)

Librarian
I have to disagree that Draco is a carbon copy of Lucius. Draco is not anywhere near as smart.

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Solitaire - Jan 30, 2005 10:29 am (#94 of 270)

I tend to agree with Steve on this one. Draco certainly possesses all of Lucius's negative qualities--meanness, prejudice and bigotry, dishonesty--but he appears to lack the cunning and smoothness of his father.

Solitaire

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Choices - Jan 30, 2005 6:04 pm (#95 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I also agree - Draco isn't as crafty and cunning as Lucius, he's just a petty little playground bully so far.

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Ydnam96 - Jan 30, 2005 7:07 pm (#96 of 270)

Well, I'm not sure I agree that Draco is one dimensional...I don't like him, nor do I think he is a greatly rounded character, but I do see some depth there. Especially in the scenes where he is interacting with his father. But this might be more appropriate on the Draco thread.

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Weeny Owl - Jan 31, 2005 12:46 pm (#97 of 270)

When I said he was a carbon copy of his father, I meant in the attitudes and not the abilities.

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Bathilda - Feb 1, 2005 8:57 am (#98 of 270)

SAHM (of two wee ones)
Edited by megfox Feb 1, 2005 1:06 pm
Whoa! Draco is 16, like Harry. He can't be expected to be as smooth, nay, slippery as Lucious. He's still a kid, and Lucious has had many years to refine his nastiness. We don't really see Draco's transformation as he matures. We know he's malicious. We know he's evil. We know he's your run of the mill jerk, even to his "friends". However, we also know he's a prefect. We can assume that he gets good grades and is coming into his own as a wizard. (Even though we see some small failures during the OWL exams) Maybe the DE have rules about needing to be "of age" to join, just as the Order does. Do you think that the DA gang will be able to join in Book 6 since they've already been to battle, but are still underage? But back to dear Draco. I'm sure that he would join the DE if given the chance, even though he is a bit of a coward...just because it's the Malfoy way. I think that he's always been on the "wrong" or "bad" side because he's a bigot and a putz, but I agree with someone on an above post. The "sides" are clearer now, as Voldy is back, and the Death Eaters have been outed. Now you're either with the good side--DD, or against it.

Edited - Ginerva, please don't use words that you feel you need to "star out" letters of. If you can't say it out right, you shouldn't use any form of the word. If you have any questions, please feel free to email me at [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Thanks!

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Solitaire - Feb 1, 2005 1:24 pm (#99 of 270)

The manner in which Draco taunts and threatens others pretty much shows cowardice. He always tries to cut off his quarry (Harry) and ambush him when he is alone and Draco has his "seconds." But that is how bullies operate, isn't it? They make sure the odds are well in their favor before they strike. He does tend to underestimate things, though.

I agree about making choices (there it is again!) ... now that Voldemort has been outted, Wizards and Witches are going to have to declare themselves. I'm not sure people can elect the same options as last time (as in pure-blood yes, Voldemort no). This may make even some of the pure-blood Slytherin families stop to consider ... do they really want to align themselves with Voldemort, or are they willing to put their prejudices aside for the greater good. Or would that be too "un-Slytherin" a thing to do ... consider the "greater good"? Just wondering ...

Solitaire

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Wand Maker - Feb 1, 2005 6:31 pm (#100 of 270)

I wondered about how the wizarding world will divide itself. Will there be a roughly even split, or will the Voldemort supports be a far smaller group. Jo calls it a war. How small can a war be and still be a war? (I am thinking that Voldemort supporters will be a smaller group).

On comparing Draco with Lucius, Lucius is smoother, particularly with his tongue. He also appears to be more cunning than Draco, but in quick acting situations, he seems to lack the ability to see the immediate consequences. He then finds himself on the losing side of an altercation. This is like Draco.

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:53 am

MickeyCee3948 - Feb 1, 2005 8:16 pm (#101 of 270)
Avatar courtesy of Gwen
WandMaker-Voldemorts group will probably smaller but very deadly, considering their total lack of concern for the damage and deaths that they cause.

Mikie

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Wand Maker - Feb 1, 2005 8:25 pm (#102 of 270)

I agree wholeheartedly. His core group will be a devistating lot. It is the less actively committed of the WW that could be a considerable number. In GoF, the tortuing of the muggles was being egged on by an ever increasing crowd of people. This could be compared with merry makers after a championship game in the muggle world, but there are plenty of them who need just a bit of encouragement to do things they would not normally do. There could be a bunch of the WW that could find themselves on one side or the other without really making that concious decision. And then having to defend themselves.

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Bathilda - Feb 2, 2005 7:45 am (#103 of 270)

SAHM (of two wee ones)
I don't think it would be an even split for Voldy/DD supporters. The Greater good wouldn't necessarily turn off all Slytherins. I don't think all Slytherins are evil. They are charaterized as cunning and ambitions and using any means to get their ends. If the "greater good" was a Slytherin's goal, then said Slytherin would go to any lengths to attain it, right? I agree on the above differences between Draco and Lucius, but my point was the Draco is still an adolescent. Who knows what Lucius was like when a teenager. You don't get as smooth and slippery as Lucius overnight. He's been working on it awhile. And for the record, the word I used in the edited post can be found in the bible, and in Christmas songs. And it's in a Children's book I have for my daughter. (sorry, a bit wounded after my admonishment)

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Muggle Doctor - Feb 2, 2005 6:44 pm (#104 of 270)

I fear a much more destructive group of DE this time. Why? Because last time they were winning, up to the point where Voldemort's luck ran out, and this time they know there is a very good chance they may lose (Voldemort has been foiled twice in two engagements, once by Harry and once by Dumbledore, and large numbers of death eaters are being exposed and imprisoned in one fell swoop). So they're going to come out swinging and perhaps not bother with converting or turning people they'd find it easier to kill.

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Solitaire - Feb 2, 2005 6:54 pm (#105 of 270)

Good point. And since some of the Inner Circle who were previously thought to be non-DEs--Malfoy, Crabbe, Goyle, Macnair--are now outted and/or imprisoned, they no longer have reputations to preserve by trying to stay low-key. It may make them more reckless, as you say, and much scarier--if it's possible for Lucius to be any scarier than he already is. I doubt it's possible for Bella to be any scarier. She already scares me.

Solitaire

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Muggle Doctor - Feb 27, 2005 6:36 pm (#106 of 270)

Bellatrix is just a psychopath. To quote an old 80's action film, "You don't assign her; you unleash her". Lucius is radically different - if there had been a duelling club in his schooldays, I have no doubt he would have been champion. The MoM battle was altered by the fact that they were strictly there after the prophecy, and still wanted to keep their cover to a certain extent. Now that Lucius' true nature is revealed, he doesn't have to be a goody two-shoes any more: he will come out swinging.

Unlike Draco who, if he were to go in for duelling club now, would get his little ferret backside kicked. Maybe Harry should take transfiguration lessons from Moody... "Careful, Draco: get on my nerves, and it's furry bouncy time again!"

I wonder if Draco and co. had time to realise what hit them on the train; or more to the point, who hit them. If he has any sense at all, knowing that a hotchpotch of Ravenclaws and Hufflepuffs leaped to Harry's defence ought to tell him just how isolated Slytherin house is right now. It will probably also speak volumes to other Slytherins, and it is this which will encourage the defection of the 'swingers' and fence sitters in Slytherin.

The debate will be: who will be the first to defect? And will it be one of the three we've been discussing (Blaise, Pansy or Theodore), or someone else?

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Solitaire - Feb 28, 2005 12:04 am (#107 of 270)

It would be nice to know who are the DE supporters among the Slytherins. I can't believe they all support Voldemort, can you? Surely there are some who glory in their pure-blooded Slytherin-ness without feeling the need to blast everyone else off the face of the earth. These might be the ones Harry and the rest of the DA need to target for support.

Question: Is it remotely possible that Draco and his goon squad (especially those who made up the Inquisitorial Squad) are the only DE supporters in their year among the kids in Slytherin House? If it IS possible, what kind of effect might it have on Draco et al?

Solitaire

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Muggle Doctor - Feb 28, 2005 2:58 pm (#108 of 270)

I strongly suspect that Draco and his goons are indeed in the minority, and that they have been holding their fellow Slytherins in thrall to some extent, with everybody knowing what they (and their fathers) are but too scared to say much about it. Now that it's all in the open, Draco can't put his hand on his wand and say "Are you insulting me, sir?" or slime up to them and say "What, me? A Voldemort supporter?" He has to listen and say nothing while they talk about what he is. Sort of like Ernie McMillan's whispering campaign against Harry in CoS, but now it's all true.

In addition, at the end of GoF, JKR specifically mentions Draco and a few others rather than "All of the Slytherins" sitting down when the rest of the school drinks to Dumbledore's call of support for Harry, which leads me to believe that there were at least some Slytherins who stood and raised their glasses to Our Hero.

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Dumbledore - Mar 1, 2005 9:02 am (#109 of 270)

(Albus Percival Wulfric Brian)
I agree that Draco & co. are vastly in the minority. The reason that we only hear about them as opposed to what we may call "neutral" Slytherins, is that Draco and his friends are the ones who are more central to the plot. However, now that the Voldemort secret is out and the second war is most likely beginning, I think Slytherins who were in the shadows will be forced to take sides, which is why in this book in particular I think we will hear more about Slytherins that we have been wondering about (i.e. Nott and Zabini).

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Gary L Varnam - Mar 8, 2005 6:38 pm (#110 of 270)

Gary Varnam This student came in under strange circumstances. He took a Youth potion and turn him from a 50 year old into a 10 year old. Then turn 11 in Oct. He was Sorted into Gryffindor house in 1991. He come by Time Turner from year 2005. Has a crush on Luna Lovegood. Play on Quidditch team as a first year like Harry as Chaser.

Melissa Varnam This student came with Gary Varnam. It is His duaghter. But at school as his sister. She was sorted into Slytherin house in 1991. She has a crush on Draco Malfoy. She came by Time Turner from year 2005.

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Detail Seeker - Mar 9, 2005 2:09 pm (#111 of 270)

Quod tempus non sanat, sanat ferrum,... so prepare
Gary, welcome to the forum ! Have fun here.

On another note: I do not get the point in your post #110 in regard to the topic. This Forum does not deal with Fan Fiction, as this has its own Forum. If you want to write an HP-related fiction of your own, you are welcome to post there. An introduction of yourself and your daughter may be posted on the "Introduction"-Thread. Thanks very much!

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Ms Amanda - May 8, 2005 5:12 pm (#112 of 270)

While it will be great fun to see Draco taken down a few notches within his own house, I'm afraid I will be suspicious of any Slytherin that openly "switches sides" or joins the DA or something like that.

I keep hearing Lucius in the back of my head, reminding Draco that it is unwise to appear less than fond of Harry. What if we see Slytherin students joining the DA, and Harry buys in to educating them (because Hermione will be all for it), just to have them double-cross him?

