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septentrion - Jun 25, 2007 3:53 am (#2451 of 2974)
I'm very glad with my own Acceptable. This Wombat was very difficult, I did a lot of guess work.
vanessa cave - Jun 25, 2007 5:00 am (#2452 of 2974)
Hi My Goodness i got an Exceeds Expectations, which exceeded my expectations. I have to say the last one was mostly guess work. I feel so pleased, my inner Hermione wants to print them off and display them (two EE's and one Outstanding) But my inner Ron is laughing and telling me to act my age(30)
Good Evans - Jun 25, 2007 5:06 am (#2453 of 2974)
oh boo!!!! I am at work and my code is at home!!!!!! rats rats and treble rats
edit : HAHA HAHA - I am a resourceful Gryffindor if nothing else!! - youngest is at home today - so I rang him for my student code ...
I got an E !! so that is grade 1 = E Grade 2 = O and Grade 3 = E
happy with that!!!!
edit 2 : Vanessa - all three of mine - well two until I get home tonight - are proudly displayed on the wall next to the PC. OK I haven't had them framed or anything - but I think you should display them - go girl !! (oh and I am 8 years older than you!!!)
well done everyone - wouldn't it have been nice to have had a graduation certificate from Hogwarts if you had sat all three? just something a bit extra? oh well -- I have printed out my gold edged certificate and am really pleased with the effort. This Wombat of them all was not easy!!!
journeymom - Jun 25, 2007 5:25 am (#2454 of 2974)
I got an Exceeds Expectations! Like Vanessa said, that completely exceeded my expectations!
I DO wish we could see the answers.
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 25, 2007 6:40 am (#2455 of 2974)
Woohoo! I got an O! I honestly don't know how I pulled that one off. Must have been magic! That makes my third one.
Mrs. Sirius - Jun 25, 2007 6:45 am (#2456 of 2974)
Oh no, the results are in. I am afraid to go look at my results. In this one while I may not have score a T I don't think I did well. I took the test with out having first looked at it and thought about it and I did it only once as usual in the middle of the night. Silly me was trying to get my kids to take it too.
I go check my results, I feel an ominous drum roll tum tum tummm
No there must have been a mistake I can't have gotten an "O"!! I really can't believe it. I was sure I had bombed and wanted to take it over a few more time.
Oh, congratulations Madame Pomfrey well done. I got only 2 O and 1 A.
I can't wait to tell my kids. ME ? a teaching post at Hogwarts? waaooooo
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 25, 2007 7:00 am (#2457 of 2974)
Mrs.Sirius,Only 2 O's ? That is wonderful! I consider these to be very hard tests. Congratulations to everyone!
painting sheila - Jun 25, 2007 9:04 am (#2458 of 2974)
I am afraid to look!
Edit: Oh the shame! The shame!
I brought home a Dreadful!!! I failed!!!
It says though "Do not take your grade too much to heart, for this was an extremely difficult examination. A new textbook will be available on July 21st 2007, which will enable more effective study. In the meantime, console yourself with the thought that there was a large number of trolls."
Mrs. Sirius - Jun 25, 2007 9:47 am (#2459 of 2974)
lol, You have to love that woman!
Good Evans - Jun 25, 2007 10:53 am (#2460 of 2974)
Oh Sheila !!!! Do you think the hint is that you can resit at some time? wont that be fun!!!!!
Phelim Mcintyre - Jun 25, 2007 11:07 am (#2461 of 2974)
I think I may be a troll - will let you know when I check my results.
John Bumbledore - Jun 25, 2007 11:09 am (#2462 of 2974)
I sat the W.O.M.B.A.T. Grade 2 twice, first from work and scored an E, then from home and scored an A.
I sat the W.O.M.B.A.T. Grade 3 twice, both from work and both scores were O.
I was sure I had a T on this last test, that is why I tried the second time.
I am hoping that after DH has been out for some time that we may have another chance to sit for each grade of the W.O.M.B.A.T.
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
painting sheila - Jun 25, 2007 12:17 pm (#2463 of 2974)
JKR if you are reading this . . . please let me retest!!!
I must have had brain freeze or something!
Tazzygirl - Jun 25, 2007 3:45 pm (#2464 of 2974)
I'm sorry, Sheila! I hope Jo lets you retest!
I love Jo's little speeches on the certificates. Too funny!
Good Evans - Jun 26, 2007 12:00 am (#2465 of 2974)
I do think that the wording suggests they may well become available for resit again at some time - that will be fun! I wonder if she will just make them generally available on the site with an auto scoring system (I dont know how difficult that would be to set up - but assumedly it can be done)
totyle - Jun 26, 2007 12:16 am (#2466 of 2974)
Oh wow!..I seriously wonder how these tests are marked..or I just got seriously lucky. This was my first Wombat and I breezed through it picking answers randomly and intuitively. I must have spent less than 5 minutes (I dont know I wasnt keeping count but the hour glass had more than 90% of sand still left when I got to the end) and I got an A. I havent read any parts of the Lexicon apart from the Forum and the Essays, so I really didnt have any extra references to any of the questions too.
...somebody mustve spiked my pumpkin juice...!
painting sheila - Jun 26, 2007 8:16 am (#2467 of 2974)
totyle - Did you drink any gold colored liquid before you started? Maybe a little Felix juice?
Edit: Can some one at least pretend to get a Dreadful or a Troll? (sniff sniff)
Anna L. Black - Jun 26, 2007 9:44 am (#2468 of 2974)
~whispering~ I got an O!! I really couldn't believe my eyes, I never expected it. I got Es on the previous two.
DJ Evans - Jun 26, 2007 10:57 am (#2469 of 2974)
OK as I bow my head in shame (for not coming forward before now & I'm doing it just for Shelia's sake as it is...didn't want her to feel like she was the only one) but I'll admit that I got the dreaded Dreadful too. I'll go so far & even admit that I wasn't going to post about it....just too ashamed, afraid I might have my Harry Potter fan status taken away from me or something. Yet my score wouldn't come as a surprised to anyone in my family though, they know how my memory is about as long as a gnat's eyelash. And I have never been good with multiple choices either, even on the ones where you have a 50/50 chance. I should have known when after I finished the test & I thought to myself, "Hey, that was kinda easy" that it would come back to bite me. ***sigh*** lol
Nevertheless, I consider myself in very good company Shelia...maybe one of us will do much better if we are given a chance to re-take the test. I was sadden though to see that we don't even get a certificate for our Dreadful score, just a letter that goes back in the envelope & sits on the shelf. Wonder what the deal is on that?
Allison R - Jun 26, 2007 11:53 am (#2470 of 2974)
I'm a new member to the forum (::waving hello: but I've been lurking for about a week now, reading and getting to know you all a bit before posting. I'm thrilled to have found such a robust and active forum-- you are a very prolific bunch!!. On some threads I admit to having to resort to "mark as read", on others I have read eagerly posts dated as far back as 2003-- just because the subject matter was so interesting to me.
This was the first WOMBAT I was able to take, and like many of you I found myself wishing HRH had paid more attention in History of Magic Class so we could have peeked over their shoulders! (Okay, I would have happily settled for Hermoine's notes, Ron's and Harry's wouldn't have done anybody any good, now would they?!) Many of the questions did seem more logic and intuitive-based than stuff we could have picked up from previous books, so I was pretty apprehensive about my score. Imagine my delight and surprise to get an "Exceeds Expectations"! Hermione wouldn't have been satisfied with it, but I'm quite relieved.
I just wanted to be brave enough to finally post and say "hello". I look forward to getting to know you all better and becoming part of your community here-- and I thank you for so much thoughtful commentary and theories for me to go back and read through!! I'm quite enjoying hearing you all think out loud and learning lots = )
juliebug - Jun 26, 2007 12:32 pm (#2471 of 2974)
I think that the first one I took could have been Dreadful or even Troll worthy. Everytime I try to check it's results, I get an error message saying I'm entering the wrong code. The second one I took got marked as Acceptable, which was probably way more than I deserved.
journeymom - Jun 26, 2007 1:09 pm (#2472 of 2974)
...just too ashamed, afraid I might have my Harry Potter fan status taken away from me or something. DJEvans
Neville Longbottom - Jun 26, 2007 1:16 pm (#2473 of 2974)
I think that the first one I took could have been Dreadful or even Troll worthy. Everytime I try to check it's results, I get an error message saying I'm entering the wrong code.
This happened to quite a few people. Did you maybe mistkae little "L" with big "i" or both with the numbr "1". Otherwise, a mistake between the number "0" and the letter "O" is also possible. Happened to me as well.
painting sheila - Jun 26, 2007 1:27 pm (#2474 of 2974)
Thank you DJ Evans!! whew! I was worrying there for awhile.
I have decided that I must have taken the test during a glitch in the computer when all test taken in that 5 minute time period were graded with a "D".
DJ Evans - Isn't it odd how you and I both happened to hit the same glitch? Wonder what the odds are?
I will happily take it on the chin for all our other forumners. (such a martyr!)
Welcome Allison R!!! So glad to meet you and can't wait to hear you views on everything Harry Potter!
DJ Evans - Jun 26, 2007 2:57 pm (#2475 of 2974)
Journeymom...thank you! Glad to know I'm not at risk of losing face & being dis-Potter or something.
Shelia: Isn't it odd how you and I both happened to hit the same glitch? Wonder what the odds are?
Hey! I like that thought, yep I think I go with that too & stick with that story myself. lol
riotgrrrl - Jun 26, 2007 2:57 pm (#2476 of 2974)
Holy cricket- I got an "O". I lost my code for the other 2 Wombat but I believe I got an A and an E on those- although I have to say most of the answers I give are purely gut and intuition with a little memory mixed in for good measure- I never happen to have the books handy when I take the test. Since we've never learned the actual answers to the test I'm forced to assume that it is possible that the grades are given at random- but then why the crazy intricate codes? Oh well, I'm just glad we are still able to get our results- my connection has been down for 4 days and I'm going a bit mad....as is obvious from my rambling...
Madam Pince - Jun 26, 2007 4:09 pm (#2477 of 2974)
(((hugs Deb and Sheila))) We love you still! Just think, Fred and George didn't get such great grades either, but look how universally popular and financially successful they are!
Welcome, Allison! Glad to have you here!
I bet the "no certificate" thing is because it is technically a "no pass" grade, don't you think? Meaning you'd have to re-sit the test to get the "qualification." If this was real.
painting sheila - Jun 26, 2007 6:24 pm (#2478 of 2974)
I'll be Fred! You can be George, DJ!!
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 26, 2007 7:02 pm (#2479 of 2974)
Well said,Madame Pince. Hear,Hear! Welcome to the forum,Allison and welcome back D.J. I havn't seen you post in awhile.
Allison R - Jun 26, 2007 8:43 pm (#2480 of 2974)
Thank you so much for the warm welcomes! Sheila, I peeked behind your name and my kids and I had lots of fun this afternoon doing the HP personality quizzes you have linked there. My 11-year old was mortified when she turned out to be most like LV, but we thought it was hysterical! Hey, he's wickedly smart, very talented and stands up to the death to defend the strength of his convictions, right? Okay, those convictions are twisted and evil, but he defends them to the end! I think she should be flattered LOL (I was most like Prof. McGonigall)
Thora - Jun 27, 2007 6:12 am (#2481 of 2974)
I got an Acceptable. Do you think the reference to places that are accepting applications is a subtle peek at the state of things in DH?
John Bumbledore - Jun 27, 2007 6:26 am (#2482 of 2974)
Edited Jun 27, 2007 7:04 am
juliebug, I've had some success with "cracking" mistyped or mistaken W.O.M.B.A.T. student IDs. If you send it to me by email I can run a few permutations on character substitutions and see if any are valid. If you recorded it by hand, we can add 'zee', 'two', 'six', 'bee', upper case 'kay', lower case 'kay' and perhaps a few more to the previous list of 'one', 'el', 'aye', 'oh', and 'zero' to the look alike list (depending on, erm, how 'distictive' one's handwriting is.
She and Deb, don't forget your also in the company of Fred, George, and Hagrid. No! No! I meant that in a good way!
She, I did see the local paper's 77 word contest. Did you hear about the screening of OP in the IMAX theater?
Allison R, welcome to the forum.
I do hope Jo does see fit to bring the W.O.M.B.A.T. test back each year. Afterall, there will always be new 'students' discovering both her books and her website.
For anyone that wants a shotcut to the W.O.M.B.A.T. results site you can use your favorite site address (like [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and then add /wombat/en/ (en for English, fr for French, de for German, it for Italian, and es for Spanish) such as [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] or [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] or [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Edit to add a wave to Thora. Of course you are remembered, silly which witch! [Thank you for not [sic]-ing me, Pam] We don't forget friends! You were missed! and Welcome back!
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
* Pause your mouse pointer over a smile to see it's quick-edit code:
If you type in your post you will instead see which is "cool" isn't it?
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jun 27, 2007 6:52 am (#2483 of 2974)
"Of course you are remembered, silly which!"
LOL, which witch?
painting sheila - Jun 27, 2007 7:34 am (#2484 of 2974)
John - NO!! I didn't see it at the Imax. I have been looking on line bt haven't seen it.
I will head downtown today and see if I can buy tickets already - I am SO excited!! Thanks!
John Bumbledore - Jun 27, 2007 7:45 am (#2485 of 2974)
Edited Jun 27, 2007 8:38 am
"Of course you are remembered, silly which!" — [my bulnder]
LOL, which witch? — Pam (TwinklingBlueEyes)
Okay, so that old witch of a "which" is one nasty witch of a word for me, but I still got my **Outstanding on the W.O.M.B.A.T. Grade 3 to console me.
And speaking of word choice, I have re-read the FAQ poll and again notice Jo uses two different verbs when she talks about "tell" the secret. I tried to point it out when she first made the update but was either not noticed or dismissed. The quotes for sharing or including another in the secret while maintaining the secret is, "Everybody in whom [the secret keeper] confided will continue to know the hidden information, but nobody else." The "revaling" quote is , "The information is hidden inside the chosen person, or Secret-Keeper, and is henceforth impossible to find -- unless, of course, the Secret-Keeper chooses to divulge it." [Emphasis is mine]
That nails it to the wall for me. The information is impossible to find — unlsess the Secret-Keeper chooses to divulge it. Divulge verb"To disclose in a breach of confidence: betray, blab, expose, give away, let out, reveal, tell, uncover, unveil. Informal spill. Archaic discover. Idioms: let slip, let the cat out of the bag, spill the beans, tell all. See show/hide." ("divulge." Roget's II: The New Thesaurus, Third Edition. Houghton Mifflin Company, 1995. Answers.com 27 Jun. 2007. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] *edited to remove the link.
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix: An IMAX 3D Experience
Wednesday July 11th 2007 ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
*Edit 07:54 AM 06-27-2007 by John
**Edit 11:34 AM 06-27-2007 by John
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jun 27, 2007 7:59 am (#2486 of 2974)
John, I do know which witch I am...
...toddles off giggling to self, ...which witch was in the witches coven with which witch?...
Die Zimtzicke - Jun 27, 2007 8:08 am (#2487 of 2974)
Nice to see discussion again about something besides wombats. I don't get into that, but I like to discuss other stuff on Jo's site. I sometimes wish the wombat talk could be kept in the wombat thread. I see lots of posts about Jo's site, and I get excited thinking she's put something new up I've missed, but when I look at the posts, it's all wombat junk.
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jun 27, 2007 8:15 am (#2488 of 2974)
Very true Die, and to try and get back on topic, JKR's official site is truly bewitching!
Now which witch is bewitched is up to ya'll, be it this witch or which witch, LOL!