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Muggle Doctor - May 8, 2005 7:20 pm (#113 of 270)

I keep hearing Lucius in the back of my head, reminding Draco that it is unwise to appear less than fond of Harry.

On the other hand, 1995 (their fifth year) was, it seems, a very good year in which to appear less than fond of Harry.

(Lots about Draco following, but it is thread-relevant.)

And Draco, it must be admitted, has never been known for his wisdom. His approach to Harry before they actually arrived at Hogwarts was sledgehammer-obvious: he wore his prejudices on his sleeve and left Harry in no doubt as to what he was dealing with. Had he talked UP Slytherin without talking DOWN the other Houses (or the people in them), he might have done a better job: in particular, Harry would not have been so determined to say "Not Slytherin."

But Draco will never change his spots. He is a talent-less git, riding on the coat-tails of the powerful and motivated by hatred of his betters (in terms of intellect, work ethic and the like) - as well as those who show him and his friends/family up for what they are. Now that Lucius is exposed as a Death Eater (and in Azkaban at least for a while), Draco's hatred will become irrational and irrepressible, and I don't doubt he will whip up the Death Nibblers into a simuilar frenzy (especially since many of them are also fatherless at the moment).

I think it will be easy to see who the trustworthy Slytherins are, when the side-switchers start to appear.

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Solitaire - May 8, 2005 7:36 pm (#114 of 270)

You're probably right, Muggle Doc. Do you think, though, that any Slytherin kids will be surprised to discover that their parents are DEs? Or do you think the kids have all known all along? Just wondering what others think about this.

Solitaire

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Muggle Doctor - May 9, 2005 12:34 am (#115 of 270)

I think the ones whose parents are death eaters have known it all along, and are probably influencing their children's choice of friends to boot. Why else do you think Draco (who for all his faults appears at least reasonably intelligent) would hang around with two knuckle-dragging sub-neanderthals like Crabbe and Goyle when, as a Slytherin, he should be acting to his own best advantage.

There is of course the Quibbler interview, in which Harry is sure to have named names (i.e. Crabbe, Goyle and Malfoy at least, probably Nott too). And I'm sure that even the Slytherins are aware of a small group of uber-Slytherins within themselves (note that not ALL the Slytherins stayed in their seats during the memorial toast at the end of Fourth Year). Plus the Death Nibblers must surely boast from time to time, at the very least.

Many Slytherins will probably have heard them say "As soon as the Dark Lord is back, all those mudbloods and muggle-lovers will be out of Hogwarts for good." And like others before them, they will nod and approve, but they probably will not realise exactly what Draco and co. mean by this.

When they do (i.e. pine boxes rather than just marching orders), that will be when we see Slytherins turning.

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Solitaire - May 9, 2005 12:02 pm (#116 of 270)

two knuckle-dragging sub-neanderthals like Crabbe and Goyle

Awww, don't you like Crabbe & Goyle? LOL Frankly, both of them strike me as the sort who would run in the opposite direction if they saw Voldemort. They already shrink at the mention of his name. I also question their ability to wield a wand. Have we ever seen them do any real magic? Perhaps we will get a demonstration of their abilities in HBP.

Solitaire

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librarian314 - May 9, 2005 12:28 pm (#117 of 270)

Hey all!

I think the Slytherins (or other students) who would be surprised that they had relatives who were Death Eaters were those whose relatives were killed in the last war. Surely there must be at least one Slytherin who lost a father, uncle, or some other, older relative during that war whose parents covered it up. Once people realize that Voldemort is back, there will bound to be stories popping up about those that died during the first war. We may just find out that some students have relatives that had been Death Eaters, that we and they would never have suspected.

*michelle the librarian**

EDIT: For readability

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Cuivienen - May 12, 2005 4:05 pm (#118 of 270)

I just rewatched the movie of PS/SS and noticed something of interest -- when Susan Bones is called to be sorted, a theme I don't think appears elsewhere in the movie plays very briefly before Harry turns away to look at Quirrell and Snape. While movie evidence is shaky at best, this may suggest that Susan Bones will be of importance later in the story.

Has anyone else noticed this?

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Miriam Huber - May 13, 2005 8:14 am (#119 of 270)

I´d really like Susan Bones to have a bigger part, but is it really plausible if it happens no sooner than the 6th book that JKR told the makers of the first movie? And if so, she might have prevented Stephen Fry from giving Susan a defectible pronounciation (rather th than s)?

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Cuivienen - May 14, 2005 7:03 am (#120 of 270)

It's possible, I won't say likely, but possible. After all, Susan already became more important in the 5th book - at least Harry knows her name now!

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Blaise Zabini - May 21, 2005 10:49 am (#121 of 270)

"I´d really like Susan Bones to have a bigger part, but is it really plausible if it happens no sooner than the 6th book that JKR told the makers of the first movie?"

It can indeed be plausible as was the graveyard incident--still yet to come. JKR prevented the director from putting a graveyard on the grounds, because she said it belonged somewhere else. Unless the graveyard she was referring to was the one in GoF--highly unlikely because they used a portkey to get there--it has not yet been seen and most likely will be in the sixth or seventh book, unless JKR has changed the plot line.

Just a theory! =]

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Eponine - May 21, 2005 1:52 pm (#122 of 270)

psst...the girl who played Susan Bones in the first two movies was Chris Columbus' daughter. Since she is American, it's doubtful that she'll continue to play the part if Susan is given a larger role. If Susan does have a larger role, one must question why JKR ok'ed the casting of an American in the role.

I'm not saying that Susan won't have a larger part in the next two books, but I don't think you should base any prediction of that sort on the fact that the director of the movie wanted his daughter to appear in the films.

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Neville Longbottom - May 21, 2005 4:08 pm (#123 of 270)

I must admit, I would prefer it if Susan remains a background character. It would make it more realistic, if not everyone who has lost some family members to Voldie becomes a major character.

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Choices - May 21, 2005 5:41 pm (#124 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Blaise - "Unless the graveyard she was referring to was the one in GoF--highly unlikely because they used a portkey to get there--"

That graveyard was near the old Riddle house because they could see it in the background. The old Riddle house is not near Hogwarts.

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frogface - May 22, 2005 2:46 am (#125 of 270)

Plus I doubt Voldemort would risk having his regeneration anywhere near Dumbledore.

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Other students of Hogwarts Empty Other students of Hogwarts (Post 126 to 150)

Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:54 am

Miriam Huber - May 22, 2005 4:26 am (#126 of 270)
Eponine,

reading your post one of the portrait in Dumbledore´s office shouted "Blatant corruption!" (with Stephen Fry´s voice) -

not to critisize Columbus, just a "I know I am a completely obsessed Harry Potter fan"-moment.

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Solitaire - May 22, 2005 8:22 am (#127 of 270)

I believe it was necessary to use a part of Riddle's father's remains for the rebirthing potion. That may account for the choice of graveyards.

Solitaire

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Cuivienen - May 22, 2005 10:30 am (#128 of 270)

Eponine, the point isn't so much that Susan Bones appeared in the movies - I can understand Chris Columbus wanting his daughter in the films. The point is that she seems to have her own musical theme, which is usually used in movies to foreshadow importance of a character that otherwise appears insignificant.

I agree that it is doubtful that Miss Columbus will continue to play Susan Bones if she appears again; then again, it will have been three years since she last appeared when Susan Bones pops up in OotP, making the use of a different, British actress perfectly acceptable.

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Eponine - May 22, 2005 12:23 pm (#129 of 270)

Cuivienen, what do you mean, her own musical theme? Is something distinctive played everytime she's shown on screen?

So this won't be entirely off-topic for being purely movie related, I wouldn't be surprised to see her with a slightly more substantial role, but I don't think Susan is going to suddenly turn into a major character. It's my opinion that she'll always be more of a background character.

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Cuivienen - May 23, 2005 7:44 pm (#130 of 270)

Watch the sorting scene in PS/SS. I swear a theme plays when she is called that is unique from any other in PS/SS, at least.

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Camden Zoe - Jun 8, 2005 11:15 pm (#131 of 270)

Marcus Flint: How much do we know about him? I know that Harry thought he might have troll blood in him, but do we know what his background is? Does anyone have the description of him? I don't have the HP books to look it up. Or know any sites with that info? Thanks so much.

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David Breeze - Jul 28, 2005 9:59 am (#132 of 270)

Edited by Jul 28, 2005 10:01 am
I have been doing a bit of detective work to find out the names of all the kids in Harry's year at Hogwarts. I have used various sources including 'The Sorting Hat' chapter in PS/SS; The Lexicon's own list of Hogwarts students and JK Rowling's official notes, seen on this site [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which although slightly altered when appearing in books are still considered cannon.

Providing that there is a total of forty children in each year, broken down into five boys and five girls into each house, I have produced the following list:

Gryffindor

Harry Potter (male), Ron Weasley (male), Dean Thomas (male), Seamus Finnigan (male), Neville Longbottom (male), Parvati Patil (female), Lavender Brown (female), Hermione Granger (female),

GRYFFINDOR ARE MISSING TWO GIRLS

Ravenclaw

Terry Boot (male), Michael Corner (male), Anthony Goldstein (male), Stephen Cornfoot (male), Morag McDougal (female), Li Su (female), Padma Patil (female), Lisa Turpin (female), Mandy Brocklehurst (female),

RAVENCLAW ARE MISSING TWO BOYS

Hufflepuff

Justin Finch-Fletchely (male), Earnie MacMillan (male), Wayne Hopkins (male), Susan Bones (female), Hannah Abbott (female), Megan Jones (female),

HUFFLEPUFF ARE MISSING 2 BOYS & 2 GIRLS

Slytherin

Draco Malfoy (male), Vincent Crabbe (male), Gregory Goyle (male), Blaise Zabini (male), Theodore Nott (male), Millicent Bullstrode (female), Tracey Davis (female), Daphne Greengrass (female), Pansy Parkinson (female),

SLYTHERIN ARE MISSING 1 GIRL

Unconfirmed Houses

Sally-Ann Perks, Kevin Entwistle,

(Surnames only) Spinks, Smith (Probably Zacharias Smith, a Hufflepuff), Moon, Rope/Roper,

I cannot prove it, but I think that Eloise Midgen, who the Lexicon say is probably a Hufflepuff, Is also in Harry's year. She has bad acne and a lopsided nose, details which the trio would probably only have picked up upon if she was in there year. If she was in a different Hufflepuff year, the trio would never have lessons with her and therefor would probably not know who she was.

If Eloise and Zacharias Smith are in Harry's year, that would amke the new Hufflepuff lineup look like this:

Hufflepuff

Justin Finch-Fletchely (male), Earnie MacMillan (male), Wayne Hopkins (male), Zacharias Smith (male), Susan Bones (female), Hannah Abbott (female), Megan Jones (female), Eloise Midgen (female),

HUFFLEPUFF ARE MISSING 1 BOYS & 1 GIRL

Now we have five students with unconfirmed houses left. There are 7 vaccancies left in the houses. Sally-Ann Perks, Kevin Entwistle, Spinks, Moon & Rope/Roper.