DJ Evans - Jun 27, 2007 8:24 am (#2489 of 2974)
Has anyone else kinda wondered who the next "Wizard of the Month" might be? With this being the last one before the final book comes out, I was thinking wouldn't it be cool if Harry was the one picked? Oh don't worry, I haven't lost it (my mind) quite yet & I know it isn't very likely to happen but I did think it would be neat for it to be Harry.
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jun 27, 2007 8:27 am (#2490 of 2974)
TBE wonders what Deb will think the "Wizard of the Month" card might read if it was Harry?
DJ Evans - Jun 27, 2007 9:00 am (#2491 of 2974)
lol TBE Hmmm, what would it say? Something along the lines of:
...Known throughout the Wizarding World as "The Boy Who Lived" for having survive an AK that was cast on him by LV. Nowadays he is recognized as "The Man Who Lived" to defeat the evil LV & brought peaceful times back to the Wizarding World.
Or something to that effect.
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jun 27, 2007 9:02 am (#2492 of 2974)
Very good ad lib, LOL!
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 27, 2007 9:12 am (#2493 of 2974)
Harry Potter 1981-?
Known as the Boy Who Lived and The Chosen One. Only known surviver of the Killing Curse.Has escaped You-Know-Who 5 times.Helped start and ministered an organization known as the D.A. A very tallented young wizard known to produce a patronus at the age of 13.
What it won't say
Harry Potter 1981-? The Chosen One. Best known for his defeat of the Wizarding Worlds darkest wizard known as Lord Voldemort.
Sorry,D.J. I couldn't resist.
Nathan Zimmermann - Jun 27, 2007 10:05 am (#2494 of 2974)
Madam Pomfrey, a slight correction Harry Potter 1980 not 1981. The Boy who Lived, The Chosen One. Best known for his defeat of the Wizarding Worlds darkest wizard known as Lord Voldemort.
Harry was born in 1980 not 1981.
juliebug - Jun 27, 2007 10:10 am (#2495 of 2974)
Thanks so much John for the very thoughtful offer to help me with my WOMBAT ID number. I decided to give it one more try, and this time it worked. It was a lower case l (el) that was messing me up. Is there room for one more in the dreadful club? Maybe I could be Neville? Lee Jordan?
John Bumbledore - Jun 27, 2007 10:12 am (#2496 of 2974)
Sorry, another suggestion for Choices version:
"A very talented young wizard known to produce a fully corporeal patronus at the age of 15."
From the Lexicon...
Lucius Malfoy sneeringly called Harry this after the latter's disciplinary hearing, when the word got out that Harry was capable of casting a corporeal Patronus (OP9).
This of course referring to Dudley Demented, when he was age 15. We know that he first cast a Corporeal Patronus in his third year to save Sirius (and himself) from a swarm of Dementors. That wasn't know outside Harry, Hermione, and Dumbledore. And DD may have only guessed at it after Harry recounted how he thought he saw his father across the lake... if DD though "but my how you look more and more like your father." I think DD saw H and H in the pumpkin patch and put that together with a missing hippogriff and a James Potter look-alike casting a powerful patronus charm (knowing that Remus had taught Harry). Smart wizard, he is, that DD.
Didn't someone later in the book say it would have taken a very powerful wizard to have done that? (or was that movie or just my active imagination?)
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
azi - Jun 27, 2007 10:22 am (#2497 of 2974)
Now I'm hoping that Harry will be wizard of the month in August (July could give the book away couldn't it)!
Luna Logic - Jun 27, 2007 10:30 am (#2498 of 2974)
Edited by Jun 27, 2007 10:49 am
As we had two Founders as last wizards of the month, why not a third ? We had a woman (Helga Hufflepuff), then a man (Salazar Slytherin), so why not now another woman, Rowena Ravenclaw? I hope to see the notice: " Creator of the Room of Requirement..."
John Bumbledore - Jun 27, 2007 10:33 am (#2499 of 2974)
Edited Jun 27, 2007 11:14 am
Have we had Godric Griffendor before? Or is it a famous wizarding card that I remember? Ah, the cards of the founders:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
But Slytherin doesn't look the same on the Wizard of the Month card. come to think of it, neither does Helga. But both show similarity with the WOM images.
Edit: my edit cross posted with Luna Logic. Helga and Slytherin have been WoM May and June respectively... so who is next?
I suggest Godric for July, as we know his artifacts (hat and sword) and a card for him is less likly to be a spoiler. I wonder is his birthday would be in July? That would be a nice parallel with Harry (and Neville too).
I think Ravenclaw may not be until August, as we suspect something of hers is a Horcrux. Helga's card showed us her cup but we already new it existed and was likely stolen by Tom Riddle.
But I do hope that Harry (and Ron and Hermione all) get WoM sometime soon.
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Luna Logic - Jun 27, 2007 10:43 am (#2500 of 2974)
Edited by Jun 27, 2007 10:47 am
No, I think not, because when Helga Hufflepuff was wizard of the month of may, the Alchemy thread discussed about the fact she was the first, and about the possible order of the following founders.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
Thom Matheson - Jun 27, 2007 11:11 am (#2501 of 2974)
Glamour Shots really changes the look of a person doesn't it?
painting sheila - Jun 27, 2007 1:42 pm (#2502 of 2974)
Thom - huh?
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jun 27, 2007 1:47 pm (#2503 of 2974)
Helga's cup was shown to Riddle first then Slytherins locket. The July Witch or Wizard may be part of a pattern. LPO
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 27, 2007 3:11 pm (#2504 of 2974)
Oops,1981 is my own sons Birthday.He would be in Slytherin. John,you are quite right.No one knew Harry was able to produce a corporal patronus at age 13. I kind of rushed through that one. I hope Godric Gryffindor is the next W.O.M. I would love to see Harry's in August or September.He deserves it!
Chemyst - Jun 27, 2007 3:21 pm (#2505 of 2974)
JB on Harry's patronus: That wasn't know(n) outside Harry, Hermione, and Dumbledore.
I forget details, but didn't Lupin know when he taught him? He knew at the beginning of OP when Moody wanted the guard to ask a question only a "real" Harry could answer.
Sheila, Glamour Shots is a portrait studio that retouches and digitally air brushes as needed to make anyone look like a model. Thom was "explaining" the reason for the difference between the wizard trading card pictures and the wizard of the month pictures on Jo's website by making a joke. Some portraits are modified so much the person is barely recognizable.
Nan B - Jun 27, 2007 4:25 pm (#2506 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Dobby!
And best wishes for many, many more.
Hope you get lots of socks. And a new jumper.
Mrs. Sirius - Jun 27, 2007 6:06 pm (#2507 of 2974)
Dobby's birthday today, hmmmm June, end of June.
Alright you alchemy folks, tell us what does that mean?
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 27, 2007 6:25 pm (#2508 of 2974)
Happy Birthday to Dobby,my favorite elf!
painting sheila - Jun 27, 2007 7:51 pm (#2509 of 2974)
Dobby - Happy happy birthday!!
(Does that mean he is a Gemini too? We're like . . . .twins!)
Elanor - Jun 27, 2007 9:42 pm (#2510 of 2974)
Happy birthday Dobby! We should all wear odd socks today in your honnor!
Mrs Sirius, I'd say his birthday being on the 28th refers to the number 10 (2+, that is the ouroboros/the circle closing itself (meaning that Dobby should be important in the resolution of the series) and if we see it as 28/06 or 06/28, then 2+8+6=16, that is "7" (6+1), the series' symbolic number, which confirms the number 10/circle symbolism. I love "Arithmancy", and no wonder it is Hermione's favorite subject!
Mrs. Sirius - Jun 27, 2007 11:16 pm (#2511 of 2974)
I love you folks! Knew you wouldn't fail me!
Phelim Mcintyre - Jun 28, 2007 2:51 am (#2512 of 2974)
Harry could even be a famous wizard card if he dies defeating Voldemort. But not until August at the earliest or that would be a spoiler!!
jose043 - Jun 28, 2007 4:49 am (#2513 of 2974)
Happy birthday Dobby hope you got a lot of socks to mix up & new jumper, hope you have many more birthdays.
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Betelgeuse Black - Jun 28, 2007 5:51 am (#2514 of 2974)
"JB on Harry's patronus: That wasn't know(n) outside Harry, Hermione, and Dumbledore. I forget details, but didn't Lupin know when he taught him? He knew at the beginning of OP when Moody wanted the guard to ask a question only a "real" Harry could answer. " Chemyst post #2505
I was always a bit confused about this being a big secret. Harry performed the patronus charm in front of the entire school while playing quidditch. He scared the imposter dementors: Malfoy, Goyle and Warrington. DD commented about the form of the patronus and the only time he ever saw it was at the quidditch match. So why would this be a big secret?
Back on topic: Happy Birthday Dobby! I hope you're the holder of GG's sword on the Bloomsbury children's cover. Dobby, the liberator of House Elves (hopefully)!
S.E. Jones - Jun 28, 2007 7:43 am (#2515 of 2974)
Was it caporeal at the Quidditch match or just a silver blob? Maybe, since the Patronus is a silver creature, it is hard to see during the daytime unless you know what you're looking at.
I hope Jo sets up a better way (better than what's there currently) of directly answering fan questions once the books are finished on her site. That way, things like this can get asked and answered.
Thom Matheson - Jun 28, 2007 10:06 am (#2516 of 2974)
Thank for the explanation Chymist. You are correct. I just went to a signing for another author, Janet Evinovich. Hysterical books, but, her picture is on the back cover of every book. Meeting her in person, I almost wanted to ask for ID to see if it was really her. She has probably aged 20 years in the photos on her books. Just dumb for people to do that.
Solitaire - Jun 28, 2007 10:47 am (#2517 of 2974)
Happy Birthday, Dobby ... and may your head NEVER go on a wall!
Sheila, I'm afraid Dobby is a Cancer rather than a Gemini ... like ME!
John Bumbledore - Jun 28, 2007 11:15 am (#2518 of 2974)
All this talk of Zodiac signs and Dobby reminds me..
Dobby: "Hi. I'm a Cancer. What's your sign?"
Winky: "No trespassing!"
Aren't we glad Jo chose the 90s decade and not the 70s! LOL
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Choices - Jun 28, 2007 12:23 pm (#2519 of 2974)
Thom - "She has probably aged 20 years in the photos on her books. Just dumb for people to do that."
People do that in obituaries here. You look and are feeling so sorry because a young person died (in the picture they look 20), then you read the write-up and turns out they were 104. LOL
Thom Matheson - Jun 28, 2007 9:20 pm (#2520 of 2974)
I see it a lot in Real Estate Business cards
Phelim Mcintyre - Jun 29, 2007 3:56 am (#2521 of 2974)
S E Jones - I think Harry's patronus was corporeal as Dumbledore mentions the form it took at the Quiddich match. It must have had a definate shape for DD to see what shape it was.
Mediwitch - Jun 29, 2007 8:14 am (#2522 of 2974)
Also, Lupin looks "shaken" and comments "That was quite some patronus" - I don't think a non-corporeal patronus would have produced those reactions, but seeing a stag would have.
Back to Jo's site - Happy Belated Birthday, Dobby!
S.E. Jones - Jun 29, 2007 8:36 am (#2523 of 2974)
Yeah, I found the quotes in PoA after I posted. Since it seems only teachers (and Malfoy and Co.) saw the patronus, I'm betting that everyone else was watching the game and only a few people were keeping their eyes open for another Dementor incident.....
As to who the next WotM will be, I'm betting Ravenclaw, but whichever it is I think they will be there to give us a subtle clue about what's coming. I definitely don't think we'll see Harry as one just yet as the dates listed would give too much away as to whether he dies or not.
Thora - Jun 30, 2007 7:15 am (#2524 of 2974)
Well I'm going to hope against hope for Rowena wearing an opal necklace that wasn't cursed bak when she had it... but that's rather a slim chance, right?
Lina - Jun 30, 2007 7:37 am (#2525 of 2974)
That'd be cool, Thora!
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jun 30, 2007 12:30 pm (#2526 of 2974)
Nice idea Thora! LPO
Ginerva Potter - Jun 30, 2007 1:06 pm (#2527 of 2974)
We will find out soon! I can't wait to see who the WOM will be!
azi - Jun 30, 2007 4:08 pm (#2528 of 2974)
Godric Gryffindor is the new WotM!
journeymom - Jun 30, 2007 4:53 pm (#2529 of 2974)
He's got his sword and is wearing gauntlets or armoured gloves with cuffs. He looks very fierce. He has rich red hair and has either green or blue eyes.
He looks a bit like the Beast from Disney's Beauty and the Beast.
"Godric Gryffindor, Medieval (precise dates unknown) One of the four famous Founders of Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry, Godric Gryffindor was the most accomplished dueller [sic?] of his time, an enlightened fighter against Muggle-discrimination and the first owner of the celebrated Sorting Hat."
Madame Pomfrey - Jun 30, 2007 5:29 pm (#2530 of 2974)
He looks very noble. I wonder if anyone else owned the hat between Gryffindor and Hogwarts?
Now I really think the treasure room is his!
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jun 30, 2007 7:04 pm (#2531 of 2974)
We have seen the cup, the locket and now the sword. Does that mean the sword could be a Horcrux? Is this Dumbledore's big mistake? LPO
Nathan Zimmermann - Jun 30, 2007 8:04 pm (#2532 of 2974)
The image of Godric Gryffindor reminds me of some the depictions of Hagrid.
Madam Pince - Jun 30, 2007 9:06 pm (#2533 of 2974)
I was going to post but hadn't gotten around to it that I thought July's WOTM would be either Gryffindor or Ravenclaw. It's odd that we haven't had Ravenclaw yet -- I was thinking it would be good for her to do the four founders and then maybe Harry for August, because you certainly couldn't do Harry before DH is released. But this is her last chance, so either she screwed up and forgot to start doing the Founders in time to get all four of them in in time(unlikely), or she did it on purpose because of exactly what LPO said above -- the horcruxes are going to be the cup, the locket, and the sword (or maybe the armoured gauntlets?) Despite JKR having said "Ravenclaw will have their day," it seems like Ravenclaw's getting left out. (My personal theory with that JKR quote is that it is referring to Luna doing something spectacular, but who knows...)
Wow, Godric looks a lot "tougher" that I pictured him! I was thinking of him as a bit more... I don't know... very different from this. This guy looks like he just came out of the Braveheart movie! Quite the warrior! And as Nathan says, he looks a bit like Hagrid with all that hair!
Verity Weasley - Jun 30, 2007 9:11 pm (#2534 of 2974)
Does anyone else think it might be significant that Godric Gryffindor is a redhead? Can we read anything into that? (Of course we can, LOL). Are the Waesleys the heirs of Gryffindor?
S.E. Jones - Jun 30, 2007 9:25 pm (#2535 of 2974)
The red hair reminds me of the Weasleys....
I'm with LPO on wondering what this means. I mean, why show us two known Horcruxes and then show us a founder object that we've been specifically told isn't one... Unless, to show Rowena and her object would give too much away... I guess if she showed up wearing a tiara that would be a dead giveaway and may take away from some of the excitement of the book.....
Madam Pince - Jun 30, 2007 9:59 pm (#2536 of 2974)
Don't forget Dumbledore says he can make mistakes, too... maybe he was mistaken about the sword?
Red hair = Weasleys, Lily Potter, Albus Dumbledore, Mundungus Fletcher, Crookshanks... anybody/anything else?
Darn JKR, she knows just how to get us going right before the release, doesn't she? She's just sitting there cackling right now, knowing that we're all going "But, but, but... you said..."
Edit: I was disappointed with Helga, too, Mrs. Brisbee. She looked like one of Cindarella's fairy godmothers...
Mrs Brisbee - Jun 30, 2007 10:00 pm (#2537 of 2974)
Godric Gryffindor is renowned for being the best dueller of his time and fights for the downtrodden Muggles-- suitably heroic for a Great Wizard. His dark red hair reminded me of young Dumbledore's auburn.
I didn't think the Sorting Hat had been Gryffindor's sole property. I know it was his hat, but I thought all four of the founders enchanted it, so I had assumed that once it became The Sorting Hat it belonged to all of them, but I guess not.
While I'm glad he was said to be a Great Wizard in both powers and morals, I am disappointed that Helga Hufflepuff looks like little more than a glorified cook when compared to his blurb. I thought Hufflepuffs were noted for being fair and just, and I assumed those traits started with that Houses founder. It would have been nice if she had been noted for her moral convictions as well. I'll hold out hope for some good color text for Rowena Ravenclaw, who I hope will not simply be noted for great skill at cleaning charms.
Nathan Zimmermann - Jun 30, 2007 10:18 pm (#2538 of 2974)
Mrs B., I thought of the blurb on Helga in adifferent way. I thought blurb on Helga was meant to emphsize the things that she seemed to value most home and hearth and to illustrate her as a salt of the earth type of person akin to Molly Weasley. I see Helga as a diligent hardworking mother figure who is unafraid of toil and passes these ethics to future generations, and like both Molly and Tonks I would argue that Helga would have seen the potential Remus possessed and would have been willing to teach him all that she knew.
Luna Logic - Jul 1, 2007 12:56 am (#2539 of 2974)
Hello ! Godric and not Rowena...
But have you seen the sparkles on Godric's sword... What do you think of that movement... (yes....that symbol again...)
Phelim Mcintyre - Jul 1, 2007 4:56 am (#2540 of 2974)
Yes Luna, I noticed the movement as well. Now what does that tell us? In 20 days we will know (I hope).
I guess we didn't have Ravenclaw as to see the object associated with her would be a spoiler. We have seen the locket and cup, which we know about from previous books, and the sword. The heirlooms (hallows?) associated with three of the founders which we have been told about but we still don't know what the Ravenclaw artefact is. But does this mean the sword will be important in destroying horcruxes?
Luna Logic - Jul 1, 2007 5:16 am (#2541 of 2974)
does this mean the sword will be important in destroying horcruxes?
Good idea, Phelim !
If it is the case, I wonder about Dumbledore and the ring... Did he used the sword to destroy the Horcrux which was in the Gaunt ring ? (because, the stone was broken..)
Dumbledore's hand was injured. But Harry did handle the sword without damages and Dumbledore said that Harry was a true Gryffindor...
Julie Aronson - Jul 1, 2007 5:31 am (#2542 of 2974)
OOh! That's a really good idea, Luna! I wouldn't be at all surprised to find some magical objects with user restrictions. It reminds me a bit of the sword in the stone, too.
Ginerva Potter - Jul 1, 2007 6:50 am (#2543 of 2974)
When I saw Godric Gryffindor, I immediately thought of Lily. He has red hair and green eyes...
I also like the idea that Gryffindor's sword will help destroy the horcruxes. Great idea! Only 19 days until we find out! ***Squee****
Anna L. Black - Jul 1, 2007 8:59 am (#2544 of 2974)
After we saw Helga and Salazar (feels weird to address them by their first names ), I thought that if we get Godric first and then Rowena, it must mean that we'll see Rowena's horcrux-artifact only after we read about it in DH I hope I'm right for once.
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 1, 2007 9:16 am (#2545 of 2974)
I immediately thought of Lily,too. Is it possible that G.G. is ancestor on Lily's side instead of James? Maybe Gryffindor married a muggle which may be another reason why he defends them. Just a thought. Only 19 more days!
Madam Pince - Jul 1, 2007 9:58 am (#2546 of 2974)
Madame Pomfrey, I agree -- I have long wanted to tie in Gryffindor with Harry's ancestry, and the red hair and green eyes sure helps. The muggle connection makes sense too -- if he was a champion of muggle rights, perhaps he ended up marrying a muggle, and somewhere down the line a family that thought it was all-muggle ended up with Lily in the family.
That could be the reason why JKR says there's something important about Harry's eyes -- they're just like Gryffindor's maybe?
Die Zimtzicke - Jul 1, 2007 3:34 pm (#2547 of 2974)
I think the theory that Rowena Ravenclaw hasn't been shown because it would give something away is an excellent one.
S.E. Jones - Jul 1, 2007 4:40 pm (#2548 of 2974)
I don't know about Godric being an ancestor of Lily's, it takes all the magic out of who ends up being magical.
Just to play a little devil's advocate here, just because Godric was "an enlightened fighter against Muggle-descrimination" that doesn't mean he was "pro-Muggle" and thus married a Muggle, just that he wasn't "anti-Muggle" and thus didn't actively hate or persecute them. I'm not saying he didn't and I doubt he'd have thought the idea horrible or that he would've held it against any other wizard if they did, just that one doesn't necessarily mean the other. For instance, we know the Weasleys have long been considered blood traitors because of their kindly views towards Muggles but they are still a pureblooded family.
Thora - Jul 1, 2007 8:08 pm (#2549 of 2974)
All I can say is that I (as a red-head) whole-heartedly approve of Jo's preference for gingerheaded characters.
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 1, 2007 8:13 pm (#2550 of 2974)
S.E. They may get a Muggle in the family! If Ron and Hermione survive and marry. I think it is unlikely that Godric is Lily's ancestor. I think probably Dumbledore's or James. LPO
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
Lina - Jul 1, 2007 10:35 pm (#2551 of 2974)
I think Helga looks appropriate for a witch that is known for the cooking charms. I also think that she and Professor Sprout look a lot alike and that it is great!
The Godric's sword looks a lot like the one that Dobby is holding on the UK children cover. I think it might be the key for whatever that sign is standing before.
So, it is my thinking that the sword is the key for the mysterious sign and she is not giving too much away by showing it to us, since we saw the sign already and we have no idea where is it from or what is it about. While Rowena's should be the last Horcrux and she doesn't want us to find out what that Horcrux is before we read the book. I just think that the fact that she left Rowena for August is showing that her relic is the last Horcrux.
Phelim Mcintyre - Jul 2, 2007 2:40 am (#2552 of 2974)
I agree Lina, I think having Rowena Ravenclaw as Wizard of the Month for July would have been a spoiler. Never noticed the sword being similar to the one being held by Dobby. Is this coincidence or what?
Madam Pince - Jul 2, 2007 6:11 am (#2553 of 2974)
About the red-hair thing... Leaky just published an interview with JKR done in 2000 but apparently "forgotten/lost" until now. In it, the interviewer recalls back to when he/she first interviewed JKR right after the first book came out -- and Jo had red hair then. (Interviewer made a special point to mention "blonde now" when the next interview took place in 2000.)
I don't know which is Jo's natural color, but obviously at some point she at least liked red hair on herself. She's then made Godric Gryffindor, Albus Dumbledore, and Lily all redheads. (And Mundungus is ginger, but hey...)
Aurora Gubbins - Jul 2, 2007 10:12 am (#2554 of 2974)
Luna and Phelim (posts #2539 & #2540): I looked at the movement you mentioned and my mind immediately skipped to the symbol we had to put together for the ROR recently. I don't remember, but did either of the two previous WotMs have a 'movement' and if so, were they the circle and straight line akin to the aforementioned symbol?
And I still think Tom Riddle's school award is a horcrux! After all, by Jo's own admission, her website is full of clues...and there it is!
John Bumbledore - Jul 2, 2007 11:56 am (#2555 of 2974)
Edited Jul 2, 2007 12:54 pm
Ah, I predicted Godric as the July Wizard of the Month in my June 27 post, #2499 on this thread. My reasons were: We knew about the cup and locket being suspected horcruxes. We suspect something of Ravenclaw's but don't know what it could be. We already know what artifacts belong to Gryffindor (sword and hat). So I think Jo first gave us the founders that wouldn't be spoilers. I expected (and still expect) Ravenclaw to be August 2007 WotM.
The suggestion that Voldemort would use Tom's award for service to the school as a Horcrux doesn't sound likely to me. Voldemort already used an artifact from "Tom Riddle," his own diary. I don't think he would have more than one. Dumbledore though he was drawn to the founders of Hogwarts. Wasn't the list that Harry was reciting something like this?
"The locket, the cup, something of Ravenclaw's or Gryffindor's, and the snake."
Edited by John to add a new, fake avatar for myself.
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Good Evans - Jul 2, 2007 2:31 pm (#2556 of 2974)
Surely the new Minister for Magic (Scrimgeour)must be related / descended from Gryffindor? He is described as putting one in the mind of a Lion. And boy is that not the first impression you get from the WOTM Godric? I certainly did.
Elanor - Jul 2, 2007 10:04 pm (#2557 of 2974)
I did too Julie!
Actually, my first thought was that it would have been a great pic of Richard the Lion Heart and I was sure I had posted something about it sometime already. Found it this morning, can't believe it was in 2004, lol! Here: Founders thread, post #148. it is about Richard's crest and the similarities with Godric Gryffindor.
The Lion connection is also very interesting because Godric is July's WoM, that is the month during which the Leo astrological sign begins (and Harry is a Leo...). And Harry will need to become a wonderful dueller in no time IMHO, this could be a very good omen for him...
I did notice the triangle shape too (thanks for posting about the triangle being a "Delta" reference Choices! ). I won't repeat once again what we've said about that symbol or about the four founders as WoM on the alchemy thread but everything is there already! The wheel of the elements is turning again...
Edits: Here's the link to the "Delta" post: Delta symbol and the one to the post in which the discussion about the "rotation of the elements" starts: post #1685.
Hogs Head - Jul 3, 2007 12:24 pm (#2558 of 2974)
On my regular PC screen (Sony, and using those standard software products originating in Seattle, WA), the Gryffindor eyes appeared blue, but when I used "Print Screen," pasted in "Paint," and "Zoom Large," they look definitely green. Perhaps someone with a more advanced graphics program (such as those the professional photographers use) can tell us more.
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 3, 2007 1:18 pm (#2559 of 2974)
They definitely look bright green on my computer.I had to put my glasses on to make sure,though.
I had pictured Lily with the same coloring.Wouldn't that be something if the "something more than meets the eye" about Pet would be that she is also a descendant of G.G.? Wouldn't that make Vernon's head spin.
Chemyst - Jul 3, 2007 3:36 pm (#2560 of 2974)
Hogs Head, I tried "invert color" because blues invert to yellow/orange while greens invert to magenta/violet and I find it is sometimes easier to tell those apart on computer screens. Godric's peepers inverted to a lovely shade of lavender, which means the eyes are green green green.
Mrs Brisbee - Jul 3, 2007 10:55 pm (#2561 of 2974)
Well, I'll be disappointed if the important thing about Lily is she's a connect-the-dots between two powerful men. I was hoping she'd actually be amazing in her own right.
However, I'd thought Rowling had nixed the idea of Harry being Gryffindor's heir, but looking at the quote now, it looks ambiguous. She never said he definitely wasn't.
It would explain why Voldemort chose Harry over Neville to the point he was going to make his final Horcrux with Harry's death. The first battle seems to have been between Slytherin and Gryffindor (with the other two founders siding with Gryffindor but not major players). So of course Voldy would think Gryffindor's heir would be "The One".
I suppose it might be amusing if Petunia started complaining about that stupid sword her parents used to own, set with glass baubles the size of eggs....
Good Evans - Jul 4, 2007 7:44 am (#2562 of 2974)
I dont think that Pet has Gryffindors sword - I think that is in the headmasters office at Hogwarts?? (following chamber of secrets), however she may have other relics, preferably hidden under the squeaky stair (oh please please please, let something be under that squeaky stair).
Hogs Head - Jul 4, 2007 1:34 pm (#2563 of 2974)
Mrs. Brisbee - every great man is decended from some great woman and every great woman is decended from some great man. That does not minimize the accomplishments of the decendent
Choices - Jul 4, 2007 6:43 pm (#2564 of 2974)
Hogs Head - "...every great man is decended from some great woman and every great woman is decended from some great man."
Are you sure? I thought there were a lot of great men and women who came from very humble (not great parents) beginnings. Guess I was wrong.
Hagsquid - Jul 4, 2007 7:30 pm (#2565 of 2974)
I guess your ancestors are limited to your parents?
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 4, 2007 7:36 pm (#2566 of 2974)
I think Lily has already do something remarkable: She sacrificed her life for Harry. LPO
Mrs Brisbee - Jul 4, 2007 8:26 pm (#2567 of 2974)
I dont think that Pet has Gryffindors sword - I think that is in the headmasters office at Hogwarts??-- Good Evans
I just meant Petunia would mention having seen the sword in the past as a vehicle for Harry to realize that his mother's family-- and therefor he-- is descended from Gryffindor. I do think having Harry being the actual blood heir rather than the heir because of his chosen principles will detract from the theme of choices defining a person. Of course, after a thousand years it is possible that every wizard in the U.K. is descended from Gryffindor, and the other founders as well.
Rowling has promised that we will find out something important about Lily in the final book. Certainly her unthinking sacrifice and its unwitting protection are important, but it does sort of represent a generic selfless love a mother has for her child, rather than anything individualistic about Lily. I'm holding out hope for something important that will give the adult Lily personality.
Hogs Head - Jul 4, 2007 8:33 pm (#2568 of 2974)
Choices -- Yes, I'm sure. You should not allow greatness to be measured by popular or fleeting standards. Great is as great does. People of humble means can be great in their own right, even if very few recognize it. Sometimes those most heraled for greatness are simply not very great.
And, by definition, ancestors goes back further than just immediate parents.
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 4, 2007 10:20 pm (#2569 of 2974)
Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness t-h-r-u-s-t upon them. he he he sitting (under the stairs snickering) #$%^^.
TwinklingBlueEyes - Jul 5, 2007 5:51 am (#2570 of 2974)
"#$%^^." Is that a forum friendly word? ROFL!
Hmm, topic, topic. Oh yes, nothing new to report from JKR's site.
...toddles off elsewhere...
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 5, 2007 6:08 am (#2571 of 2974)
No, that is just me cackling, he he he. This quote for me offers much rich history. "#$%^^La la la la
Chemyst - Jul 5, 2007 6:31 am (#2572 of 2974)
Sometimes those most heralded for greatness are simply not very great.
Hogs Head, we try to keep the Paris Hilton comments limited to the chat thread.
Mrs. Sirius, is that a Chicken Run joke?
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 5, 2007 7:13 am (#2573 of 2974)
Reguarding Lily having G.G. coloring.Pet said that her parents were proud about having a witch in the family. Maybe they were proud because they knew about their lineage(Gryffindor) and their hasn't been a witch or wizard produced in a very long time.
Hagrid said about the Potters. "suppose the myst'ry is why You-Know-Who never tried to get 'em on his side before...probably knew they were too close ter Dumbledore ter want anythin' ter do with the Dark Side." Maybe Voldemort didn't want them because he knew their connection to Gryffindor? Hmm. That wouldn't explain why he gave Lily a choice,though.
journeymom - Jul 5, 2007 9:35 am (#2574 of 2974)
Is it possible Voldemort gave Lily a chance to step aside simply because JKR needed him to, in order for Lily's sacrifice to mean more, thus creating the unexpected, protective magic? In otherwords, we are not going to find out that Voldemort had some other plans for Lily, or that Snape begged for Lily to be spared, only that Voldemort did it because JKR needed Lily to choose to die to spare Harry.
I think I'll continue this elsewhere.