Kevin Entwistle must be in either Hufflepuff or Ravenclaw as they are the only houses with male Vaccancies.

Sally-Ann must be in either Gryffindor, Hufflepuff or Slytherin. My bet is Hufflepuff.

Filling the other vaccancies depends on the genders of the remaining three uncomfirmeds and upon the gender of the missing to students whoose names are not legible in JK's note book.

If anybody can offer me some help, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

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Ponine - Jul 28, 2005 12:38 pm (#133 of 270)

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
David, I think your attempt is admirable, but not necessarily possible, as there is no way of knowing how many kids - and how many girls and how many boys - come to school each year - forty may or may not be average - and I also doubt whether the Sorting Hat actually only would put five of each in each house - in my opinion, it would take away the purpose of having the hat. All that being said, however, I really like your overview, which looks pretty accurate and extensive!

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Finn BV - Jul 28, 2005 2:40 pm (#134 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
David, I do believe someone else on this forum (I don't want to say the name for fear of miscrediting the actual one) has also done extensive work on this topic. I'll search for it…

Edit: Found it! Knew Tomoé was involved in there somehow! Warty Harris started (from what I see) the idea of the research. (Warty Harris, "Minor Characters, including Students" #30, 9 Dec 2003 5:52 pm)

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Ponine - Jul 28, 2005 4:33 pm (#135 of 270)

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
You know - I was looking up a name, and stumbled over Pansy in the process - interestingly enough, this came up... from the English word for a type of flower, ultimately deriving from Old French pensee "thought".

I am sure it is a tad too far-fetched, but, still, I thought it was interesting...

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Dr Filibuster - Jul 30, 2005 1:20 pm (#136 of 270)

Sue, from Northwich, England.
David, check out Rowling's interview with Mellisa and Emmerson. It's on The-Leaky-Cauldron.org, Mugglenet and there's a thread on this forum too.

JKR confirmed that there were indeed 40 kids in Harry's year. She was asked if she could tell us the "2 missing Gryfindors". She reminded us that she's hopeless with numbers, hadn't checked her notes, and promised that she WILL PUT INFORMATION ABOUT THE MISSING GRYFFINDORS ON HER WEBSITE.

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Tomoé - Aug 5, 2005 8:42 pm (#137 of 270)

Back in business
Edited Aug 5, 2005 9:18 pm
Nice to see another fan of the background crowd aroud!

I have another screen shot of the note-book, a montage in fact, which is a bit wider than the ones you have. It's out of its original context, the web site was closed months before, but here's the pic.

So my list looks pretty much like yours:



Gryffindor Hufflepuff Ravenclaw Slytherin
Boys Seamus Finnigan
Neville Longbottom
Harry Potter
Dean Thomas
Ron Weasley Justin Finch-Fletchley
Wayne Hopkins
Ernie Macmillan
Zacharias Smith
Stebbins Terry Boot
Michael Corner
Stephen Cornfoot
Kevin Entwhistle
Anthony Goldstein Vicent Crabbe
Gregory Goyle
Draco Malfoy
Theodore Nott
Blaise Zabini
Girls Lavander Brown
Hermione Granger
Parvati Patil
Sally-Anne Perks
? Hannah Abbott
Susan Bones
S. Fawcett
Megan Jones
? Mandy Brockehurts
Morag McDougal
Su Li
Padma Patil
Lisa Turpin Millicent Bulstrode
Tracey Davis
Daphne Greengrass
Pansy Parkinson
?

Black = canon from the books
Dark red = canon from the lists
Red = educated guess

There still Moon and Eloise Midgeon, plus another girl, for which I have no idea which house they were sorted in.

Sally-Anne Perks: I suspect she's a Gryffindor because we get her first name in a succession students of whom we get only the last names, sounds like she was more important than the others. Like the Patil sister of which we learn they were identical twins along with their last name. So the extra information of the first name hint that she's a Gryffindor. I mean, all the Gryffindors had more informations than the people named around them.

Stebbins : I strongly suspect Stebbins is from Harry's year, he sat the OWLs with him and was found in the bushes with the S. Fawcett girl, which one we see around Terry and Ernie in the dueling club and the QtA borrowers' list. So I believe both of them are from JKR's list of forty. I also suspect Stebbins is the final name of the Spungan Spinks student.

S. Fawcett: S. Fawcett would be the final name of S. Roper on the list. She was a Ravenclaw in GoF, but there is no room left in the House so I suspect girls have switched houses the same day Anthony and Michael did (I suspect 2 Ravenclaw have been move to Hufflepuff, likely Smith and Stebbins). Since the list is older than the switch, and since Fawcett is a Hufflepuff in the British version of the bushes scene, I put her in Hufflepuff. I suspect either Morag or Su has sitched place with her. We also see her around Ernie, Terry and Stebbins, so I guess she' in Harry's year.

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Madam Pince - Aug 6, 2005 9:45 am (#138 of 270)

The eyes are the windows to the soul...
Wow, great list Tomoe! You've done a lot of research! Thanks for the "screen shot" picture, it was really interesting.

So, it looks like JKR changed both Michael Corner and Anthony Goldstein from Hufflepuffs on her original list to Ravenclaws in the books, right? (Interesting that along with some others, both Hermione and Neville had different last names on her original list --Longbottom was originally to be Puff? did I read that right?)

So according to that screen shot of the original list, there are four names on there that aren't used in your chart -- Malone, Moon, Rivers (which was originally Quirrell but she crossed that out, obviously thought of a better use for that name!), and what looks like Runeon or something. One of those has probably been changed to Midgeon. Is that what you've come up with, Tomoe?

What do the symbols beside the names mean, do you reckon? I know the H-R-G-S is the house name, but what about the dark/light squares and the stars/circled stars and the boxed-in N's?

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Finn BV - Aug 6, 2005 11:31 am (#139 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Wow, Tomoé! Bloody brilliant! The nitpicker I am, I would change Padma Patil's name from dark red to black as Hermione tells us in GoF that she is in Ravenclaw.

Also, the houses don't have to be even. I know that it would be all "nice and pretty and perfect" () if it worked out that way, but there can be, say, 11 children in Ravenclaw and 9 in Gryffindor; that would account for the Fawcett and the missing Gryffindors, etc.

Madam Pince, the symbols I believe talk about the heritage of the students, but I don't know which symbol means which heritage. Yes, Hermione's name changed from 'Puckle' (which she told us on her web site) to Granger and Neville's from 'Puff' to Longbottom. Actually, I thought it said 'Pupp,' but I'm not entirely sure.


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Tomoé - Aug 7, 2005 10:33 pm (#140 of 270)

Back in business
Finn BV -> The nitpicker I am, I would change Padma Patil's name from dark red to black as Hermione tells us in GoF that she is in Ravenclaw.

You are perfectly right, I moved the names around a lot while doing the table and it seems a tag didn't follow its proper name. *Tomoe blush deeply* (Padma is even a prefect of the Ravenclaw house *blush deeper still*)

Madam Pince -> So according to that screen shot of the original list, there are four names on there that aren't used in your chart -- Malone, Moon, Rivers (which was originally Quirrell but she crossed that out, obviously thought of a better use for that name!), and what looks like Runeon or something. One of those has probably been changed to Midgeon. Is that what you've come up with, Tomoe?

What you read as Malone (and I read as Malbre) is the former name of Malloy, who became Malfoy, so it is, in fact, in my list. ^_~ For Moon, Rivers and Runcorn, I have no idea where to put them since we have no information. Maybe I should have put them in whatever blank space left ... Anyway, as you sugested, I believe that one of these is Eloise Midgeon.

I suspect Quirrel Rivers is the last Slytherin girl, since Quirrel was a bad guy name, but it is very thin a hint, from any standard, to sort someone.

About the symbols, JKR said they stand for the heritage of the students (as Finn BV said). It is obivious the [N] stand for Muggle-borns, as Hermione and Justin have that one, but the other two are less strait forward. Seamus, whom we know to be a half-blood, have a (*), but the circle is scratched, so it is belived the * means half-blood and the (*) means pure-blood. Plus, Crabbe and Goyle have a (*), and since they are likely pure-bloods, (*) should mean pure-blood. It would have been clearer with the other page with Harry, Ron, Draco and Gary Dean.

Finn BV -> Also, the houses don't have to be even. I know that it would be all "nice and pretty and perfect"

Yes, but I have the feeling they are. JKR was asked twice about the missing Gryffindor girls and she answered twice that she forget who they were, but didn't denie their existences. Plus, she's bad with math and the teacher are even between male and female. So to be sure she didn't neglect Ravenclaw or Hufflepuff, to be sure she didn't put more boys than girls, the 5 boys / 5 girls per house kind of sound right. I was against the idea more than a year ago, but since I read her answer for the World Book Day Chat on March 2004, I finaly came to term with this unrealistic disposition of the students. ^_~

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Weeny Owl - Aug 10, 2005 10:32 pm (#141 of 270)

Can anyone tell me in which chapter of HBP it mentioned Millicent Bulstrode not being at Hogwarts for sixth year?

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John D'Oh - Aug 10, 2005 8:40 pm (#142 of 270)

Hermione's Roommates

Hi!

I've searched the forums for a discussion as I know I can't be the first to speculate, but has anyone given any thought - or has any text given reference to - who Hermione's roommates are.

She's never complained about them and since the stairs don't allow Harry or Ron into the room we've never been given an idea of what the girl's dorm looks like or who she rooms with.

Plus Harry's roommates play such an important role in his stay at Hogwarts it would be interesting to know how her roommates might have shaped hers.

Any thoughts?

Cheers, John

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Amilia Smith - Aug 10, 2005 7:50 pm (#143 of 270)

Well, in the Interview, Melissa asked Jo:

MA: Yeah. Have you discovered the two missing Gryffindor students?

JKR: [Covers eyes] Ohh! [Frustrated.] I was going to go and get that for you, I'm sorry I haven't got it, I'll put it on my site.

Hopefully she will remember, and we will have more information soon.

Mills.

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Choices - Aug 10, 2005 7:56 pm (#144 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Just look up the girls who are in Hermione's year at Hogwarts and are Gryffindors and they are probably her roommates....or at least four of them are. If the girl's dorm is like the boys, there are 5 to a room. So far, it really hasn't been vital to the story to know who Hermione's roommates are.

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Finn BV - Aug 10, 2005 8:40 pm (#145 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
This thread will probably be moved to the Other students of Hogwarts thread, because there is currently a discussion there about the "missing Gryffindors" as well as the other "free" spots in the other houses. Tomoé, one of our members, has been doing quite a bit of research on it and you should, if you are interested in this topic, check out that thread.