Die Zimtzicke - Jul 5, 2007 3:18 pm (#2575 of 2974)
I really didn't think of Lily when I saw the picture of Gryffindor. I thought of a young Albus Dumbledore, actually.
Lily can't be the connection, unless it's VERY far back, since she is considered Muggle. I would think somebody in the wizarding world would have been interested in genealogy and would have figured out who was descended from the founders.
S.E. Jones - Jul 5, 2007 4:16 pm (#2576 of 2974)
Well, obviously Voldemort was very interested in wizarding geneology (and hopefully Harry will be in DH). Frankly, I think Pet's comment about her parents being proud of Lily reflects their acceptance of her in contrast to Pet's comment that Lily was a freak, rather than reflecting any family ancestry. And, as for why Voldemort wouldn't have tried to get them on his side, maybe he knew about James's deep hatred for anything Dark Arts that apparently goes back as far as his childhood (which probably means that it also reflects Potter family values).
And, I think journeymom is right, this should all probably be carried on in another thread somewhere....
Elanor - Jul 6, 2007 10:11 am (#2577 of 2974)
Hmm... My inner Sibyll whispers to my ear that tomorrow being 07/07/07, this could be a great date for an update on Jo's site. Doesn't your inner Sibyll agree?
MickeyCee3948 - Jul 6, 2007 10:15 am (#2578 of 2974)
Don't know but I'm going to buy a lotto ticket.
riotgrrrl - Jul 6, 2007 10:20 am (#2579 of 2974)
While I really hope there is an update- I am torn as I am going on vacation and don't want to miss anything else. I'm already going to miss the release of the movie as I'll be on my honeymoon and don't want to spend time indoors in Hawaii- actually my husband doesn't. Anyways, if there is an update, be sure to thoroughly discuss it (no problem there, I'm sure) so that I get everything when I return!
Choices - Jul 6, 2007 3:34 pm (#2580 of 2974)
"Nature's Nobility, A Wizarding Genealogy" I think will be important in book 7.
painting sheila - Jul 6, 2007 10:27 pm (#2581 of 2974)
okay - work with me here . . . killed a Slytherin descendant and made a horcrux out of Slytherin heirloom. Killed a Hufflepuff descendant and made a horcrux out of a Hufflepuff heirloom. I don't know about Ravenclaw, but treid to kill a Gryffindor descendant (Harry) to make a Gryffendor heirloom (the sword) a horcrux.
Maybe LV had the sword with him that night and when the spell rebounded he dropped it and "the mysterious person" that was there picked it up and returned it to Dumbledore.
Has this already been thought of before . . . . ?
TheSaint - Jul 7, 2007 1:20 am (#2582 of 2974)
PS - don't know about Ravenclaw, but treid to kill a Gryffindor descendant (Harry) to make a Gryffendor heirloom (the sword) a horcrux.
How is he related to Gryffindor? That would certainly make blood an important factor.
S.E. Jones - Jul 7, 2007 1:31 am (#2583 of 2974)
Similar theories have been proposed but not that one in particular. The one that comes to mind, as far as similar theories goes, is that Voldemort was going to make the sword into a Horcrux and the Potters had the sword; Dd hid the sword in the Sorting Hat and, of course, Harry's murder didn't go as planned so the whole thing was botched. This would probably be better suited to another thread, though. Perhaps either the 'DH', 'Horcruxes', or 'Harry' theads?
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 7, 2007 1:34 pm (#2584 of 2974)
I don't think he killed a Slytherin descendent. He did not kill Morfin or Marvolo he killed his father and grandparents. I agree with the Hufflepuff. Horcrux. LPO
S.E. Jones - Jul 7, 2007 10:26 pm (#2585 of 2974)
LPO, he did kill Marvolo. That's how he got the ring and found out that his father was a Muggle.
Ginerva Potter - Jul 7, 2007 10:55 pm (#2586 of 2974)
S.E. - Actually he got the ring from Morfin and found out from Morfin that his father was a muggle. Then, Morfin was framed for the deaths of the Riddles and died in Azkaban. Marvolo had already died when Voldemort found the Gaunt house.
Sorry...I just wanted to clear that up. I don't mean to be an insufferable know it all..
Kip Carter - Jul 8, 2007 12:19 am (#2587 of 2974)
Ginerva, you are very correct in your statement.
I feel that I need to explain something and I do not want this thread to interrupt the discussion because of my statement. If you feel it is necessary to comment on what I state, please take it to the Chat Thread, not here!
S.E. Jones normally would never need correcting; however this was the first post she made on the Forum right after she learned of the death of her father suddenly due to a blood clot while recovering from double knee surgery. My prayers are with her and her family and I am sure that each of you on our Forum Family share my feelings. Enough said.
Soul Search - Jul 8, 2007 4:00 pm (#2588 of 2974)
I guess we aren't going to get any chapter titles or interesting passages. Oh well, only a few more days.
Die Zimtzicke - Jul 8, 2007 5:23 pm (#2589 of 2974)
Actually, maybe a lot of this needs to go someplace else. Not all of this discussion is really about Jo's site.
I was really hoping for an update before the OotP film came out, but I guess it's not going to happen. Maybe Jo will at least comment on what she thought of the film soon. She usually does, doesn't she?
Gina R Snape - Jul 8, 2007 7:05 pm (#2590 of 2974)
Yes, I thought for sure we'd get something about the book. A small passage, a list of chapter titles, something. Oh well.
I promised myself I would remain spoiler free this time and, surprisingly, it has not been difficult. I haven't come across a single one yet.
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 8, 2007 8:23 pm (#2591 of 2974)
Lol,Gina. That would narrow your choice to peek a bit:) Hey,we still have a Friday the 13th coming,maybe we will get something then.
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 8, 2007 8:36 pm (#2592 of 2974)
I think Jo is setting a good example by not releasing anything. She has been very outspoken about any spoilers. I don't think we will be getting anything this time. LPO
Erika Gryffindor - Jul 8, 2007 9:06 pm (#2593 of 2974)
well she did release something. She said that the last word is NO LONGER SCAR!!!
I was shocked and now Im tormented! This was released today on Yahoo news.
gusmania - Jul 9, 2007 2:16 am (#2594 of 2974)
But changing the last word of the book is not going to change the whole story, so I don't think is a big release.
Erika Gryffindor - Jul 9, 2007 6:10 am (#2595 of 2974)
In my mind since the last word was scar it meant to *me* that Harry did not die. NOw (altho I don't think he will die) it is just a little concerning.. lol
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 9, 2007 7:44 am (#2596 of 2974)
Right you are Erika. I don't think we will get chapter titles or descriptions though. After 17 years there had got to be some changes. LPO
Die Zimtzicke - Jul 9, 2007 12:39 pm (#2597 of 2974)
She said the word scar is still close to the end of the book, it's just not the last word.
Stephanie M. - Jul 9, 2007 7:36 pm (#2598 of 2974)
The first thing that I was going to do when I get the book was going to be to check to see if the very last word was scar, and try not to see anything else, but now that we know its not, I guess I won't check.
Gina R Snape - Jul 9, 2007 8:26 pm (#2599 of 2974)
Yeah, it could be "scar on his forehead" or something.
Caius Iulius - Jul 10, 2007 2:51 am (#2600 of 2974)
A bit late to mention, buy I got an "Acceptable". Oof..! Now I may proceed and try to find a job.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
John Bumbledore - Jul 10, 2007 7:10 am (#2601 of 2974)
A bit late but I have noticed a new link on Jo's "Links" book case for "Missing Madeleine."
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Good Evans - Jul 14, 2007 12:09 pm (#2602 of 2974)
I know that this isn't strictly Jo's site but it doesn't seem wholly out of place to ask this here ... Did anyone win tickets to the midnight reading? suffice to say I heard nothing so obviously didnt!
Allison R - Jul 14, 2007 12:44 pm (#2603 of 2974)
Good Evans, we didn't win here, either-- but they're doing a live webcast now, followed by a live chat-- so everyone can attend, after a fashion! Here's a link with full info
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
We're excited that we'll still be able to hear/see the event!
Good Evans - Jul 14, 2007 1:43 pm (#2604 of 2974)
Thanks Allison !!
Allison R - Jul 14, 2007 3:01 pm (#2605 of 2974)
You bet! I just hope that they prepare for the massive hits on the server and are properly fortified to handle the traffic. I'd hate to not be able to log on because the server is too busy to accomidate my request to load the broadcast or the chat room!
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 14, 2007 8:07 pm (#2606 of 2974)
Sorry, at midnight on the 21 July, I will at the store, purchasing a book. It's at least a 12 mile drive so I doubt, I will get the webstream live.
On a happier note, the sleepover science camp I signed my kids up for has changed it's date. I was the first to tell them this date interfered with the publishing premier of DH, could they change it please. (She said no at the time, I guess they saw the light when other parents also complained).
Lina - Jul 15, 2007 1:28 am (#2607 of 2974)
Mrs. Sirius, to cast the webstream alive, that should be at midnight Greenwich time. At THAT time, I will be at the store, but it will be several hours before midnight your time. I'd say that is very handy situation for the Americans.
Good Evans - Jul 15, 2007 3:13 am (#2608 of 2974)
great avatar Lina !! - I too will be at store, but might get back in time to hear some of it.
Ginerva Potter - Jul 15, 2007 7:07 am (#2609 of 2974)
Lina - I didn't even recognize you! LOL! My first thought when I saw your avatar was that it was Gina. Why would Gina have that as her avatar? I don't know...cool avatar though!
Chemyst - Jul 15, 2007 7:13 am (#2610 of 2974)
I'd say that is very handy situation for the Americans.
Yes! ...and a live webstream goes quite a way to helping make up for our extra wait. But isn't BST an hour different from Greenwich Mean? Either way, I'll have it figured out by then.
legolas returns - Jul 15, 2007 7:44 am (#2611 of 2974)
Yes its +1hr from GMT.
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 15, 2007 9:59 am (#2612 of 2974)
Wait, wait, you mean that it will be GMT? Not mid-night my time? I just assumed they would not allow the live, live webcast here until 12:00 EST.
So those of us in this side of the Atlantic will get a PREVIEW!!!! weeee
Lina - Jul 15, 2007 2:11 pm (#2613 of 2974)
Yes, weeee! Chemyst, what I meant to say was - midnight in Great Britain, or midnight in London, whatever you like better. Precision is not my stronger quality, as you might have noticed already.
And thanks for the avatar comments. When I saw it, I just couldn't resist. I knew it would be noticed here.
Chemyst - Jul 15, 2007 4:46 pm (#2614 of 2974)
That's OK, Lina. The only reason I know BST stands for British Summer Time is because I learned about it here on the Lexicon Forum a couple of years ago.
Doris Crockford - Jul 15, 2007 6:55 pm (#2615 of 2974)
Wait, so that will be 6 hours ahead of New York/Toronto time? Or am I just confusing myself more? Woohoo, who cares? We get a preview!
Allison R - Jul 15, 2007 7:44 pm (#2616 of 2974)
Doris, this is the site I used to find out my local time: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Just put in "London" for the first line and whatever your local time is for the second line and click on "show timetable". Here where I am in Mountain time, it'll be 5PM. What a perfect activity for us to do before heading off to the bookstore for the in-person festivities!
Geber - Jul 15, 2007 7:53 pm (#2617 of 2974)
Midnight British Summer Time = 7 pm Eastern Daylight Time = 6 pm Central Daylight Time = 5 pm Mountain Daylight Time = 4 pm Pacific Daylight Time
Take it from a ham radio operator.
legolas returns - Jul 15, 2007 11:49 pm (#2618 of 2974)
The last reading she did she chose passages that were interesting but did not really spoil the whole story. She will probably do that again so people on Uk time do not get an unfair advantage.
septentrion - Jul 16, 2007 12:16 am (#2619 of 2974)
It means a sleepless night for me Friday night. And I'm so very sorry that I'll be at work on July 30th. I'll probably have to settle for the retranscript.
*waves to Lina - great avater indeed**
Marie E. - Jul 16, 2007 7:14 am (#2620 of 2974)
At 5pm Mountain Time I will still be at work. Dang it!
Caius Iulius - Jul 18, 2007 1:58 pm (#2621 of 2974)
J.K. Rowling has asked to (my words, the text wouldn't copy) ignore the misinformation on the internet and preserve any possible secrets so we will all enjoy reading at the same time.
Chemyst - Jul 18, 2007 7:22 pm (#2622 of 2974)
Caius, the text copies in the text only version:
Section: Diary JULY 18th
We are almost there! As launch night looms, let's all, please, ignore the misinformation popping up on the web and in the press on the plot of Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. I'd like to ask everyone who calls themselves a Potter fan to help preserve the secrecy of the plot for all those who are looking forward to reading the book at the same time on publication day. In a very short time you will know EVERYTHING!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- All rights reserved JK Rowling. Site by Lightmaker
painting sheila - Jul 19, 2007 9:48 pm (#2623 of 2974)
I love that woman!! Here's to you JKR!! Thank you for such an amazing ride!!
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 19, 2007 9:52 pm (#2624 of 2974)
Yes, She, she is in a class of her own. Even today, a model of decorum and grace. To J.K. Rowling. (insert raised glass here)
Pssst to New York Times!
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Jul 20, 2007 2:00 am (#2625 of 2974)
The door has opened again.
Luna Logic - Jul 20, 2007 2:18 am (#2626 of 2974)
Thanks, Hogwarts Class of 85 ! It is very moving to read, towards the end. (I think it is a good sign for Harry IMO...)
Are the details on the left of the door the same as always ? I didn't remember the cloud, the birds, and the flower...
Anna L. Black - Jul 20, 2007 2:19 am (#2627 of 2974)
I have tears in my eyes after reading that. (Although the last sentence made me LOL).
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Jul 20, 2007 3:05 am (#2628 of 2974)
Yeah, I was welling up a bit too. I can't imagine what it will be like after reading the book tonight.
Luna Logic - the window at the left looks the same to me.
Nan B - Jul 20, 2007 4:20 am (#2629 of 2974)
Yes, very moving. Isn't this the first time there hasn't been a puzzle to solve, to get through the door?
Luna, the cloud and the birds have always been there. The things on the table have changed a bit over the months. The flitterbloom (and reviving potions) have been there for quite a while - they were part of one of the Easter Eggs, I think, and have been there ever since. (If you are seeing a flower, not a dead plant, then you must have found the Easter Egg.)
Luna Logic - Jul 20, 2007 5:18 am (#2630 of 2974)
Thanks, Nan B. I don't remember having done any Easter Egg but I do see the potions and a white (an beautiful) flower.
Yes, Anna L Black, the last sentence is very JKR like... emotions and smiles, mixed.
Ida-ho-Potato - Jul 20, 2007 5:37 am (#2631 of 2974)
Thank you JKR for the final goodbye. I hope you still do some fun things with your site though. Like give us all the answers to any open ended questions that may still be out there.
Ida-ho-Potato - Jul 20, 2007 5:39 am (#2632 of 2974)
Did you notice. She left her pen behind. Saying she done. She no longer needs the pen.
barbara webb - Jul 20, 2007 5:58 am (#2633 of 2974)
My door is not open,???.
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 20, 2007 6:12 am (#2634 of 2974)
Her desk is clean.*sniff,sniff* I'm still waiting for the document to unload.
Mrs. Sirius - Jul 20, 2007 6:29 am (#2635 of 2974)
Great, it opened, I got the letter and it was well worth the wait.
JK does have an amazing gift for words. She knows just how to word it. Jessica is lucky, as are we.
Madame Pomfrey - Jul 20, 2007 7:38 am (#2636 of 2974)
Finally! Took a while to unload with my slow dial up service. It was worth the wait,very touching.
The pen being left on the desk may mean she is not through with writing,I hope.
Thank you, Jo! Thanks for working so very hard for your demanding and adoring fans! Waiting,years at a time, for your books, and having the pleasure of reading them has been a very memoriable experience in my lifetime,not to mention the friendships I have made with these wonderful people on the Lexicon,whom without you, I would not have had the pleasure to know through our common bond of loving Harry Potter. It has been a wonderful ride and I am so very thankful for the day I discovered The Harry Potter Lexicon while visiting your website.
Marie E. - Jul 20, 2007 8:21 am (#2637 of 2974)
I'm glad I'm not the only one who got teary-eyed. I thought maybe it was missing my own girls too much.
She does have a wonderful way with words. It's a simple list of thanks and acknowledgments, but it is very heartfelt and sincere.
Thank you, Jo.
Mediwitch - Jul 20, 2007 8:38 am (#2638 of 2974)
Thanks, Jo! You've given us so many new friends (both fictional and real), and a rich new world to visit any time we want. Thanks for sharing with us.
Ms Amanda - Jul 20, 2007 8:41 am (#2639 of 2974)
That was a wonderful and touching letter. It is good to hear her talking about Harry as her daughter's brother. I think it bodes well for him, too.
journeymom - Jul 20, 2007 8:43 am (#2640 of 2974)
I can't read it! I clicked on it and it disappears in a puff of sparkles, and it's gone.
Am I just being impatient?? (Can't be that.)
Jenniffler - Jul 20, 2007 8:48 am (#2641 of 2974)
I admit I am now sparkly-eyed. Yay for Jo!
Phelim Mcintyre - Jul 20, 2007 11:27 am (#2642 of 2974)
Am at Sectus, and all I can say is wow. What a great letter. Thanks Jo.
legolas returns - Jul 20, 2007 11:47 am (#2643 of 2974)
Its her favourite book. Feeling a bit emotional reading the letter. Our last book.
Soul Search - Jul 20, 2007 2:26 pm (#2644 of 2974)
Nothing on the text only site yet. Sounds good. Could someone post the text so we who have trouble getting on the website read it? Many thanks.
Ludicrous Patents Office - Jul 20, 2007 3:40 pm (#2645 of 2974)
I can't read the letter! I second Soul Searches request. Please someone post the text. LPO
Ponine - Jul 20, 2007 3:50 pm (#2646 of 2974)
How do I do that without re-typing it? It's a little long...
This is the snippet Mugglenet has on their site, trying to figure out how to get the rest..
Within hours you will know what happens to Harry, Ron, Hermione and the rest in their final adventure. All the secrets I have been carrying around for so long will be yours, too, and those who guessed correctly will be vindicated, and those who guessed wrongly will not, I hope, be too disappointed! As for me, I feel a heady mixture of excitement, nerves and relief. 'Deathly Hallows' remains my favourite of the series, even after several re-reads; I cannot wait to share it with the readers who have stuck with me through six previous books.
jose043 - Aug 7, 2007 2:07 am (#2647 of 2974)
Belated happy birthday for the 31st July 2007 to Jo & Harry many more to come
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 9, 2007 12:26 pm (#2648 of 2974)
I was right about the August wizard of the month being Rowena Ravenclaw. I wonder who next months will be? Dumbledore, Snape, Potter or even Voldemort.
Gina R Snape - Aug 10, 2007 6:07 pm (#2649 of 2974)
So, has anyone gone back and checked the list of birthday names compared to the list of the living post-DH?
zelmia - Aug 10, 2007 7:00 pm (#2650 of 2974)
Looks like the only ones from the list who didn't make it were Snape, Dobby, Fred, and Lupin.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:48 pm; edited 2 times in total
Gina R Snape - Aug 10, 2007 7:16 pm (#2651 of 2974)
Ok, well, there's that theory blown!
I wonder, then, how and why she chose the birthdays she did.
haymoni - Aug 10, 2007 8:01 pm (#2652 of 2974)
I think the theory still holds.
Lupin is easy - she changed her mind about him.
You can't give out George's birthday without giving Fred's.
Dobby's death was just so heartbreaking, he deserves to be remembered.
And Snape - Gina, that one was for you!
Madame Kulich - Aug 10, 2007 9:51 pm (#2653 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Ginny Weasley!
zelmia - Aug 10, 2007 9:52 pm (#2654 of 2974)
I'm surprised she changed her mind about Lupin. He always seemed doomed to me. True about Fred though. Should we only count him as half? I was surprised that Dobby even got a mention on the Birthday Calendar, to be honest.
jose043 - Aug 11, 2007 1:20 am (#2655 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Ginny Weasley many more to come
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Rea - Aug 11, 2007 2:31 am (#2656 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Ginevra Weasley Potter... and me!
2BMcsmom - Aug 11, 2007 4:32 am (#2657 of 2974)
Happy belated Birthday Ginny...... and Rea
Madame Pomfrey - Aug 19, 2007 12:20 pm (#2658 of 2974)
I've just read that JKR has been spotted writing in a Scottish cafe.She is supposedly writing a detective novel.Anyone else read this?
Choices - Aug 19, 2007 1:12 pm (#2659 of 2974)
No....but when can we pre-order? LOL
Chemyst - Aug 19, 2007 2:45 pm (#2660 of 2974)
That's the spirit, Choices!
Madame Pomfrey - Aug 19, 2007 3:50 pm (#2661 of 2974)
Lol!! I know it will be awesome. I read it on Aol News.
Choices,Hermione is such a cute pooch!
Choices - Aug 19, 2007 5:00 pm (#2662 of 2974)
Thanks Madame. We call her 'Mione for short. She is a Cairn Terrier and has a buddy named Molly. I will put up her picture soon. :-)
I am so excited about this new book JKR is writing. I may just become a crime novel fan. LOL
Denise P. - Aug 19, 2007 5:13 pm (#2663 of 2974)
Rumor, it is only a rumor according to TLC. I think she said she was taking a break. I can't really buy into her writing in a cafe, working on a new book for many reasons. Now, I certainly hope she does start writing soon and I already read crime fiction (but not real life crime)
Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 20, 2007 2:47 am (#2664 of 2974)
Denise - love the avatar, where did you get it (will google for it anyway). As to JKR writing crime fiction, one of her best friends is Ian Rankin and the Harry Potter books won mystery and crime awards in the US so why not.
Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 20, 2007 4:22 am (#2665 of 2974)
For some reason it won't let me edit one of my messages, oh well.
I have recieved an email update from the Bookseller, the UK publishing trade magazine. The person who talked about this was Ian Rankin in an interview to a paper at the Edinburgh festival. It was his wife who supposedly spotted Jo at work. As Jo lives in the same street as Ian Rankin and Alexander McCall-Smith and is a personal friend of the Rankin family I doubt that t is a case of mistaken identity. Jo has also said that she has two stories on the go and is waiting which one takes off as she writes. I would say that this is more than a rumour.
Madame Pomfrey - Aug 20, 2007 5:09 am (#2666 of 2974)
Thanks,Phelim. I'll take the Luna approach.It is true unless it can be proven that it's not!
Choices, Me too! The closest I've come to reading mystery crime is Brenda Joyce's "Deadly" series and HP,of course!
wynnleaf - Aug 20, 2007 7:01 am (#2667 of 2974)
As for JKR still writing in cafes, she mentioned this in one of the recent interviews. She didn't say anything about what she wrote there, just that she still writes in cafes. I think, at the time, she was talking about some of the writing for DH, but I assume if she wrote some of DH in cafes, she's still doing it on whatever she's working on now.
legolas returns - Aug 20, 2007 10:35 am (#2668 of 2974)
I think it will be pretty cool whatever she writes. I can imagine a detective story with lots of twists and turns and loads of red herrings.
zelmia - Aug 20, 2007 10:41 am (#2669 of 2974)
Madame Pompfrey, may I suggest Alexander McCall-Smith to ease you into the mystery genre? The Sunday Philosophy Club or The No. 1 Ladies Detective Agency are both great series. But start with the first one because there is a progression to them.
Madame Pomfrey - Aug 20, 2007 11:05 am (#2670 of 2974)
Thanks,Zelmia. I might just do that.After I have read DH a few more times,that is.
Luna Logic - Aug 20, 2007 12:23 pm (#2671 of 2974)
I agree with Zelmia : The No. 1 Ladies Detective Agency are great, simple and sensible books.
Mrs. Sirius - Aug 20, 2007 9:44 pm (#2672 of 2974)
(H) he he he, Ian Rankin, was just making a tiny joke. (no jokes were it concerns JKR please).
Phelim Mcintyre - Aug 21, 2007 1:54 am (#2673 of 2974)
Yes Mrs Sirius, Ian Rankin was making a joke. But as Jo as said she has two draft ideas, and she knows both Ian and Alexander McCall-Smith I am watching this space avidly.
journeymom - Aug 21, 2007 10:03 am (#2674 of 2974)
About JKR's (Non) New Novel...
This link shouldn't be a problem, as it is to the HP Automatic News Aggragate site.
Verity Weasley - Aug 21, 2007 7:34 pm (#2675 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Percy Weasley! He redeemed himself in the end, so I feel quite justified in sending him birthday greetings. "By the way, did I mention I'm resigning?" is one of the more memorable lines of the book.
Tazzygirl - Aug 21, 2007 9:51 pm (#2676 of 2974)
Happy Birthday, Percy! (I feel the same way, Verity!)
I also thought JKR was taking a long (well deserved) break. I haven't seen any news online at all, except here, about the new book she is supposedly writing.
I met Alexander McCall Smith. Very nice gentleman, with a lot of humor! I also really enjoyed the No. 1 Ladies Detective Agency books.
journeymom - Aug 21, 2007 11:51 pm (#2677 of 2974)
Hurrah! Happy Birthday Percy!
Good Evans - Aug 23, 2007 5:25 am (#2678 of 2974)
Happy belated Perce, I stuck by you despite all the stupid things you did over the years. have a great day and dont worry about cauldron bottoms or broomsticks - seriously they're just not worth it!!!
Choices - Aug 23, 2007 9:11 am (#2679 of 2974)
Easy for you to say, Good Evans. You obviously have never slaved over a very complicated potion for hours, only to have it leak out all over the floor due to a too thin cauldron bottom. Honestly! It's very important!
LOL Just teasing Good Evans. Happy Belated Birthday, Percy. Glad you saw the light and have returned to your family!
Good Evans - Aug 23, 2007 10:55 am (#2680 of 2974)
VeronikaG - Aug 25, 2007 11:10 am (#2681 of 2974)
I lurrrve British crime/mystery fiction! Boy, I sure hope Jo start swriting a loooong series of books!
May I suggest Caroline Graham's Midsomer Murders series? Never read the books, but I love the TV show. And also Dalziel and Pascoe by Reginald Hill. The first few episodes of the series are the very best TV crime ever IMHO! The books and TV series part after season II.
Edited for subject/predicator concord.
Good Evans - Aug 31, 2007 12:35 pm (#2682 of 2974)
new wizard of the month tomorrw, anyone taking bets? I would think a strong possibility that it will be either Dumbledore or Harry himself?
Elanor - Aug 31, 2007 1:12 pm (#2683 of 2974)
I do agree with you Julie/GE, it would be perfect to have Dumbledore or Harry as the new Wizard of the Month!
I would love to see Snape as a Wizard of the Month too, wouldn't you?
Lina - Aug 31, 2007 1:29 pm (#2684 of 2974)
Good Evans - Aug 31, 2007 1:39 pm (#2685 of 2974)
Oh yes, Snape would be great... one day!
Joanna Lupin - Aug 31, 2007 1:55 pm (#2686 of 2974)
I bet she'll honour Harry now.
Xenophilius - Aug 31, 2007 4:19 pm (#2687 of 2974)
Dumbledore is the next wizard of the month and they are showing his age as 115 when he died.
Verity Weasley - Aug 31, 2007 5:41 pm (#2688 of 2974)
I haven't visited JKRs site in a while but I checked in today to see the new Wizard of the Month. This is the first time I have been there since I got my new computer with Windows Vista. There was a new item on the desk, called a Vista Gadget. When I clicked on it, it told me about this gadget thing you can download to keep in touch with JKRs site. It must be some sort of glitch because it said 'new book released in 23 days'! If only!!
haymoni - Aug 31, 2007 5:41 pm (#2689 of 2974)
Isn't he 150???
Xenophilius - Aug 31, 2007 6:19 pm (#2690 of 2974)
I am assuming the 1881 - 1996 under his name are the years of his birth and death. The 150 came from an old interview.
Mrs. Sirius - Aug 31, 2007 7:47 pm (#2691 of 2974)
It is September 1st in England. First day at Hogwarts! And the wizards of the month is Dumbledor!
Elanor - Aug 31, 2007 10:33 pm (#2692 of 2974)
Symbolically, having Dumbledore as the new Wizard of the Month is just perfect!
After the 4 founders (for the 4 Elements), we have Dumbledore who is associated to the Quintessence symbol (the "5th" element, at the same time part of each element and above them as he is as a headmaster. His "bee" - "bumblebee" - "mead/honey", and "music" connections for example are also quintessence symbols). Purple is also the color symbolizing quintessence and on the Wizard of the Month's "card", Dumbledore is wearing... purple robes.
The fact he was 115 when he died is also telling: 1+1+5=7, THE symbolic number associated with the series!
I just wish we knew when his birthday is now. (Please, Jo!!!!)
Anna L. Black - Sep 1, 2007 2:52 am (#2693 of 2974)
A few people noticed in the pensieve on the Lex's "What's new?" section, that 1996 is probably a mistake, and it should be 1997 (unless she counts his death as the time he put on the ring and got hit by its curse). Oh well
Luna Logic - Sep 1, 2007 3:55 am (#2694 of 2974)
Edited by Sep 1, 2007 3:59 am
Yes, it is a mistake - because Harry is born in 1980 (if Godric's Hollow happens in 1981) thus he has his 17th birthday on July 1997. Thus Dumbledore died in June of the same year: June 1997.
But we learn that Dumbledore was not 150 years old. Muriel and those who followed her were right, and those who followed JKR's interview about Dumbledore's age were wrong ! (me for example -confused - by the interview!)
azi - Sep 1, 2007 5:18 am (#2695 of 2974)
I'm so glad I'm not the one sorting out the timeline on this.
Is it just me, or do the wizards of the month usually move in some way? Like glittering jewellery, for example? Dumbledore isn't moving at all. Maybe it's just my imagination that it normally happens. DD also looks a bit...dark...not the benign image you usually have of him.
I can see JKR changing his age from the one in the interview purely because of the headaches that age produces. I mean, there's a lot of time to fill! It would also make people who are older than him really old. When we seem to have most wizards dying at the usual 'muggle' age, despite JKR saying they live longer than muggles, it seems odd that a few live substantially (it would be 50+ years) longer than others.
Chemyst - Sep 1, 2007 7:07 am (#2696 of 2974)
It is not just you, Azi. Wizards of the month usually do have some movement. I think his half-moon glasses also look a day or two into gibbous.
Lina - Sep 1, 2007 7:45 am (#2697 of 2974)
Indeed, I noticed that something was missing but I couldn't figure out what it was until I read your post, Azi. It seems to me that she is a bit tired. I hope some day she will enjoy communicating with us again. I think there are still things that she could put in F.A.Q. section and in all other sections and so on.
While on 150, it sounds very similar to 115 and since she said it in an interview, she could always say that she was misheard. That might also be the reason why she put in the wrong year of his death, so that it would be 115, a number that sounds like 150. JM2K.