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Tomoé - Aug 12, 2005 6:47 pm (#146 of 270)

Back in business
It have been said, somewhere in PS, that Hermione had no friend (I think it's before she head to the toilet on that faithful Hollowe'en day) so I guess whoever the other two roommates are, they are not Hermione's best buddies, just acquaintances.

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ex-FAHgeek - Sep 24, 2005 2:13 pm (#147 of 270)

Ron makes a comment about "No wonder she doesn't have any friends," although this is not necessarily strictly true - we do know that Hermione is at least on good terms with Neville at this point (if not participating in a fully-blossomed friendship.)

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Solitaire - Sep 24, 2005 8:03 pm (#148 of 270)

So far, it really hasn't been vital to the story to know who Hermione's roommates are.

It is Harry's story, after all. Don't we seem to learn details about any of Hermione's relationships or encounters with other students or faculty only when they are important to or touch Harry's life in any way?

Solitaire

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Nirnel Treelior - Oct 6, 2005 7:21 am (#149 of 270)

How comes Angelina was 17 in GoF but was still in Hogwarts in OotP? She should have finished school one year before.

Nirnel Treelior

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haymoni - Oct 6, 2005 7:24 am (#150 of 270)

She had just turned 17 in GOF - she's old for the year but still with Fred & George.

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Other students of Hogwarts Empty Other students of Hogwarts (Post 151 to 175)

Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:57 am

Neville Longbottom - Oct 6, 2005 9:07 am (#151 of 270)
It's the same as with Hermione. Hermione turned 17 in the very first weeks of her sixth schoolyear, in September. And Angelina turned 17 at the end of October. When they started their sixth schoolyear they were 16, that's why they are in their respective years.

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haymoni - Oct 6, 2005 9:29 am (#152 of 270)

Is that right about Hermione?

If so, I can't believe we didn't hear about her being of age.

I thought Hermione was actually young for her year.

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azi - Oct 6, 2005 12:02 pm (#153 of 270)

Photo borrowed from Ardent Photography
I'm confused on that as well haymoni! I thought Hermione had been put a year ahead because she was so smart (and was therefore younger than the rest of her year), but then in HBP she took her apparition test. This means she turned 17 before Harry. It stems from that 'two 13 year olds' bit in POA doesn't it?

JKR said herself Hermione was a year ahead, but now it seems to have changed?

Can anyone explain this? I'm confused!

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ex-FAHgeek - Oct 6, 2005 1:48 pm (#154 of 270)

Well, Hermione did get her Apparition license in HBP, and Harry was too young. So, Hermione is older than Harry and Ron.

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haymoni - Oct 6, 2005 1:52 pm (#155 of 270)

I need to go back and re-read!

I totally missed that. I just remember the lessons.

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RoseMorninStar - Oct 6, 2005 3:21 pm (#156 of 270)

I live in the Shire. It looks a lot like Wisconsin, USA
Hermione's birthday is September 19, 1979.

OK...I'm going to do a Hermione impression here...

'Honestly people! Don't you read the Lexicon A-Z?!!!

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Finn BV - Oct 6, 2005 5:22 pm (#157 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
See J.K. Rowling Official Site, FAQ Section.

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Weeny Owl - Oct 6, 2005 9:20 pm (#158 of 270)

Dumbledore may have said "two thirteen-year-olds," but he might not be aware of every single student's birthday and might just lump all third-year students in with being thirteen.

I asked a while back about Millicent Bulstrode but no one ever responded. I've reread HBP more than once, but if there's a reference to her, I've missed it. Does anyone know if she's mentioned at all?

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rambkowalczyk - Oct 7, 2005 1:06 pm (#159 of 270)

Just that she might have been in one of Harry's classes. Definately no headlock fights. Smile

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Muggle Doctor - Oct 9, 2005 5:58 am (#160 of 270)

Question: About Hannah Abbott - I am given to understand that she is an only child, and that she is Muggle-Born. Is this right?

The LEXICON page correctly reminds us that she left Hogwarts after her mother was found dead, but the link to her name from the Hufflepuff page still gives her years as 1991-1998. I think it should probably read 1991-1996, 1997-? or perhaps 1991-1996? to reflect the fact that (until we've seen the end of the seventh book) she may yet return.

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Finn BV - Oct 9, 2005 5:37 pm (#161 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
Muggle Doctor, your should place your inquiry on the -- Corrections or Questions to the Lexicon thread.

Weeny, as far as I remember, this is no mention of Millicent.

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Muggle Doctor - Nov 27, 2005 2:31 pm (#162 of 270)

Question: what do people think is going to happen with all those who have left Hogwarts because of the war (Zacharias, Seamus, Hannah, the Patils etc.)? Are we going to see them again, or are they going to vanish, perhaps only to appear at the end? Does the reason they were withdrawn make a difference?

I take my hat off to the Boneses. Whoever is currently responsible for Susan has guts: relatives fell in the first war, Amelia has just been killed in the second, a girl in her class has had her Muggle mother killed - but Susan remains at Hogwarts.

I think Hannah would have stayed as well if her mother hadn't been killed, but something like that almost seems justifiable in the Muggle universe - at least pull her out for a while and let her get over it - the fact that it was murder rather than an accident means that the recovery period might be greatly lengthened, and seeing as she went to pieces as much as she did over her OWLs, her mother's death might have left her incapable of coping with any school.

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frogface - Nov 27, 2005 4:23 pm (#163 of 270)

Its been suggested that Zacharias Smith may turn out to be more important in book 7 because of the theory that he is desended from Helga Hufflepuff and as such may lead to the Cup horcrux. However alot of us are still blushing from the Mark Evans incident, and Smith is a VERY common surname. I feel sure we'll see some of them again, it would be such a waste to build up characters like Seamus only to dispose of them. It all depends on whether theres room for them in the story, and what roles they may play.
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Solitaire - Nov 27, 2005 9:23 pm (#164 of 270)

Smith is a VERY common surname

Watch it, Frogface! LOL

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me and my shadow 813 - Nov 28, 2005 10:20 am (#165 of 270)

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I imagine DA to get back in business, it just makes sense to have more on that, since they're too young to join the Order. If Harry doesn't return to school, Ginny and Hermione would make an excellent pair to lead the DA in DADA lessons.

Regarding Zacharias, I posted on Hepzibah's thread that I see trouble brewing for this Smith descendent. I see a Dark Mark in his future.

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Solitaire - Dec 3, 2005 10:47 am (#166 of 270)

Wow, Shadow! Do you really think so? I guess I'd better hustle over to that thread and see what's brewing!

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haymoni - Jan 24, 2006 10:34 am (#167 of 270)

I was wondering what everyone thinks will happen to Crabbe & Goyle.

I had made the prediction before HBP was out that none of the DEs would allow their children to go back to Hogwarts. Obviously, I was wrong.

But now that Draco obviously won't be back, what will happen to our favorite mossy boulders???

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Choices - Jan 24, 2006 12:05 pm (#168 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
They could turn out to be not-so-bad. We have seen instances where they went along with the rest of the students until Draco stopped them. Without Draco's evil influence, they might actually be half- way decent. Of course, their Death Eater father's influence could drag them down.

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haymoni - Jan 24, 2006 12:17 pm (#169 of 270)

Yes - I just don't see them being much use to Voldy.

Draco at least has a bit of magical ability.

Maybe they'll just fall off the radar.

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Solitaire - Jan 26, 2006 1:55 pm (#170 of 270)

I agree with Choices that they might possibly be decent with Draco out of the picture. DE parents, though, could prove a problem ... I also think that what the other Slytherins in their year do will have some bearing. Theodore Nott seemed quiet, but Blaise seems to me like he could be trouble, if he chooses. He seems a big arrogant. Haymoni could also be correct ... they might just sort of fade into the background.

Solitaire

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Soul Search - Jan 27, 2006 8:17 am (#171 of 270)

We have pointed out before that neither Crabbe nor Goyle had a single line of dialog in six books. The only time we see either, without Draco, is when they are polyjuiced as little girls. HBP might also be the first time we see Draco without Crabbe and Goyle, in the potions class (and maybe the DADA class.)

I doubt either will appear in book seven, and would also doubt either will even be mentioned.

But, doubts aside, how would they return?

As Hogwarts students? I gather they returned to Hogwarts in HBP only for "remedial" classes. On a couple of occasions Goyle is described as rather slow, but I can't recall any such description of Crabbe. We didn't see either in any NEWT level class, although only the potions class students were described with any detail.

As DE's? Voldemort would probably take them, since their father's have given service for a long time, but they wouldn't be of much use. They could serve as cannonfodder, though.

On Harry's side, somehow? I can't envision a scenario where they could be of any help.

Still at Draco's side? They didn't seem pleased with Draco in HBP. My guess is that this role is done. And, Draco is probably in hiding, anyway.

None of these possibilities seems useful to the storyline. I guess they are, indeed, "off the radar."

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Solitaire - Jan 28, 2006 9:08 pm (#172 of 270)

I gather they returned to Hogwarts in HBP only for "remedial" classes.

Other than the ruse of using remedial potions tutoring to cover Harry's Occlumency lessons with Snape in OotP, have we even heard of any kids having to take remedial classes?

Solitaire

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haymoni - Jan 29, 2006 6:48 am (#173 of 270)

Just Marcus Flint.

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MichaelmasGal - Feb 8, 2006 3:34 am (#174 of 270)

In book 5 when Harry first shouts at Umbridge, it says that there are 30 students in the class all silent watching him. I thought each class had 2 houses in it? Or did that change at OWL level?

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frogface - Feb 8, 2006 4:12 am (#175 of 270)

Thats an interesting point. You might want to put it on the problems in book five thread.

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Other students of Hogwarts Empty Other students of Hogwarts (Post 176 to 200)

Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 1:58 am

Maiden - Mar 2, 2006 3:08 am (#176 of 270)
Back to Crabbe and Goyle: During Slughorns Christmas party, we learn that they got detention from Snape, because they didn't work hard enough to get their DADA OWL this time. That is why Draco had no guards that night. So they are indeed redoing subjects to get their OWLs.

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Choices - Mar 2, 2006 12:30 pm (#177 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I am rereading SS/PS and it struck me as odd that we don't see Crabb and Goyle being sorted. After Draco is sorted into Slytherin, it says he goes to join his friends Crabb and Goyle at the table, but Crabb and Goyle are not mentioned in the sorting ceremony. I assume they are in the same year as Draco? There are 23 named kids who are sorted and if Crabb and Goyle were also sorted before Draco, then that would make a total of 25 kids. Evidently Crabb and Goyle are sorted, but we do not see them being sorted nor are they named among those sorted - they are just seated at the Slytherin table when Draco goes to sit down.

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Solitaire - Mar 2, 2006 1:18 pm (#178 of 270)

In the book, the kids are sorted alphabetically, so Crabbe and Goyle would have been sorted before Draco.

edit: Wait a minute! If 23 kids are named, then wouldn't we know those two potential Gryffindor "mystery girls" people are always wondering about? Or did we decide there were only three Gryffindor girls in Hermione's year? I can't remember ...

Solitaire

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haymoni - Mar 2, 2006 1:26 pm (#179 of 270)

Wasn't Harry talking or looking around during the sorting so we missed a few names???

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Solitaire - Mar 2, 2006 1:30 pm (#180 of 270)

Haymoni, I do not have my books here, but I think you are right ... I thought that kids had been sorted who were not mentioned by name.

Solitaire

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haymoni - Mar 2, 2006 1:33 pm (#181 of 270)

Yes - so many questions would have been answered if Harry would have just paid attention to the Sorting!!!!

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Choices - Mar 2, 2006 6:38 pm (#182 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
There are only three girls named that went to Gryffindor.

I just thought it strange about Crabb and Goyle not being named in the sorting, since there were some kids named who we have not heard mentioned again.

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Weeny Owl - Mar 3, 2006 2:06 am (#183 of 270)

Somehow between Gryffindor and Slytherin there have to be at least twenty students regardless of how many are named because there were twenty brooms during the flying lesson with Madam Hooch, and that flying lesson was with Gryffindor and Slytherin only.

We know of five Gryffindor boys (Harry, Ron, Dean, Neville, Seamus), three Gryffindor girls (Hermione, Lavender, Parvati), five Slytherin boys (Draco, Crabbe, Goyle, Nott, Zabini), and two Slytherin girls (Pansy, Millicent). That would be fifteen, so between the two classes, there are five more students who were never introduced.

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frogface - Mar 3, 2006 3:32 am (#184 of 270)

I get the feeling there are more Slytherin girls who simply haven't been named. Pansy is at least once been described as "with her gang of Slyterin girls" (completely paraphrased that but I know something like that is written in one of the books!)

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Amilia Smith - Mar 3, 2006 3:56 am (#185 of 270)

And I'm pretty sure the "Mystery Gryffindor Girls" do exist. People keep asking Jo about them, and she doesn't deny their existence . . . she just can never remember their names.

Mills.

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MichaelmasGal - Mar 6, 2006 1:48 pm (#186 of 270)

Does it make it unfair to a house that has less people sorted into a year because they have less chances to do well or less people to choose from for quidditch? Or just the social factor, that there are less people you have a chance to make friends with, as people seem to socialize rarely outside of their own houses. Or is that just Harry?

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MichaelmasGal - Mar 6, 2006 1:50 pm (#187 of 270)

The other Gryfindor girls in Harry's year must be mutes who aren't very bright either then....

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Czarina II - Mar 20, 2006 10:53 pm (#188 of 270)

The other students at Hogwarts just don't factor into the story -- it doesn't mean that they don't exist. Individually, they don't affect Harry's story, and therefore they aren't named. How many characters have suddenly appeared by name in the last two books? When we think about it, we've met very few students by name -- only those that associate with Harry in some fashion.

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MichaelmasGal - Mar 21, 2006 4:06 pm (#189 of 270)

But wouldn't girls in Harry's year and most importantly in his house matter? If anything, they were two possible dates to the ball in GoF lol.

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Tomoé - Aug 7, 2006 8:07 am (#190 of 270)

Back in business
Choices -> I am rereading SS/PS and it struck me as odd that we don't see Crabb and Goyle being sorted. After Draco is sorted into Slytherin, it says he goes to join his friends Crabb and Goyle at the table, but Crabb and Goyle are not mentioned in the sorting ceremony. I assume they are in the same year as Draco? There are 23 named kids who are sorted and if Crabb and Goyle were also sorted before Draco, then that would make a total of 25 kids. Evidently Crabb and Goyle are sorted, but we do not see them being sorted nor are they named among those sorted - they are just seated at the Slytherin table when Draco goes to sit down.

Solitaire -> Wait a minute! If 23 kids are named, then wouldn't we know those two potential Gryffindor "mystery girls" people are always wondering about? Or did we decide there were only three Gryffindor girls in Hermione's year? I can't remember ...

Well, since Dean Thomas isn't mention in the sorting ceremony of the Britsh version, I would think there are more students that only 25. But here's what JKR said on the subject:

"Way before I finished “Philosopher's Stone,” when I was just amassing stuff for seven years, between having the idea and publishing the book, I sat down and I created 40 kids who enter Harry's year. I'm delighted I did it, [because] it was so useful. I got 40 pretty fleshed out characters. I never have to stop and invent someone. I know who’s in the year, I know who's in which house, I know what their parentage is, and I have a few personal details on all of them. So there were 40. I never consciously thought, “That's it, that' s all the people in his year,” but that's kind of how it's worked out." (The Leaky Cauldron and MuggleNet interview Joanne Kathleen Rowling: Part Two, 16 July 2005)

It seems I still remember how to do it after a year o.O

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Choices - Aug 7, 2006 2:09 pm (#191 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Welcome back Tomoe'.....:-)

American version of SS/PS.....

"And now there were only four people left to be sorted. 'Thomas, Dean,' a black boy even taller than Ron joined Harry at the Gryffindor table."

The 23 named as being sorted are....Abbott, Bones, Boot, Brocklehurst, Brown, Bulstrode, Finch-Fetchley, Finnigan, Granger, Longbottom, MacDougal, Malfoy, Moon, Nott, Parkinson, Patil, Patil, Perks, Potter, Thomas, Turpin, Weasley, & Zabini.

All it says is that after being sorted, "Malfoy went to join his friends Crabbe and Goyle, looking pleased with himself." So, Crabbe and Goyle would make 25 kids sorted - it's just odd that they are not named among those being sorted.

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Mediwitch - Aug 7, 2006 2:19 pm (#192 of 270)

"We could have all been killed-- or worse, expelled!"
Welcome back, Tomoé!

Harry seemed to get "lost in his thoughts" a few times during the sorting; maybe that should have been the first clue that he wasn't going to pay very close attention to most of his classmates!

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Tomoé - Aug 7, 2006 7:46 pm (#193 of 270)

Back in business
I'm not fully back yet, I still have tens of thousands of posts to read (I want to cry T_T).

Choices -> "it's just odd that they are not named among those being sorted."

Sounds like you're defying me, I'll show you my jutsu! Quote no Jutsu!
(ok, too much Naruto these days, by the way, justsu means technique, so quote no jutsu is quoting technique)

In the Britsh version, it goes like: "And now there were only three people left to be sorted. 'Turpin, Lisa' became a Ravenclaw and then it was Ron's turn."

Here's JKR's words about this chapter: "Anybody who has read both the American and British versions of 'Philosopher's Stone' will notice that Dean Thomas's appearance is not mentioned in the British book, whereas in the American one there is a line describing him (in the chapter 'The Sorting Hat'). This was an editorial cut in the British version; my editor thought that chapter was too long and pruned everything that he thought was surplus to requirements." (jkrowling.com, extra stuff section)

It sounds like her editor get rid of more stuff than just Crabbe, Goyle and Dean. Ernie Macmillan isn't named either. Likely we had the 40 students named in the complete version of this chapter.

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TheSaint - Aug 7, 2006 8:32 pm (#194 of 270)

"And now there were only four people left to be sorted. 'Thomas, Dean,' a black boy even taller than Ron joined Harry at the Gryffindor table."

I loved that line in my book, of course mine say 'Black boy'. Made for the lovliest flights of fancy...RAB having fallen for a muggle, and having a child. He had to 'die' in order to escape the DE and now lives as Dean's muggle father! LOL

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Choices - Aug 8, 2006 10:35 am (#195 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I don't understand why an editor would be so adamant about cutting a few lines here and there. Is it such a bit deal to add one more page to a book? Considering some of the trash that is published, one more page to a guaranteed best seller seems trivial.
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Holly T. - Aug 8, 2006 10:49 am (#196 of 270)

Well, I think the first two books were probably the most heavily edited. They weren't "guaranteed" best sellers at all; the publisher was definitely taking a chance. As for editing out Dean Thomas, perhaps the editor was trying to streamline the sorting by saying "hmmm, here's a minor character, we don't need to mention him here as he's mentioned on p. xx, which gets the same point across." Keep in mind that Jo was certainly not in any position to insist on changes to the editor's work, especially on something so minor.

Contrast that with her having enough clout by GoF, I think, to insist that the British terms not be changed in the American edition, "jumpers," "trainers," etc.

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Choices - Aug 8, 2006 10:55 am (#197 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
You are definitely right, Holly. I was thinking of the books in general, but that sorting was in book one and JKR had not become the huge success that she is now. I still say though....if you are going to publish an almost 400 page book, what's one more page?

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Holly T. - Aug 8, 2006 11:05 am (#198 of 270)

It's not so much that it is "one more page" but deciding if something is repetitive or extraneous information that might be keeping the story from moving along.

Or the editor might have thought it was racist to specify Dean's race and not anyone else's and decided just to delete the entire reference rather than make an issue of race.

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TheSaint - Aug 8, 2006 11:33 am (#199 of 270)

As mine was a capital B, I never considered it a race issue.

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Steve Newton - Aug 10, 2006 1:15 pm (#200 of 270)

Librarian
Welcome back Tomoe!

I've been away for 4 days and there are about 500 posts to catch up on. I don't envy you your task of catching up.

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Other students of Hogwarts Empty Other students of Hogwarts (Post 201 to 225)

Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 2:00 am

Finn BV - Dec 2, 2006 10:24 pm (#201 of 270)
Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
I don't know if this has ever been mentioned before, but the name 'Brocklehurst' (as in the Ravenclaw we never hear anything about in Harry's year, Mandy Brocklehurst) is the name of the head of the school Jane goes to in Jane Eyre. I can't tell you much more about that as I've only read four chapters, but I thought this was an interesting connection to note. (Considering Jane's story is somewhat similar to Harry's with the Dursleys…)

If anybody's read JE, please try not to spoil it if you make a comment!

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haymoni - Dec 4, 2006 8:08 am (#202 of 270)

The only thing I really remember about reading "Jane Eyre" in high school was that we called it "Jane Airhead".

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journeymom - Dec 4, 2006 12:09 pm (#203 of 270)

Finn, in the end everybody dies. ;-)

When you finish Jane Eyre read the essay "The Language of Slavery In Jane Eyre":

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Solitaire - Dec 7, 2006 8:20 am (#204 of 270)

LOL @ Jane Airhead! hehe For some reason, I've never been as big a fan of the Brontes as I am of Jane Austen. I find their books dreary. Such sentiments coming from an English teacher ...

Solitaire

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TwinklingBlueEyes - Dec 8, 2006 12:28 am (#205 of 270)

"Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking"
"dreary"? I prefer a lighter shade of pale. Gray even. Downright boring until you resolve to allow yourself to be drawn in, think, see, feel the stories. But only because it is required, of course. Never admit you might actually find worth in them?