Jo, we love you and you have every right to make mistakes! What you did to us is just to good to hold any grudges.
journeymom - Sep 1, 2007 7:10 pm (#2698 of 2974)
It would also make people who are older than him really old. azi
Madam Marchbanks administered Dumbledore's NEWTS, but also administered Harry's OWLS. If Dumbledore were 150 years old or so, that would make Madam Marchbanks very old indeed! 115 years old is a little more reasonable.
Phelim Mcintyre - Sep 2, 2007 4:57 am (#2699 of 2974)
This also makes sense of Aunt Muriel's claims in Deathly Hallows. If Dumbledore is 115 and Muriel is 107 then there is only 8 years difference thereabouts).
Good Evans - Sep 3, 2007 5:53 am (#2700 of 2974)
I like his skinny and nobbly looking elbows!!!
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
legolas returns - Sep 3, 2007 11:00 am (#2701 of 2974)
Perhaps the fact that Dumbledore is not moving is intentional. The way that he is looking is much like a stare. Perhaps you are meant to feel like you are being "x-rayed".
John Bumbledore - Sep 4, 2007 9:53 am (#2702 of 2974)
Albus is a very accomplished Legilimens, yes? Perhaps he is memasuring us?
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Sep 19, 2007 12:12 am (#2703 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Hermione!
jose043 - Sep 19, 2007 12:15 am (#2704 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Hermione & Many more to come.
Tazzygirl - Sep 19, 2007 9:36 pm (#2705 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Hermione!
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Sep 28, 2007 7:54 am (#2706 of 2974)
Any bets on the new wizard of the month? I am thinking it could be snape or harry
PeskyPixie - Sep 28, 2007 7:57 am (#2707 of 2974)
I would love to see her interpretation of Snape as book-Snape and movie-Snape are worlds apart.
Phelim Mcintyre - Sep 28, 2007 8:38 am (#2708 of 2974)
I agree PeskyPixie - I'd love to see a sketch by Joe of Snape.
Choices - Sep 28, 2007 8:52 am (#2709 of 2974)
I think she draws a pretty clear picture of Snape in the book and he is not at all appealing. Alan Rickman completely changed our view of Snape when he played him in the movie. Had they been true to the description of Snape from the book, the guy who played Filch would have been a better choice to look like the book description of Snape. I can't imagine anyone else as Snape now that I have seen Rickman in the part, but he is far and away more charismatic and good looking than book Snape.
Phelim Mcintyre - Sep 28, 2007 8:55 am (#2710 of 2974)
So most people who adore Snape have the movie version in mind not the book version. I agree the actor who plays Filch would have been closer to book Snape but that is now impossible.
Choices - Sep 28, 2007 8:58 am (#2711 of 2974)
Phelim - "So most people who adore Snape have the movie version in mind not the book version."
I definitely think so. I know I do.
PeskyPixie - Sep 28, 2007 9:36 am (#2712 of 2974)
I've been a fan of the books from before the movies came out. My imagination's Snape is quite different from Alan Rickman or Filch (I can't recall the actor's name at the moment). Tim Roth (the original casting choice for Snape, who backed out to film 'Planet of the Apes' instead) actually comes closest to my idea of Severus Snape's appearance.
Gina R Snape - Sep 28, 2007 9:47 am (#2713 of 2974)
Actually, Rickman was first choice but they didn't think he'd agree so they asked Roth. When Roth declined they asked Rickman and were pleased to get a yes from him.
I've debated the movie/book Snape thing many times here :koffKipkoff: and definitely like Rickman but think of book Snape as the REAL Snape.
I really hope she makes him Wizard of the Month.
PeskyPixie - Sep 28, 2007 10:03 am (#2714 of 2974)
Book Snape is the REAL Snape for me as well, and I do see Tim Roth fitting his body type better ('round-shouldered yet angular', medium height, thin face). I honestly don't find book Snape to be all that grotesque; he's no Johnny Depp, but he only becomes 'miserable'-looking after Lily's death. Apart from the greasy hair I'd say he's quite average-looking ... if only he smiled a bit more.
journeymom - Sep 28, 2007 10:36 am (#2715 of 2974)
I think Jeremy Irons would have been a better Snape than Alan Rickman. Thinner, more angular and closer in age. Tim Roth would have been more appropriate. But they're all too good looking and charismatic. None of them make me angry or disgusted.
But yes, here's hoping October's Wizard is Snape. Though Harry would be fine with me.
PeskyPixie - Sep 28, 2007 10:40 am (#2716 of 2974)
I find Jeremy Irons even yummier than Alan Rickman.
I think you could make Roth look worse, and a lot depends on the acting of course.
Gina R Snape - Sep 28, 2007 11:46 am (#2717 of 2974)
Jeremy Irons played a brilliant Snape in "Harry Potter and the Secret Chamber Pot of Azerbaijan."
If next month isn't Snape, I can't really think of who else.
wynnleaf - Sep 28, 2007 5:55 pm (#2718 of 2974)
I've never thought of Rickman as Snape. He's far too old anyway. However, there really is little in the series to lead us to believe he looks particularly bad. Oily hair, yes, and bad teeth, but that doesn't necessarily add up to bad looking.
Lina - Sep 29, 2007 12:14 am (#2719 of 2974)
I hope for Snape next month too. Harry may be greater, but he is still alive, I'd give priority to the dead wizard.
Actually, when I saw Karkaroff in GoF, I thought - that's the way they should have made Snape, except for the beard. I think Rickman is acting very well, they should have just worked more on the make up. He is looking too good for the real Snape.
Luna Logic - Sep 29, 2007 12:26 am (#2720 of 2974)
Wynnleaf : there really is little in the series to lead us to believe he looks particularly bad. Oily hair, yes, and bad teeth, but that doesn't necessarily add up to bad looking.
On J Rowling's site, there is a drawing of Snape(by herself, I think). During your discussion I had the two "Snape" in mind, Rickman and the drawing... Really different!
zelmia - Sep 29, 2007 2:09 am (#2721 of 2974)
Just popping in to add that Jeremy Irons isn't really any closer to the right age for Snape than Rickman. In fact, he's only two years younger than Rickman - who is 61, by the way.
journeymom - Sep 29, 2007 12:52 pm (#2722 of 2974)
Good point. Jeremy Irons had a lot of salt and pepper hair in Eragon.
Die Zimtzicke - Sep 29, 2007 9:32 pm (#2723 of 2974)
If people think Rickman is too old, then so is Jeremy Irons, isn't he?
I love Jeremy and Alan both, but I think they both look too old. The actor who plays Filch is absolutely too old.
PeskyPixie - Sep 30, 2007 9:34 am (#2724 of 2974)
One often forgets how young Snape is. During the timespan of the books he ages from 31 to 38. Hence my opinion that Tim Roth is an excellent casting choice for Severus Snape.
Choices - Sep 30, 2007 10:05 am (#2725 of 2974)
I think age is the least important thing about the character of Snape. Yes, he is in his thirties according to the books and he is not very attractive as he is described in the books, but Alan Rickman is so very "Snape" in my opinion. I think if JKR could somehow have seen Rickman as Snape before she wrote the books, I think she would have used Rickman as her model for Snape - he is just too perfect. Granted he is older and better looking than book Snape, but his attitude, voice and demeanor, and his fantastic acting ability, perfectly portray Snape in my opinion. I can't even imagine anyone else being Snape.
Neville Longbottom - Sep 30, 2007 4:06 pm (#2726 of 2974)
To bring this back on-topic ( ;-) ), Snape is not the new Wizard of the Month. It's Harry.
Mrs. Sirius - Sep 30, 2007 4:09 pm (#2727 of 2974)
He's there.... no words. Just picture. And this month his eyes sparkle, his hands move and his wand flashes!!!!
wynnleaf - Sep 30, 2007 6:13 pm (#2728 of 2974)
Certainly there are words! Click the Dark Mark.
Mrs Brisbee - Sep 30, 2007 8:11 pm (#2729 of 2974)
So I take it that the witches and wizards need not be dead to be Wizard of the Month.
Will we get Ron and Hermione for the next two months? ***hope hope hope***
Marie E. - Sep 30, 2007 9:26 pm (#2730 of 2974)
So Harry became head of the Auror department at age 27? That's pretty good, right?
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Sep 30, 2007 9:39 pm (#2731 of 2974)
I'm glad she chose Harry - I suspect it will be Ron and Hermione over the next two months.
legolas returns - Oct 1, 2007 12:13 am (#2732 of 2974)
Yeah. I am really pleased that Harry is the wizard of the month. If Harry joined the department at age 17 he cant have completed his final year at school. Oh well at least he had a lot of practical experience in his final year. Harry must have had a fairly metioric rise through the deparment. Training takes a number of years (I cant remember whether it was three of four years). So at best he had about 6-7 years to become head. So yes Marie E thats not bad .
Joanna Lupin - Oct 1, 2007 1:26 am (#2733 of 2974)
Yay! I'm so glad it's Harry! He didn't complete his education, but who would dare to begrudge him that? The kid defeated the most powerful dark wizard in history at 17!
Madame Pomfrey - Oct 1, 2007 6:42 am (#2734 of 2974)
I am so glad to see Harry as Wotm.I couldn't imagine anyone but him.Hopefully Ron & Hermione are next.Maybe Neville too.Head of Auror Department at 27..Go Harry!!
Mrs Brisbee - Oct 1, 2007 6:52 am (#2735 of 2974)
Neville, yes, he deserves a mention soon too. I think Molly Weasley deserves a WotM spot for killing Bellatrix. Maybe Lily too, since we are always hearing about how her sacrifice made it all possible. Lee Jordan for running Potterwatch is also deserving, if you ask me. Lots and lots of possibilities!
Marie E. - Oct 1, 2007 7:23 am (#2736 of 2974)
I would imagine that any student who fought and survived in the Battle of Hogwarts would at least get an Outstanding in DADA N.E.W.T.S. and O.W.L.S.
Die Zimtzicke - Oct 1, 2007 7:50 am (#2737 of 2974)
I may be the only one (what else is new?) but I was horribly depressed at the implication that Harry never went back to school and finished his last year. He's a glorified drop out. I wish he had gone back and finished. It's bad enough that he apparently got into the auror department without having to take any training at all, not even a class on procedures, for appearances sake, but I do wish he had finished school.
Mrs Brisbee - Oct 1, 2007 8:05 am (#2738 of 2974)
I am surprised they seemed to have skipped training, since a lot of it would have been procedure, like Die said. Perhaps after the war they were desperate to fill the ranks-- the Aurors probably had been hit hard in the war. Harry probably got on the job training out of necessity.
I do wish he had gone back to school. He even laments at least once in the books that there were certain areas of useful magic that he didn't know well, like healing.
journeymom - Oct 1, 2007 8:44 am (#2739 of 2974)
I like this depiction of Harry. I like how various artists depict him differently. This isn't a whole lot different from Mary Grand Pre's image of Harry. But he's got the scar and the messy black hair. That's quite a chin, there.
PeskyPixie - Oct 1, 2007 10:11 am (#2740 of 2974)
Apart from DADA Harry himself acknowledges that there is much he does not know, and much that he is not extraordinary at. Hard work on his NEWTS and rigorous training would be necessary. There are only so many Dark wizards who can be defeated by love ... and Harry lacks the connection with them which he had with Voldie.
I do like the depiction of Harry. Messy, black hair, not brown!
Good Evans - Oct 1, 2007 10:22 am (#2741 of 2974)
I thought Harry went back to Hogwarts and finished? If so how could he have joined the auror department when he was 17? I'm a bit confused!!!!
azi - Oct 1, 2007 10:27 am (#2742 of 2974)
I found the answer in which JKR discussed Harry going back to school confusing. I couldn't work out if she said he did or not, the wording was all...weird.
I think it would be acceptable for him to go straight into auror training. A great morale boost and a good addition to the auror team. Maybe he had extra classes to get him up to speed with some things? With the 3 years training before being fully qualified, I think Harry would have got up to the same level as the other aurors, especially since DADA was his best subject.
PeskyPixie - Oct 1, 2007 10:30 am (#2743 of 2974)
I hope he got help with his Charms, Transfiguration and Potions as well. As I've said before, 'love' won't work with the next Dark wizard waiting around the corner.
Mare - Oct 1, 2007 10:53 am (#2744 of 2974)
Love might not always work but he does have the advantage of his name. There will be many dark wizards who would be very afraid to face the auror who defeated the Dark Lord.
I know it could be argued that there might be some who would see it as a challenge, but seeing how Voldie was portrayed in the books, and how afraid every-one was for him, I don't think that will be the case.
PeskyPixie - Oct 1, 2007 11:33 am (#2745 of 2974)
Edited Oct 1, 2007 12:58 pm
I can imagine Snape in Heaven (or wherever one believes souls retire to): 'Of course Potter skipped his N.E.W.T.s and went directly into Auror training. He's broken rules and crossed boundaries since first he set foot in Hogwarts.'
Mrs. Sirius - Oct 1, 2007 3:59 pm (#2746 of 2974)
There is "life credit", at some universities in the United States. One does not have to take all the courses ordinarily expected for a certain degree if it is deemed that the person has in the passage of time done some work or otherwise gained experience that can be substituted for the classroom work.
Also there was a time, including early 20th century I think) when one could take a bar exam without having attending law school. Working experience in a law office or apprenticing to a lawyer for certain amount of time and perhaps a year of law school were sufficient.
While the trio where out they learned so many new skills. These would be universal skills that can apply in many different ways. I would say that Harry (and Ron and Hermione too) qualify for this dispensation. I think they could skip to the head of the line.
Chemyst - Oct 1, 2007 5:40 pm (#2747 of 2974)
I thought it was a little funny (sardonic humor) that Harry, for all of what he accomplished, still seems to have gotten into the Auror Department because of who he knew. – There's really no other reason to mention Kingsley Shackelbolt.
Nathan Zimmermann - Oct 1, 2007 7:42 pm (#2748 of 2974)
I think it likely that Harry's defeat of Voldemort and the Horcrux hunt served as a D.A.D.A. practical of sorts nullifying the need for a D.A.D.A. N.E.W.T.
In regards to potions and the other courses it seems plausible to assume that Harry, Ron Hermione went back after defeating Tom Riddle and completed their seventh year in one of three ways:
First, an intensive compressed track that condensed the Trio's seventh year; Second, an alternative certification method akin to a general eqivalency degree (G.E.D.) program which taken be undertaken while an individual is working; Third the Trio could have undertaken some form of work-study program to complete their studies.
Chemyst, I view the mention of Shacklebolt in a different way, I thoink it demonstrates to the public at large that Harry has chose to associate himself with a courageous and righteous individual who proven himself worthy of trust and beong someone in whom both Dumbledore and Harry justly have confidence.
Die Zimtzicke - Oct 1, 2007 10:13 pm (#2749 of 2974)
Yes, there are life credits at some universities, but you still have to sit exams to prove you know your stuff, and they are difficult ones. (Otherwise no one would go to school!) Harry's education was spotty at best in many subjects required for that position. There was more involved than DADA.
Plus I question the notion of a kid who had gone through what he went through being ready after just a couple of months to give up his education, work full-time, or anything like that. He was about to turn 18 when the main part of the story ended! He only had a couple of months to make the auror department at 17. If he were to truly have the normal life the fans wanted for him, shouldn't he have gotten some downtime? I just don't think he was mature enough to start so soon after the last battle. I don't see how he could have been emotionally ready.