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Laura W - Dec 8, 2006 3:14 am (#206 of 270)

Ok, I admit right here that I have never cared for Jane Austin. (gasp!!) Thus, I have only read two of her novels. One in high school because I had to and one other just to give her a second try. (Oddly enough, this has come back to haunt me on another thread, Dumbledore's Death, where wynnleaf referenced a Jane Austin book in regard to a point I had made, which meant nothing to me.) All this manners-and-morals-among-the-wealthy stuff never did catch my interest. Nor did any of that cutsey our-heroine-said-this-but-she-really-meant-that-which-we-will-find-out-in-the-end stuff (my awkward way of expressing it).

I have no doubt that Austin's stories have *a great deal* of literary value, but I am just not one of her devotees.

By the way, compared to the fiction authors I have always gravitated towards, the book Jane Eyre - which I read at least 30 years ago and quite liked - is a comedy. (smirk)

Anyway, getting back to Finn 's point, is Brocklehurst a common British name? If so, maybe Jo gave it to her little Ravenclaw without any Jane Eyre connection.

Laura

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Dr Filibuster - Dec 15, 2006 2:10 pm (#207 of 270)

Sue, from Northwich, England.
Brocklehurst is not one of the most common surnames, but it's not too unusual either.

It takes up more than a quarter of a page in my phone directory. Then there's all the other Brockxxxxxs: eg Brocklebank, Brock etc. There are also many place names with "Brock" in.

By the way, Brock is another word for badger.

PS: weehee! this is the first time in weeks my dodgy tv internet has worked (it must know that a real computer is on it's way).

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azi - Dec 16, 2006 1:08 pm (#208 of 270)

Photo borrowed from Ardent Photography
Interesting connection, Sue! I think I had known that brock meant badger in the back of my head, but never connected it!

(Congrats on your real computer by the way!)

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Laura W - Dec 17, 2006 1:31 am (#209 of 270)

Thanks for the info, Sue. Of course, the badger connection would have made more sense if Mandy had been sorted into Hufflepuff instead of Ravenclaw. (smile)

Laura

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Herman Basra - Dec 31, 2006 10:14 am (#210 of 270)

I posted this in the leakylounge yesterday.

* I was wondering if we have gotten any official names for who these unidentified students might be?

I read on the HP-Lexicon that SallyAnne Perks has disappeared in the books and didnt appear in the OWL readings in OoTP, possibly indicating that she has left the school. I was wondering might she be one of the two unidentified girl, hence why there is no mention?

The other one that I was possibly thinking on was Eloise Midgen, who is mentioned quite a bit. Alas her name does not appear on the "Harry Potter and Me". So I assume its one of the other names on the right side that are not identified... Possibly Malone or Runcorn?

Harry Potter and me: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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Finn BV - Feb 8, 2007 7:47 pm (#211 of 270)

Me kayaking, Niagara River, August 2006. I have been likened to Reepicheep in this photo.
(Hmmm, this is rather late, but I'll answer anyway.)

We really have no hints as to who the two missing girls are. I doubt it's Sally-Anne Perks because, as the Lex says, she's specifically not mentioned in OoP. And Eloise Midgen seems to be a Hufflepuff, juding as most of the comments about her come from Hufflepuffs.

I would think the names of these two would be entirely new to us.

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Katrina Nadja Romanoff - Feb 23, 2007 7:56 am (#212 of 270)

In the boggart class it's clear that there are only other two character in the room, not less. Or they are the gryffindor Harry's year girls or they are from another house, if this last one the rest of the other house may have been ill...

Rowling clearly avoids talking about the two girls - "ops, I forgot my notes!" - As if she didn't know characters in harry's year. I think it's something like Hermione's sister...some moment she realized it was too late to introduce.

Katrina R.

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Soul Search - Feb 23, 2007 9:16 am (#213 of 270)

As I have read each book I have thought more and more that Harry's powers of ovservation must be extreemly poor. I mean, how could he share a common room for five years with someone like Cormac McClaggen and not have noticed him before Slughorn's get together on the train?

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xray - Feb 23, 2007 10:43 am (#214 of 270)

Hermione will work in Fred & George's Joke Shop after Hogwarts
Soul Search, I think that despite only seeing a handful of characters per class, Jo wants us to understand that it's a rather large school. In particular, Harry, Ron, and Hermione always hung out together but they only knew Dean, Seamus, and Neville "a little bit." They probably knew them a lot better than the books specifically mention even though we're not privy to it. Nevertheless, I can see how they might know of someone else in their house, have said hello to on occasion, but not really know much about them. You have a good point, but basically you only really know the people in your clique, especially if the school is large.

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peachespig - Feb 23, 2007 12:01 pm (#215 of 270)

Soul Search, I agree wholeheartedly. The idea that Harry wouldn't know Cormac before HBP is, in my opinion, preposterous. There are either eight or ten Gryffindor students in Harry's year, depending on the missing girls, most of whom he already knew about by immediately after the Sorting; the rest he would have known by their first day of classes. Cormac is only one year older than him; he would have been right there in the common room, night after night after night, year after year. Everyone new to their surroundings wants to learn the people around them as soon as possible, especially those close in age. After Harry knew his whole class of Gryffindors, I'm guessing he would have figured out the second-years like Cormac by the second night. First week, tops.

Unless Cormac was actually a transfer student, or spent five years under an invisibility cloak, I think this is just a silly Flint on Jo's part. If she had made him a year older and in another house, I could have believed it (maybe).... but then he couldn't have competed for the Gryffindor Quidditch team. A better idea would have just been to have Harry say he'd seen always steered clear of the guy. Just a plot device that wasn't well integrated into continuity, I think.

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Katrina Nadja Romanoff - Feb 23, 2007 12:39 pm (#216 of 270)

Maybe Jo does a little confusion with all her character. Probably MacLaggen wasn't an old planned character. As Jo isn't very comfortable in writing quidditch, perhaps he comes from a necessity to fill 6year quidditch season. I don't remember any essential actions of his in the plot, it's likely he's just for quidditch and casually ended up between Ron and Hermione.

Jo has plannes only a forty students in harry year (I think five boys and five girls for each house and maybe she regrets because sounds so unnatural), in the other years could be whoever.

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Solitaire - Feb 24, 2007 2:28 pm (#217 of 270)

The idea that Harry wouldn't know Cormac before HBP is, in my opinion, preposterous.

I have twenty-seven students in my second period seventh grade language arts class; there are about 100 kids in that year. Up until 5th grade there were only about 80 in that year, and they were frequently together in various activities.

About a month ago, I called on one of my quieter students to answer a question, and I heard someone else in the class ask, "Who is XXX?" Mind you, the questioner has attended the same school with the quiet girl for the past 8 years! I am sorry to say this is not the first such incident, and I teach in a very small rural school. Face it ... kids are quite often oblivious to those who are not in their immediate social circles.

Someone like Harry is probably more focused on those who are his friends and those who can do him harm. Honestly ... I really do not think it sounds preposterous at all.

Solitaire

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peachespig - Feb 24, 2007 3:40 pm (#218 of 270)

I hear what you're saying, Solitaire, and if Harry went to a day school I wouldn't have nearly as hard a time believing it. After all, Harry and Cormac don't even share classes. But the fact that it's a boarding school, where the Gryffindors take 3 meals a day at the same single table, and most importantly, that they spend hours sharing the same common room night after night... Harry and Cormac must have crossed paths literally more than a thousand times before HBP. Add that to the fact that each Gryffindor class has just ten people, plus the fact that Harry had the ages 11-16 to figure it out, when he would presumably be a lot more observant and mature than a little kid would be, and it still strains credulity for me far past what seems reasonable.

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haymoni - Feb 26, 2007 9:13 am (#219 of 270)

I think Harry avoids other students. There are too many questions, too many stares. He likes being with those he knows - those he can trust. The only folks outside his year the he talks to belong to the Quidditch Team and Ginny.

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Mediwitch - Feb 26, 2007 3:09 pm (#220 of 270)

"We could have all been killed-- or worse, expelled!"
haymoni, I think you've made an excellent point (but we should include Luna, too). Harry hates being stared at and talked about, and trust is definitely an issue! Well said.

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haymoni - Feb 27, 2007 11:35 am (#221 of 270)

Funny - I just posted this over at the Luna thread. You are absolutely right about her. She is one of the few people who likes Harry for just being Harry. She doesn't ask anything of him.

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Katrina Nadja Romanoff - Feb 28, 2007 7:28 am (#222 of 270)

Harry is quite close to some hufflepuff too since DA meetings. Haymoni, what you said is the most likely thus far, expecially because Harry has got isolated in his fifth year, but still I can't believe he had no clue who Cormac was. Just think JKR didn't planned him, so she didn't knew him before HBP and erroneously took it new for harry too.

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Solitaire - Mar 7, 2007 8:42 pm (#223 of 270)

As I was one who felt it might be possible, I brought this issue up to my seventh graders the other day. A lot of them admitted that there were kids who'd been in their same class year (we are a small school) for several years, yet they would not be able to put faces with the names. If Harry were just any other kid, I might think it was a bit odd, even though he does not take any classes with Cormac so might not see him around the halls. Dinner does seem to have the whole house together, but breakfast seems kind of "whenever," and perhaps lunch is the same. More to the point, though, Harry is the focus of so much malice of one kind or another that he has his plate pretty full just dealing with his studies, his immediate circle of friends, and the Quidditch team. I think we have seen in the books, too, that he often avoids the common room when it is particularly crowded. I believe Haymoni is right about Harry sticking pretty close to his comfort group.

Solitaire

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Muggle Doctor - Mar 13, 2007 5:05 am (#224 of 270)

On the other hand, there is no doubting that at times Harry's powers of observation, deduction and reasoning have been quite dismal. Depending on what turns out to be true about Snape, HBP could have been the book that saw those powers turn around and start to mature, i.e. he finally started to see (and realize) not only some of the things that Dumbledore saw, but also some things that Dumbledore did not (e.g. the untrustworthy nature of Snape, the danger posed by Draco Malfoy). (Casts protego spell and waits for criticism Smile )

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Muggle Doctor - Aug 15, 2007 8:32 am (#225 of 270)

Whoops. My words remain here to haunt me. Clearly Snape's part was planned, but Draco appears to have excelled himself here.

On another note: Hannah Abbott returns! (To avenge the death of her mother.) I was really glad to see her back, and it would appear she survived to the very end, or at least she is not named as dead. Hopefully she isn't one of the fallen fifty.

Now that there is an Abbott in the graveyard in Godric's Hollow, does that make her the daughter of a wizard father and Muggle (and hence murdered) mother? Or is she what I understand Muggleborns really are... the great great (however many times) granddaughter of a squib, but still with the magical gene able to emerge down the line? I'd always thought she was a Muggleborn.