Lina - Oct 1, 2007 10:51 pm (#2750 of 2974)
At least once, at the end of the year (CoS) Dumbeldore announced that all exams are canceled. I guess that they were canceled at the end of that year and that the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.s where organized differently after a year of Death Eaters ruling at Hogwarts. Being employed at the Auror office certainly helped Harry to get prepared for the exams. I agree with Chemyst that the fact - who he knew - was a little bit crucial for that employment, but I don't think that it was undeserved.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
zelmia - Oct 1, 2007 11:26 pm (#2751 of 2974)
Harry's education was spotty at best in many subjects required for that position. - Actually, Harry's OWL results were quite good. He earned a "E" in all the required classes for Auror training, including Potions. The only areas where he failed were History of Magic and Divination, neither of which has any immediate bearing on becoming an Auror.
Luna Logic - Oct 2, 2007 12:11 am (#2752 of 2974)
Edited by Oct 2, 2007 12:21 am
I agree totally with Zelmia :Actually, Harry's OWL results were quite good. He earned a "E" in all the required classes for Auror training, including Potions.
I will add that Harry was teacher of D.A.D.A. when he was fifteen, and with a great success. He was respected. He could practise AND teach all he knew so as others could practise too. I think that Harry is also unbeatable in duel- given to the reflex he has to put the hand to his wand in threatening situations, and to his capacity to disarm his adversary at once.
And last, he has totally matured since Dobby's death (the future French cover for Book 7 is very expressive about this moment - I wish I could put the link for Editions Gallimard!)
edited to add : One last argument in favour of Harry-already-Auror at the end of Book 7 is his great intuition. As maria cloos says in Harry's Thread : (...)he is extremely intuitive. He makes his best moves based on intuition and allows his heart to guide him.
I will add that in Book 7 he has learned to master his heart's moves. It gets concretised at that moment after Dobby's death, when he has to choose between Hallows (which are totally attractive for him) and Horcruxes (the voice and way of wisdom).
jose043 - Oct 2, 2007 1:45 am (#2753 of 2974)
It was great to see Harry as wizard of the month. Maybe the kids who couldn't finish their schooling at Hogwart's, finished there schooling at the Ministry of Magic, down in one of the old court rooms LoL. She has to write another book to answer all these questions for us!!!!!!!!
Josephine and Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Die Zimtzicke - Oct 2, 2007 6:06 am (#2754 of 2974)
I still think it's odd that maybe two months after the battle (since he was about to turn 18 when the battle ended) he was ready to go to work full-time. What was the rush? Most of the Death Eaters the aurors were after had been captured by then anyway.
As for classes, we know there were classes aurors needed to take that they didn't have at Hogwarts. Tonks mentioned stealth and tracking, for one.
Luna Logic - Oct 2, 2007 7:42 am (#2755 of 2974)
Die Zimtzicke : there were classes aurors needed to take that they didn't have at Hogwarts. Tonks mentioned stealth and tracking, for one.
Yes, but I think the trio was expert at those exercices (all their school years in Hogwarts, Hogsmeade, with the Cloak, with polyjuice... And then again in Book seven at the Ministry and Gringotts.
It seems to be really a matter of validation of practical experience .
After a war, when many aurors were dead or not sure... The age, and academical papers don't seem to be so important in the wizard world.
The idea of Harry sitting at school classes after that year and his accomplishments seems to me impossible!
Also, I never imagined the three years of aurors training as upper-school years, but as a practical training under the guidance of experienced aurors.
TwinklingBlueEyes - Oct 2, 2007 7:58 am (#2756 of 2974)
What was the rush? Hmm, maybe because this is a work of FICTION? Not the Real world as we know it? Maybe because JKR gives it as a plausible end to Harry's saga and is ready to move onto something else?
It still amazes me that fans can try and make a story of fiction follow along the lines of the world today. Even though the story sends signals to the people of today, fiction gives an author leeway to get their point across WITHOUT staying within the guidelines of what the readers feel is "realistic". That is one of the things that the HP series does for it's readers, it is plausible in this modern age. (Read within the realm of our sensibilities, but as a work of fiction allows both the author and the reader to use their imagination.)
Can you tell I have no problem with?
Mrs. Sirius - Oct 2, 2007 8:20 am (#2757 of 2974)
IMHO, the rush is that you want to "get on with life". In the reality of the wizarding world there are "bills" to pay, "dead lines to meet". After a traumatic experience, sometimes the best thing to do it something.
In the reality of the wizarding world, after such an extremely harrowing experience, Harry wanted to get a good night's sleep and then wake up and start living a normal life time, job, wife, house, kids.
These normal things can fill up the time until you are able to start to digest the enormity of what you have just faced. JM2K
Steve Newton - Oct 2, 2007 9:14 am (#2758 of 2974)
What's the rush? Well there are a lot of DEs out there and I see no particular reason why they would repent. At the very least they will have to be hunted down and I would think that many would not come quietly.
Madam Pince - Oct 2, 2007 9:23 am (#2759 of 2974)
Luna Logic, thanks for the "heads up" about the French cover art for the upcoming Gallimard edition of DH. It is quite nice! Harry's expression very much reflects the maturity you mention. (Fun website, too, by the way -- the Harry Potter section, I mean. It reminds me of JKR's site but almost better! Now if only I could read it... Took me forever to figure out how to find the cover of DH without understanding much of what I was clicking on! Thank goodness for Latin roots! )
PeskyPixie - Oct 2, 2007 1:15 pm (#2760 of 2974)
Death Eaters are being herded into Azkaban at the end of DH. The Aurors could achieve this without Harry's assistance.
I've got my own opinions regarding this topic, however, as I'm quite unpopular on other threads at the moment I choose to not express myself on this one at present.
Gina R Snape - Oct 2, 2007 1:35 pm (#2761 of 2974)
I can imagine Snape in Heaven (or wherever one believes souls retire to): 'Of course Potter skipped his N.E.W.T.s and went directly into Auror training. He's broken rules and crossed boundaries since first he set foot in Hogwarts.'
PeskyPixie, that's the funniest thing I've read all day. And he'd be right!
I highly doubt the auror dept. would care one iota if he passed his NEWTS. Being 'the boy who lived' and 'the chosen one' would be qualification enough for most,and then add 'friend of Kingsley Shacklebolt' on top of it, and who cares about school? He'd have to pass auror training, which was quite rigorous according to Tonks.
But it's the principle of the matter. I'd like to think they would value well-rounded knowledge.
PeskyPixie - Oct 2, 2007 1:40 pm (#2762 of 2974)
Gina, thanks for responding to that. It was a funny thought I had and when no one commented on it I assumed it lost its humour on the page! Twenty points to you for brightening up my day.
Gina R Snape - Oct 2, 2007 3:23 pm (#2763 of 2974)
PeskyPixie - Oct 2, 2007 3:25 pm (#2764 of 2974)
As it's my House as well, let's make it fifty points!
Hopefully our dearly departed Head of House will be Wizard of the Month soon.
journeymom - Oct 2, 2007 4:07 pm (#2765 of 2974)
I wonder if Jo will give Snape a Happy Birthday card. I hope so.
Gina R Snape - Oct 2, 2007 5:11 pm (#2766 of 2974)
She gave him one last year. I guess I assumed anyone who got a birthday card before will continue to get one. But now that he's dead, she might not! Oh, but then she'd have to change the birthday card for the twins as well.
PeskyPixie - Oct 2, 2007 5:14 pm (#2767 of 2974)
"Happy Birthday, George"? Oh God, I won't be able to bear it. I'm not checking her site on April Fool's Day. Someone just let me know what happens.
Die Zimtzicke - Oct 2, 2007 9:02 pm (#2768 of 2974)
I would accept that the rush was because this was a work of fiction, if Jo had put this information into the dratted book. Anything she says in her interviews means squat to me, once I get past the annoyance I feel when I first read/hear it. If she wanted me to know something, she should have put it in the books.
Getting into the department without the required education and training, just because Harry's the boy-who-lived and a friend of the department head just seems out of character to me, because Harry never wanted to get anything handed to him simply because of who he was.
Someone would be bound to resent it, probably someone who has spent three years doing the required work, only to be bypassed for the job by Harry Potter.
Eponine - Oct 3, 2007 6:16 am (#2769 of 2974)
Well, since this is all a work of fiction, those supposed characters who spend three years of doing the required work don't actually exist. And they don't exist in the canon unless Jo says they exist. So unless we get a wizard of the month card for Mortimer Hornswaggle, the first auror candidate to go crazy for losing the job to Harry Potter, and turned the ministry fountain into a statue of himself as protest, then I can't really see what the problem is. If you don't want the information from Jo, why don't you just ignore it instead of complaining about it?
Anyway, I hope we start getting WotM cards for all the main characters now. If we do, who do you think will come next? Ron and Hermione definitely, but after that, I'm not sure.
Mrs Brisbee - Oct 3, 2007 6:42 am (#2770 of 2974)
The WotM text says Harry joined the Auror department at 17, not that he became an Auror at 17. I think I'll go with him actually doing the three years of training. But I'll have to agree that if Harry was let in on an exception, it wasn't fair. If the Auror Department was desperate for recruits and was allowing all to apply without the formally specified prerequisites because of a need to fill their depleted ranks, then it's all okay. If what McGonagall said about them needing Potions and Transfigurations and Charms is true, Harry is under-qualified in a few areas. In other areas, like DADA and practical experience, he does quite well.
Gatorgrad1991 - Oct 3, 2007 11:06 am (#2771 of 2974)
I think the key word on the card is "re-shuffled". That, to me, seems to imply that some of the requirements may have been changed. Which makes it not ridiculous to think that Harry got in, at least as a trainee, without the necessary NEWTs.
PeskyPixie - Oct 3, 2007 11:21 am (#2772 of 2974)
Or maybe it simply has to do with JKR's 'maths'? Perhaps she hadn't realized that Harry's 18th birthday is just around the corner in the final chapter of DH?
Joanna Lupin - Oct 3, 2007 12:03 pm (#2773 of 2974)
Re-shuffled also implies that the ministry staff was changed, probably those people who collaborated with the new regime (Dawlish, anyone?) lost their jobs and there were a lot of vacancies.
Madam Pince - Oct 3, 2007 12:10 pm (#2774 of 2974)
***Psssst, PeskyPixie... I laughed really hard at the Snape-in-heaven comment, too! I just hadn't gotten around to posting about it yet...*** High-fives to you! Perfect characterization! I can even see his lip curling as he says it!
PeskyPixie - Oct 3, 2007 12:51 pm (#2775 of 2974)
Yay! I'm glad my thought translated well to the page.
Twenty points to you as well, Madam Pince. Am I to assume you are a Gryffindor?
Good Evans - Oct 3, 2007 1:05 pm (#2776 of 2974)
Gee, it was only an observation! I can easily reconcile Harry starting work at the ministry and doing his NEWTS day release or something!!! I guess he earned the right to be cut a bit of slack. Although I do like pesky pixies Snape line!
Esther Rose - Oct 3, 2007 2:28 pm (#2777 of 2974)
I can only imagine what Snape's portrait said in the head master's office once it was put there.
I also see the distinction between working with and working for the Auror department. It may be that Harry was needed to help discuss certain issues within the auror that the department had no clue that they needed to address. As in who to arrest (Umbridge), who was doing some dirty work on the side, how to beef up the security on some of the recently broken into buildings, and just how important it is for Aurors to know the basics of Wandlore. Just to name a few things. I am sure that he was probably an assistant or apprentice of some sort until he passed the Auror exam.
Mrs. Sirius - Oct 3, 2007 11:01 pm (#2778 of 2974)
At the risk of being too real world,(and not very humorous) under certain extreme situations, usually wars, new personal are taken in even if they are not "fully qualified", and then brought up to speed in areas where they may be weak.
If I remember correctly, in the current situation in the USA, military folks were taken in if they spoke the need languages or were familiar with the appropriate cultures. They were given accelarated training in other areas.
Back in the early 20th century in the USA when the FBI was battling mobs in the middle of the country, they took candidates that were not fully qualified, as long as they had law degrees or were accountants. At that point law enforcement needed personal that understood these areas of law, so they were hired and then trained in weaker areas.
jose043 - Oct 3, 2007 11:46 pm (#2779 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Minerva McGonagall & many more to come.
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Oct 4, 2007 1:00 am (#2780 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Minerva - hope you are enjoying retirement and the quiet life
Accio Sirius - Oct 4, 2007 4:41 am (#2781 of 2974)
Do we know who becomes the next headmaster after Snape?
Madam Pince - Oct 4, 2007 5:51 am (#2782 of 2974)
JKR said in some interview that McGonnagal would be getting on in years so she wouldn't be headmaster, but it always seemed to me that that answer was given rather spur-of-the-moment and that it wasn't thought out completely, because the questions were sort of rapid-fire if I remember correctly. It seems to me like McGonnagal would've had to have been at least an interim headmaster for a year or so, until things had settled. She wasn't as old as Dumbledore.
PeskyPixie, I think I'm a GryffinClaw. Or a RavenDor. But definitely an admirer of Prof. Snape's dry wit.
Snuffles - Oct 4, 2007 6:15 am (#2783 of 2974)
Of course it's just Snape's dry wit, Madame P. *cough Alan Rickman cough*
Mrs. Sirius - Oct 4, 2007 6:23 am (#2784 of 2974)
Pesky your humor was not missed. It gave me a "chuckle" to imagine Snape saying that. As the Gryffindor, I had a Ronnish sentiment of "that's what he would say, sardonic old git".
I admire Snape from a distance. I was one who never doubted he was on Dumbledore side but, he is way too complex for me.
A big Happy birthday to Professor McGonagall. I still want Sirius' birthday, dagnabit!.
PeskyPixie - Oct 4, 2007 8:28 am (#2785 of 2974)
Aw shucks, now you're just makin' me blush.
Happy Birthday, Minnie McGonagall!
zelmia - Oct 4, 2007 10:09 am (#2786 of 2974)
17 is "of age" - an adult - in the Wizarding World. Why do people find it so incongruous that Harry, who was an adult, joined the Auror Department at 17? His birthday is in July so clearly he joined with Kingsley right away.
Which makes sense. Just because Voldemort had been killed didn't mean his reign was entirely over. There would still have been other Voldemort supporters out there who needed to be rounded up and dealt with.
And to me, 10 years is about the right amount of time to become head of your department. But if you start very young, then yes, you will be a pretty young department head.
Gina R Snape - Oct 4, 2007 10:53 am (#2787 of 2974)
I think JKR meant McG would not have been Headmistress at the time Albus Severus, Scorpius, et al. made it to school because she'd be getting on in years. Not that she wouldn't step in at the end of book 7.
azi - Oct 4, 2007 10:58 am (#2788 of 2974)
That's what I took the comment to mean, Gina.
Choices - Oct 4, 2007 11:14 am (#2789 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Professor McGonagall.
I certainly don't want to think of McGonagall as being retired. She is practically the backbone of Hogwarts and I want to think of her teaching all those young witches and wizards for many more years to come. I don't want Harry and Ron and Hermione's children to miss out on having her for a teacher and probably head of house.
I have to confess PeskyPixie, it makes me cringe to think of Minerva McGonagall being called "Minnie". You must be very brave to dare do that. :-)
PeskyPixie - Oct 4, 2007 11:22 am (#2790 of 2974)
Edited Oct 4, 2007 12:19 pm
I thought 'Minnie' would really annoy her, Choices. The Slytherin in me made me do it!
I really love her, though.
If I may borrow a bit from Gina's post, 'Happy Birthday, Minnie McG!!'
Madam Pince - Oct 4, 2007 12:13 pm (#2791 of 2974)
I hope you're right about the McGonnagal/headmistress thing, Gina and azi. That makes sense to me.