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 2:01 am

Chemyst - Aug 16, 2007 6:15 am (#226 of 270)
"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
Hopefully she (Hannah Abbott) isn't one of the fallen fifty.

I don't think she is. In fact, I have come to convince myself that we would not recognize any of those fifty names. We had quite enough death from among the people Harry did know. The purpose of the fifty faceless deaths seems to be mostly to give us a framework for the size and fierceness of the battle. I also think that very few of them would have been current students; and that the majority were former students who lived in and around Hogsmeade and heard of the battle the same way Hagrid did via Voldemort's amplified voice.

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Neville Longbottom - Aug 16, 2007 7:11 am (#227 of 270)

Hannah was mentioned in the last chapter, so she survived at the very least the first (and bigger) battle. Since that only means, that she was one of the characters, who could not be hurt anymore by Voldemort thanks to Harry's sacrifice, her survival is pretty likely. Though she could have been killed by a Death Eater, theoretically, but I don't think so.

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legolas returns - Aug 16, 2007 11:43 am (#228 of 270)

I would really like to know who died. Mainly to see who was brave enough to stay and fight-whether any of the army died etc. I hope she lets us know.

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Chemyst - Aug 18, 2007 6:35 pm (#229 of 270)

"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
I was surprised by the development of Crabbe in DH. In HBP he was still doing remedial work after failing to pass OWLs. By DH he was dangerously powerful.

I think it was JKR's intention to surprise us with his increased skill because in a parallel revelation she said that even his voice is "oddly soft for someone with his huge frame." And she has Neville further explain that under the Carrow's tutalege, Crabbe developed a powerful Cruciatus Curse saying it was, "the first time (he was) the best in anything."

In the Chapter 31, Battle of Hogwarts thread, legolas returns said, "At least in this chapter Malfoy seems to be using his brains. Crabbe and Goyle have none so they just seem intent on getting Harry rather than wondering why he wants to Diadem."

I guess when you start talking about 'having brains' there can be two ways to go with that; 1. wisdom-brains and 2. aptitude-brains. Crabbe has none of the insight & commonsense of the wisdom variety of brains, but making himself invisible with "diss-lusion" charms, bringing down 50 feet of junk at once with "desendo," using AK's, Crucio, and conjuring fiendfyre all showed an aptitude and proficiency we had not seen in him before. Who knew he could do all that?

And there was the third surprise– He was powerful enough to destroy the diadem horcrux, even though he did not know or care about why the diadem was important.

It is good that he was a minor character and in effect died from his own mistake. If Umbridge had seen the potential in Crabbe that Amycus Carrow brought out in him, he'd probably have been a lot more dangerous sooner.

Even though JKR said she scrapped the "magic late in life" character, Crabbe developed some anyway.

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Choices - Aug 19, 2007 11:25 am (#230 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Well, the Fiendfyre is what actually destroyed the diadem/Horcrux. I figured the Fiendfyre was not that difficult a spell if Crabbe could do it, but it was Dark Magic so the good guys would not have been using it.

As to the developing magic late in life.....Crabbe has always been magical. He wouldn't be at Hogwarts if he weren't. JKR's magic late in life character was supposed to be someone who had not previously done magic - like a Squib or a Muggle.

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megfox* - Aug 19, 2007 6:56 pm (#231 of 270)

I thought that it was interesting that the magic that Crabbe was suddenly able to do well (and I guess Goyle, although we aren't shown that much) was Dark magic. They were being encouraged to "explore" that part of their abilities. Remembering what Bella said about the Unforgivables - "you have to mean them", and I think that this makes a very powerful statement about what has been going on at Hogwarts this year. They were encouraged to really mean what they were doing - encouraging students, underage wizards, to learn, utilize, and perfect their Dark talents - ! It seems like brainwashing to me... And for Crabbe and Goyle to show that they are talented at them, that they can perform these Dark Arts skills even without being able to pronounce them properly... Scary... Obviously, the Carrows were allowed a great deal of leeway, even though the other teachers were trying to undermine what they were doing. They must have made Umbridge look like one of her kitten plates!

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maria cloos - Sep 4, 2007 1:15 pm (#232 of 270)

Definitely brainwashing, megafox. Remember what Neville said about DADA becoming just Dark Arts and what they were forcing them to learn in Muggle studies? and yes, I agree they were far worse than Umbridge on her worst day. Even the other teachers avoided reporting the wrongdoers to the Carrows, if they could help it. I would love to see what actually went on during that year, since we just get a small description from Neville.
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Mrs. Sirius - Sep 11, 2007 10:33 am (#233 of 270)

Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
Two things, 1. Yes, Harry is remarkably limited on other students at the school, I wish I had my notes but in books 1 and 2 it is noticeable that Harry is not very observant. Hermione always has to bring him up to speed and he is always surprised. By book 3 and 4 you can forgive him his self absorption.

2. Concerning McClaggen, in college I majored in threatre. We had all our classes together and then had to put in shop hours after classes and rehersals. I walked into class one day and noticed a girl I had never noticed before. At first I wondered if she were new, but she had been there, I some how overlooked her after weeks of being together, in close quarters, virtually living in each others pockets. One example I recall is the howlers. Neville had gotten one but Harry was totally unaware of it.

As for JKR not planning a character, fa’ ged aboud’ id.

As for power and wisdom, do you not ever have a classmate who could get all the geometry or the trigonometry problems but could figure out how to say “hello, how are“, could figure out which end of the trumpet to blow on? or couldn't’t take a recipe out of a cook book and double it? A classmate who could figure out all the science problems but knew not a single figure from history? I don’t think it’s any different creating fiendfyre or a dissillutionment charm.

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Solitaire - Sep 18, 2007 6:45 am (#234 of 270)

Perhaps Neville's Howler came at other than regular mail time. Didn't Hedwig occasionally appear at unusual times and places over the course of the series? Perhaps Neville's Howler came to the dorm room, when Harry was out on one of his little "jaunts."

Solitaire

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Mrs. Sirius - Sep 18, 2007 1:24 pm (#235 of 270)

Mom of 4 in serious lurker mode.
I agree Solitaire, it could be easily explained that the day Neville got his howler, Harry was not there.

BUT... other kids probably got them and there was much talk after Ron had gotten his howler. So there was probably talk after Neville or the other kids had gotten theirs. Harry was still clueless.

There are other examples of things that similar, Harry is unaware of these happenings which could be explained because he was out that day. But there are too many for all of them to be explained that way.

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PeskyPixie - Sep 24, 2007 5:13 pm (#236 of 270)

I love Ernie MacMillan! Even when he thought Harry was the heir of Slytherin, his pompous attitude cracked me up (ex: 'Caught in the act!').

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PeskyPixie - Sep 25, 2007 7:48 pm (#237 of 270)

I took the 'lesser Potter characters' quiz today and I'm Ernie Macmillan !

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Solitaire - Jul 5, 2009 7:41 pm (#238 of 270)

I've come up as Ginny Weasley and Neville Longbottom, depending on my mood, I guess! LOL Really, those two seem to have little in common besides loving Harry and being Gryffindors.

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Hieronymus Graubart - Aug 23, 2009 7:33 am (#239 of 270)

Looking for the “good” Slytherin student:

Millicent Bulstrode did, as far as I remember, never do or say anything pro-Voldemort or anti-muggle-born. (If Harry had ever recognized her as a member of Pansie’s gang we should have read something like “Millicent Bulstrode and the rest of Pansy Parkinsons’s gang of Slytherin girls”).

The Lexicon says that Millicent started the physical combat with Hermione at the Duelling Club, but this may be based on the prejudice that Hermione couldn’t be the “bad” girl. Wasn’t Harry too occupied with Draco to watch the beginning of this fight? Didn’t he only see the two girls already rolling on the floor? Didn’t Hermione need physical contact to grab a hair from a Slytherin?

Even if Millicent was the first who resorted to physical force at the Duelling Club, this doesn’t proof an anti-muggle-born attitude. It seems to have been quite common when the wand-work failed, and Ron advised Harry to do it to Draco in the Midnight Duel.

For some years I believed that Millicent Bulstrode was nearly as close to Draco as were Crabbe and Goyle, and that this was the reason why Hermione had choosen to polyjuice into Millicent. But rereading CS I couldn’t find any evidence. Hermione didn’t select Millicent, they were paired by Snape and Hermione just used (or made) the first opportunity to take a hair from a random Slytherin.

Dolores Umbridge wasn’t a death eater while she teached at Hogwarts (she may have become later) and she didn’t really intent to recruit death nibblers for the Inquisitorial Squad. The IS was expected to be loyal to the ministry and, above all, to its representative, the High Inquisitor. Umbridge may have realised that she had been betrayed by at least one member of the IS when Draco showed too much interest in Hermione’s “weapon”.

As long as we have no other evidence, we have to assume that Millicent Bulstrode joined the IS not because she was a death nibbler, but because she wanted to support her government, being prepared to fight a Dark Lord as well as rebellious students and mad headmasters when a trustworthy authority pointed at him saying “This is an enemy of the wizarding society”.

Of course it was a mistake to trust Umbridge and Fudge. When the Dark Lord, whose very existence had been denied by the ministry, eventually showed in public, Millicent had to look for other trustworthy authorities. Her first joice would probably be her not-mad-at-all Headmaster, who had been right all the time.

If we had ever seen a Slytherin student fighting for Hogwarts, it would probably have been Millicent Bulstrode.

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Solitaire - Aug 23, 2009 4:47 pm (#240 of 270)

Umbridge was just plain evil, and it had nothing to do with Voldemort, IMO.

My comment about Millie was that she was unpleasant-looking, based on Harry's observations. She also seems to have been a bit of a thug, based on her use of the headlock ... which is certainly a Muggle tactic. Of course, that's just my take. I do find it interesting that a Slytherin kid would resort to Muggle methods of fighting.

I'm not sure what you mean about her not being part of Pansy's group. She was a member of Umbridge's Inquisitorial Squad in OP, which pretty much puts her in the same camp with Pansy, Draco, Crabbe and Goyle. The fact that she was not specifically named as part of Pansy's group doesn't seem that important ... although maybe it should. I don't know.

I think it is interesting that neither Nott nor Zabini were in the Inquisitorial Squad. I wonder why not. Are they considered "good Slytherins"? I didn't like Zabini's remark about Ginny on the train, but that could have been due to feeling peer pressure from fellow Slytherins. Think where he was when he said it. Still, those two sat with the other Slytherins in advanced potions and seemed happy to make fun of the other kids when Draco & Co. did.

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Chemyst - Aug 25, 2009 7:03 am (#241 of 270)

"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
I figured it was unlikely that Millicent and Pansy were close. The main reason is the name that JKR chose – Millicent. It seems that if she were Pansy's friend she'd be a Kimmie or a Barbie, or at least go by Millie or Mils. Also, based on the description of her physical attributes, I doubt that she looked cool enough for Pansy to want to hang with her.

So I got to looking up the denotation and Millicent means "she with the gentle gait." ! and her last name is Bull-strode. An Oxymoron. (There was one other Millicent in the series, Fudge replaced Millicent Bagnold about whom nothing else is known except her years as MOM, 1980–1990.) I just don't see JKR ever planing any clues that the two girls were anything more than housemates.

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Solitaire - Aug 25, 2009 7:13 am (#242 of 270)

Isn't Bulstrode the name one of the darker, more manipulative, power-wielding characters in Middlemarch? The name has negative connotations, to me.

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Madam Pince - Aug 25, 2009 10:21 am (#243 of 270)

The eyes are the windows to the soul...
I figured JKR meant for us to think of her in a negative way, simply by the name she chose for her. I mean... "Millicent Bulstrode"... honestly! I suppose that's completely unfair, but to me it has nothing but negative connotations, and I'm not even familiar with Middlemarch!

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PeskyPixie - Aug 25, 2009 11:01 am (#244 of 270)

Isn't she described as mean-looking in CoS?

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Hieronymus Graubart - Aug 25, 2009 11:45 pm (#245 of 270)

Solitaire, I tried to point out that being a member of the IS doesn't necessarily put Millicent into the same camp with Pansy, Draco, Crabbe and Goyle, because they may have quite different reasons to be there.

Whenever we see Millicent, there is no sign of Pansy's group (even in the IS there is only Pansy herself). Whenever we see Pansy's gang Harry doesn't seem to know their names, but he knows and recognizes Millicent when we see her. So Millicent is probably a loner.

Good point, Chemyst, I didn't think of this: Pansy wouldn't want this mean-looking ugly thud with the gentle Bull-strode in her gang.

JKR gave us many reasons to think of Millicent in a negative way, but not a single fact to use against her. So what did she expect us to do?

I'm not sure what I should think about Zabini and Nott. Did they not join the Inquisitorial Squad because they where death-nibblers, but not as clever as Draco & Co, and didn't want to support the government? Did they not want to support Umbridge because she was too mean and they, not being death-nibblers, had no reason to pretend their support?

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Steve Newton - Aug 26, 2009 6:39 am (#246 of 270)

Librarian
Zabini is sort of interesting in an obnoxious sort of way. On the train he is clearly full of full blood prejudice but voices nothing in favor of Voldemort. He seems to be polite to Draco but not anything more.

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PeskyPixie - Aug 26, 2009 10:42 am (#247 of 270)

I just read the bit in the Duelling Club. Hermione gives Millicent a smile which Millicent doesn't return. She is also described as jutting her jaw aggressively. Whether Millicent is a friend of Pansy's or not, I think that JKR means for her to be a snotty Slytherin.

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Solitaire - Aug 26, 2009 4:32 pm (#248 of 270)

they may have quite different reasons to be there.

What reasons? They were all there, IMHO, because (1) they liked the idea of being able to pick on other kids and not get into trouble for it, and (2) they liked having power over the other kids.

I agree, Pesky, that the readers are intended to see Millie as a bit of a bully, like Pansy. She is also described somewhere as "no pixie," which tells me she is a BIG girl. I'm not sure why, but I've always kind of thought of her as a female version of Crabbe and Goyle.

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Julia H. - Aug 27, 2009 1:50 am (#249 of 270)

I'm not sure why...

Perhaps because Hermione was going to impersonate her when Ron and Harry impersonated Crabbe and Goyle. I also had the impression that she was big and not particularly likable.

Also, based on the description of her physical attributes, I doubt that she looked cool enough for Pansy to want to hang with her. (Chemyst)

I don't know... her ugliness could bring out Pansy's much better looks if they were hanging out together.

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PeskyPixie - Aug 27, 2009 8:44 am (#250 of 270)

But Pansy looks like a pug!

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Post  Elanor Wed May 04, 2011 2:02 am

mona amon - Aug 27, 2009 8:44 am (#251 of 270)
But pugs are so cute!

EDIT: All the same, I guess JKR did mean it to be uncomplimentary. She said she detests Pansy.

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Julia H. - Aug 27, 2009 9:11 am (#252 of 270)

If Pansy is unattractive, it may be even more important for her to have someone even uglier by her side.

JKR dislikes her, but she is good enough for Draco. Perhaps she is still the prettiest of those who are eligible from Draco's viewpoint.

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PeskyPixie - Aug 27, 2009 9:17 am (#253 of 270)

LOL, pugs are cute as pugs, but I pity the human girl with a puglike face! (I find rats to be absolutely adorable as well, but I doubt I'd find Pettigrew even mildly attractive. )

Methinks that Pansy cares more for Draco than Draco cares for her. (Yuck, we never really watch the Slytherins grow up, and I had a nasty mental image of Draco's first kiss with Miss Pugface. )

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Solitaire - Aug 28, 2009 7:47 pm (#254 of 270)

Julia: her ugliness could bring out Pansy's much better looks if they were hanging out together.
Pesky: But Pansy looks like a pug!
Mona: But pugs are so cute!
Julia: If Pansy is unattractive, it may be even more important for her to have someone even uglier by her side.
Pesky: LOL, pugs are cute as pugs, but I pity the human girl with a puglike face!

ROTFLOL!! I am dying laughing here, ladies!

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PeskyPixie - Aug 29, 2009 10:48 am (#255 of 270)


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Chemyst - Aug 29, 2009 8:57 pm (#256 of 270)

"Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up." A.A. Milne
'Not cool' and 'ugly' are not quite the same thing. I suppose that might be splitting (cat) hairs though.

What reasons? They were all there, IMHO, because (1) they liked the idea of being able to pick on other kids and not get into trouble for it, and (2) they liked having power over the other kids.
A third might be that there were perks in kissing up to Umbridge.

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rambkowalczyk - Aug 30, 2009 9:15 am (#257 of 270)

Pansy may only look like a pug when she is scowling, nasty, etc which may be 90% of the time that Harry sees her.

She might actually be pretty the other 10% of the time.

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Solitaire - Aug 30, 2009 2:17 pm (#258 of 270)

Chemyst, I think the kissing-up was part of it, as well.

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Orion - Sep 3, 2009 12:09 pm (#259 of 270)

Pugs again! Pugfaced girls look really cute, with their round faces and their upturned noses. I know JKR didn't mean it to sound nice, but in fact she described the sort of girl she probably detested in high school: Quite sexy, reckless, not very talented academically but smart in a "will survive anything probably even a nuclear war, like cockroaches" way, popular with the lads. I always picture Pansy as very attractive, that's why Draco hangs out with her. He fancies himself to be the coolest, so he has to have the most attractive girl.

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me and my shadow 813 - Sep 3, 2009 12:38 pm (#260 of 270)

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I agree, Orion. My motto with JKR's Sorting habit is: all unattractive students are Slytherins but not all Slytherins are unattractive. Obviously Zabini was meant to be beautiful, but he is not the exception to the rule. I think the actress they used in HBP as Pansy was very good: a pretty girl with that tough edge. Scrappy!

Also, I do think Hermione described Pansy as academically smart...?

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PeskyPixie - Sep 4, 2009 9:47 am (#261 of 270)

LOL, Orion, I don't find pug-faced girls to be pretty, but I guess they are popular with the boys.

Hmmm, I don't remember Hermione calling Pansy smart. I'd love it if someone could find that part for me.

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Steve Newton - Sep 4, 2009 10:08 am (#262 of 270)

Librarian
I don't recall Hermione saying anything like that either.

There was once a thread started by Prefect Marcus about Pansy and Harry. The idea didn't pan out but it would be a great source of infomation about Pansy. I can't remember what it was called but will scout around for it.

AHA! Got it. Its 'Harry's 'ship uniting the houses.' in the Theories Group Section folder.

Sorry, I don't know how to link to it.

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Solitaire - Sep 4, 2009 8:09 pm (#263 of 270)

Poor Marcus! He'd really have to eat his words on that one, wouldn't he?

Harry's 'Ship Uniting Houses."

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Odo the Hero - Jul 7, 2010 11:21 am (#264 of 270)

There is a character named Hannah Abbot in A Prayer for Owen Meany by John Irving. I think she is just a minor character - so far she has only been mentioned as one of a number of girls Owen finds attractive when he and the narrator are 16, but a number of seemingly minor characters and events from early in the book have already recurred in significant ways, so this may yet happen (I'm about halfway through the book.)

Is anything known about the origin of Hannah Abbot's name (in HP)? I suppose it's a combination of relatively common names, so it may well be a coincidence (I can just hear Owen denying, in capital letters, the existence of coincidences) or come from some other person or character. This is especially likely if the character in Owen Meany turns out to have no further part in the story. However, I think it is fairly likely that Rowling read the book at some point; it was written by a reasonably well-known American author and published in 1989.

I think this is the right thread to post this in - I thought there was one about name origins specifically, but couldn't find it, if it exists.

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Solitaire - Jul 7, 2010 8:37 pm (#265 of 270)

Odo, I was sure there was such a thread and went through every group folder and all of the archived folders and discussions. Perhaps it is a thread that was munched, back when things got munched. Sorry I couldn't help!

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Choices - Jul 8, 2010 6:54 am (#266 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
I may be remembering wrong, but I thought it was mixed in with the Alchemy thread. I think it was there that we discussed the meanings/significance of certain words/names.

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Odo the Hero - Jul 8, 2010 7:24 pm (#267 of 270)

I finished the book; there are no more references in it to Hannah Abbot, so unless JKR was opening books off her shelf and picking names at random (unlikely) the name probably doesn't come from Owen Meany. Still, I was interested to find it, and amused that it immediately occurred to me that it could be a source for HP.

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Solitaire - Jul 8, 2010 10:08 pm (#268 of 270)

I don't think it's impossible, Odo. If she liked the book, that could be her way of honoring it. After all, Mrs. Norris is the name of a Jane Austen character!

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Odo the Hero - Jul 10, 2010 6:58 pm (#269 of 270)

I don't think it's at all impossible, it just seems unlikely. Mrs. Norris is mentioned 18 times in the first chapter of Mansfield Park alone, whereas Hannah Abbot is mentioned only once in A Prayer for Owen Meany. (Interestingly, a couple of that book's names are derivative - Owen Meany's initials are, according to Wikipedia, a reference to a character in The Tin Drum by Gunter Grass, while Hester's name almost certainly comes from The Scarlet Letter.) Also, if the name were Blaise Zabini or Rufus Scrimgeour, it would be a different matter, but Hannah Abbot is fairly generic.

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Choices - Jul 11, 2010 10:05 am (#270 of 270)

*Completely Obsessed With Harry Potter*
Maybe Elanor will take notice of this discussion and give what information she may have concerning Hannah Abbot's name. She and RPS (Round Pink Spider) have given some fascinating info about names and their meanings on the Alchemy thread.

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