Alas, Snuffles, although I think Alan Rickman is a great actor and I love to watch all his movies, he doesn't really "do anything for me" in those terms. I'll leave that for Gina! (Well, I will say that he has an awesome and hypnotic voice, but that's enough for me...) But the character of Snape is just sooooo intriguing to me!
Victoire Weasley - Oct 4, 2007 3:48 pm (#2792 of 2974)
Hi everyone, I'm trying to catch up on this thread and have been reading throught the many posts since Harry was named Wizard of the Month. I thought it was absolutely brilliant that Harry joined the Aurors office. I thought it was a bit soon at first too, but then I thought of Harry and figured he wouldn't rest until he saw to it that it really was over.
And after that? I certainly agree that Harry would be quite keen to get on with life after Voldemort. Harry wouldn't need the money for a while, not until he had three little mouths to feed, but I can't see him sitting still for long.
I agree with you Choices, McGonagall is the backbone of Hogwarts now. But I was wondering who would become head of Griffindor House? Do we know the houses of the rest of the teachers?
My vote would be for Neville. Sorry, Professor Longbottom!
One final thought regarding the future Wizard of the Month nominees...Do you really think Ron would make it on? What would Ron's description say? Most famous for being the best mate of the boy who lived.
I'm sorry, am I being too harsh on Ron?
Chemyst - Oct 4, 2007 5:59 pm (#2793 of 2974)
Most famous for being the best mate of the boy who lived.
I'm sorry, am I being too harsh on Ron?
No. If you were being too harsh you would have said, "Most famous for being the husband of the brightest girl in her class."
I was really surprised Harry showed up so soon as Wizard of the Month. I'd have expected him to have been saved for a special anniversary. It left me wondering if the website is as 'done' as the series. Does JKR not find it as much fun now?
Potteraholic - Oct 5, 2007 3:42 am (#2794 of 2974)
Does JKR not find it as much fun now? I was wondering the same thing, especially since her Diary page has net been changed since DH came out. She's going to be on a 3-city book tour in the States starting next week, but no update about it on her website, not even a tiny morsel.
Madam Pince - Oct 5, 2007 6:47 am (#2795 of 2974)
I agree. I'm thinking she just gave a big "whoosh! It's DONE!" when DH came out, and she's avoiding all things Potter lately -- taking a bit of a break. Can't say I blame her, really, though. Her past ten or fifteen years have been consumed by the books.
I was surprised Harry was chosen as WOTM also.
Victoire Weasley - Oct 5, 2007 8:41 am (#2796 of 2974)
No. If you were being too harsh you would have said, "Most famous for being the husband of the brightest girl in her class."
It did seem really soon to have Harry as WOTM, but I was grateful for the info. I think JKR wants us to have enough information to keep us guessing and speculating about what happens between those nineteen years that passed. She probably has Harry's whole life planned out. We know she has much more material than went into the books.
I hope she keeps giving us little pieces of the puzzle. What else would we do?
Esther Rose - Oct 5, 2007 11:12 am (#2797 of 2974)
I thought differently. I was hoping that it was a sign that we will find out what happened to other characters in the wizarding world through WOTM.
Elanor - Oct 5, 2007 11:47 am (#2798 of 2974)
Harry being the new Wizard of the Month doesn't surprise me at all. Actually, from a symbolic point of view, it is perfect.
Indeed, after the 4 founders representing the 4 elements and Dumbledore, connected to Quintessence (the "5th" element) all series long, we have a new (symbolic) Quintessence figure: Harry. Remember "Quintessence: A Quest" Harry was reading in the HBP? At the end of the journey, as the "quest" is achieved, Harry has in turn become the living embodiment of this principle.
More, the text tells us that Harry became an Auror after Voldemort's downfall. "Auror(e)" means dawn in French and, in alchemy, it is a symbol for the achieved great Work/journey. You can find more details about the Auror symbolism in this post #1246 of the alchemy thread but, in short: ""The day that rises symbolizes the beginning of the King/Sun's reign, that is to say the achievement of the Great Work " (a symbolism magnificently displayed by Jo in "The Wandmaker" chapter incidentally). Harry's WotM "card" also says that this happened "under Kingsley Shaklebolt": the mention of Kingsley also adds a "royal"/Sun's reign tinge to the post-Voldemort days.
The text also says that Harry was 27 when he became head of the "Auror" department in... 2007, that is the year of the DH/ "red/achieved great Work book". If we use a bit of Hermione's favorite "arithmancy", both 27 and 2007, when their numbers are added, give 9 - a symbol for perfection. Thus we find the idea of the successfully accomplished journey again here. (All this IMO, of course. )
Ana Cis - Oct 6, 2007 8:11 am (#2799 of 2974)
Don’t be discouraged Esther Rose, I got the impression from her Bloomsbury chat time that she’ll continue to post information in her web site, probably in the FAQ section. At least I hope so!
Elanor, I agree. The trio’s journey, in search of the Horcruxes, was a dangerous labyrinth that helped them grow significantly in both mind and spirit. I would say from Jo’s interview, she sees it the same way:
JKR: Yeh, I think that's what everyone wants to do. Harry and Ron utterly revolutionize the Auror Department. They are now the experts. It doesn't matter how old they are or what else they've done. And Hermione, Well I think that she's now pretty high up in the Department for Magical Law Enforcement. I would imagine that her brainpower and her knowledge of how the Dark Arts operate would really give her a sound grounding. They made a new world. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
I believe Ron deserves to be Wizard of the Month. He saved Harry’s life twice in Death Hallows; he’s a true Gryffindor that could use the Sword and destroy the Horcrux; he became the leader of the group and encouraging them when he returned; he thought of the Basilick fangs and remembered Harry’s use of Parseltongue to get the fangs and be able to destroy cup. Although he may have been the weakest of the three, he was still loyal, brave, and persevering. He also has a great capacity to love. Yeah, go Ron!
Victoire Weasley - Oct 8, 2007 9:55 am (#2800 of 2974)
I suppose you're right. Ron played an important role. Harry didn't do everything on his own. Also, a lot happens between the end of the book and the postings of the WOTM, who knows what Ron, or anyone else, has really accomplished in all that time.
Ana Cis, thanks for the quote. I had missed that one.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 10:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
John Bumbledore - Oct 9, 2007 12:19 pm (#2801 of 2974)
Do you suppose it is too much to hope for that Ron, on his wizard of the month card is recognized as the best keeper that the Chuddly Cannons ever had? That he lead them to their first ever win of the Quidditch World Cup or something like that?
Well, it is a thought.
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Choices - Oct 9, 2007 5:17 pm (#2802 of 2974)
Oh, that would be lovely for Ron. We will just have to hope it is so. :-)
Die Zimtzicke - Oct 9, 2007 9:14 pm (#2803 of 2974)
So he works at the Weasley shop, in the auror office and plays Quidditch, too? What a busy boy he would be, and very accomplished for a drop out. LOL!
Tazzygirl - Oct 12, 2007 12:02 am (#2804 of 2974)
There were a lot of posts, so I ended up skimming most of them (so forgive me if this has been said! ) but:
I can see Harry joining the Auror group at age 17 and also finishing school. Hogwarts' school year ends in June. Harry's birthday is not until July. In the month or so between him finishing school and turning 18, he could have gotten that job at the Ministry.
I'm so glad he is Wizard of the month! (Did anyone get tears in their eyes when they saw it? ). Happy late birthday to McGonagall too!
zelmia - Oct 12, 2007 4:22 pm (#2805 of 2974)
Do you suppose it is too much to hope for that Ron, on his wizard of the month card is recognized as the best keeper that the Chuddly Cannons ever had? That he lead them to their first ever win of the Quidditch World Cup or something like that?
Sorry, but I see people talk about this - including Rowling herself - and I just have to point out that World Cup tournaments are played by National Teams (teams representing their nations) that are comprised of players from club level teams. The Chudley Cannons are a club level team.
So, in order for the entire Chudley Cannons team to win the Quidditch World Cup, the entire team would have to be chosen to represent England. Which is not completely impossible, considering that no fewer than 7 Manchester United players make up the current England National Football/Soccer team.
Ana Cis - Oct 13, 2007 11:21 am (#2806 of 2974)
Victoire, sorry I haven’t had a chance to post earlier. You’re quite welcome. Anything to help us gleam some knowledge from Jo’s formidable mind.
John Bumbledore, from your post to Jo’s eyes and ears!
Victoire Weasley - Oct 14, 2007 8:53 pm (#2807 of 2974)
Yes, I tend to miss a lot of the quotes, and until recently, didn't know where to look for them.
I was just checking the site and I was noticing that the first reading of the October book tour is tomorrow. Are there usually transcripts available of these readings? I am so excited for all of those kids who get to meet Jo and hear her read. Lucky ducks. Hopefully they'll ask some good questions and we'll get some more info.
If anyone knows where the transcripts are, let me know. Thanks.
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Oct 16, 2007 11:37 pm (#2808 of 2974)
Happy birthday to Prof. Filius Flitwick!
jose043 - Oct 17, 2007 12:23 am (#2809 of 2974)
Happy birthday to Prof. Filius Flitwick & Many more to come.
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
PeskyPixie - Oct 17, 2007 7:11 am (#2810 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Filius Flitwick!!!!!
Ana Cis - Oct 20, 2007 2:37 pm (#2811 of 2974)
I miss posting a Happy Birthday to Professor Flitwick. Drats! Oh, well, for the most part, I only have time on the weekends to post.
Victoire, Here are some sites that can go to see transcripts of JKRs interviews.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
There are many more, but I found these to be very good. I found these through the HP Lexicon site.
Geber - Oct 21, 2007 10:30 pm (#2812 of 2974)
As for Harry joining the Auror department at 17, perhaps they decided that since he was doing the work of an auror since the time he escaped from the wedding, they made him an auror retroactively, and gave him whatever leave of absence he needed to finish his education. Also, don't forget the trio spent a great deal of time in hiding, with little to do but read the mini-library Hermione brought along. If they were allowed to sit the exams at the end of what would have been their seventh year, they just might have made acceptable grades; in some subjects, who would have dared to mark their answers wrong?
PeskyPixie - Oct 25, 2007 2:07 pm (#2813 of 2974)
Well, Harry's month is almost up. Who will be next?
legolas returns - Oct 25, 2007 2:10 pm (#2814 of 2974)
Madam Pince - Oct 25, 2007 3:35 pm (#2815 of 2974)
Good guess! My money's on Snape as well. I can't wait to see the artwork.
Pigwidgeon - Oct 25, 2007 4:18 pm (#2816 of 2974)
I'm going to guess Ron or Hermione. Probably Ron.
wynnleaf - Oct 25, 2007 7:19 pm (#2817 of 2974)
Probably won't be Snape. I wouldn't be surprised if it's never Snape.
PeskyPixie - Oct 25, 2007 7:22 pm (#2818 of 2974)
JKR seems to feel she'll corrupt the youth of the world if she truly lumps Snape in with the 'good guys'!
wynnleaf - Oct 25, 2007 7:46 pm (#2819 of 2974)
Oh, I think it's more personal than that. But enough said.
Victoire Weasley - Oct 26, 2007 8:44 am (#2820 of 2974)
I think it would be great if it were Snape. He definitely deserves some sort of recognition. Dumbledore's plan would not have worked if it weren't for Snape, so he is just as important as Dumbledore and Harry. He's not really one of the "good guys", I guess, but everyone has their dark side.
If it's not him I think it will be someone like Ron or Hermione. All of the other WOTM were relatively unknown, but the last 5 have been key characters (Founders, Dumbledore and Harry).
It could be Mad-Eye, I suppose.
Phelim Mcintyre - Oct 26, 2007 9:00 am (#2821 of 2974)
The wizard of the month could be Voldemort. Slytherin isn't really a good guy even if he is a founder - with his pure blood mania.
journeymom - Oct 26, 2007 9:09 am (#2822 of 2974)
Wynnleaf, that's definitly NOT enough said! So, why ever do you think Snape will never be Wizard of the Month?
wynnleaf - Oct 26, 2007 9:17 am (#2823 of 2974)
journeymom, that's not exactly what I meant. I was responding to PeskyPixie's comment "JKR seems to feel she'll corrupt the youth of the world if she truly lumps Snape in with the 'good guys'!"
Personally, I think JKR's reasons for wanting to be sure that fans don't like Snape are personal and not entirely related to the fictional character. She has too often, in my opinion, related Snape to real people, and especially one, who can be known. That's why it's "enough said" because I don't think it's just about JKR and her fictional character.
I don't mind talking about it off-forum, however, and wouldn't mind explaining what I mean if you want to email me.
journeymom - Oct 26, 2007 10:46 am (#2824 of 2974)
Thanks, but no, not necessary, Wynnleaf. I think I know who you're referring to. If you are correct, though, that's very disappointing. In my mind Snape is such a multifaceted character, such an important part of Harry's life, he deserves the honor. It seems to me that Albus Severus Potter indicates that Harry himself believes the same thing.
PeskyPixie - Oct 26, 2007 11:04 am (#2825 of 2974)
Are you talking about her mean teacher at school? If not, I think I do know what you're getting at.
painting sheila - Oct 26, 2007 11:37 am (#2826 of 2974)
Well, I don't know what any of you are talking about!
Spill the beans!
journeymom - Oct 26, 2007 12:19 pm (#2827 of 2974)
Hm, yes, I'm not sure why we're being secretive. Wynnleaf might be referring to something else. But JKR had an obnoxious teacher when she was a girl, and she says she modeled Snape after this guy. I think her mom was a friend or co-worker of this teacher, or maybe he was her mom's boss. In any case, he wasn't a pleasant person. If JKR doesn't want Snape to be WoM because she doesn't want to glorify this other guy, I'll be disappointed. I don't know this teacher, I only know Snape, who is a really interesting character. Harry thought well enough of him to make his son's middle name Severus. Actually, I'll be disappointed regardless of the reason why, if Snape never gets to be WoM.
JKR might object to Snape being WoM because she's annoyed that many of her readers hold Snape in such high regard, even over Harry.
PeskyPixie - Oct 26, 2007 12:29 pm (#2828 of 2974)
Severus Snape got away from JKR.
I also feel she doesn't advocate 'bad boy syndrome' among young girls (and women) as she's gone that route herself and has learned from her experiences. However, most of us don't worship Snape in that way. He's simply the tragic hero who turns up in most great works (although an exceptionally well-written one).
Honestly, I wonder whether she realizes how mature and well-developed the character Severus Snape is?
Hmm, now I wonder whether wynnleaf has some simply scandalous secret to add .
John Bumbledore - Oct 26, 2007 12:40 pm (#2829 of 2974)
All of the other WOTM were relatively unknown, but the last 5 have been key characters (Founders, Dumbledore and Harry). — Victoire Weasley
Sorry, Victoire, but I must point out that your maths skills are as troublesome as Jo's. Four founders, but DD and HP makes for six not five.
Though I do see your point. Wizard of the Month is recognizion of "famous wizards." That doesn't mean they were all good! Look at the one famous for being the first to die from dragon pox (or what ever happend). So Tom Riddle could be the next famous (or imfamous) wizard to appear but I expect it to be either Hermione or Ron. Then the other of those two followed by Neville Longbottom. I wonder if she would do each of the Weasleys separately or together as a family. Certainly Fred and George would make the list for the joke shop and You-no-poo.
That's my preditions on the WotM. All that should take a full year to do, right? LOL
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
Neville Longbottom - Oct 26, 2007 12:59 pm (#2830 of 2974)
Snape is getting Birthday Wishes on her website, so why shouldn't he be named WotM?
wynnleaf - Oct 26, 2007 2:27 pm (#2831 of 2974)
Yes, I did mean her teacher who was indeed the kind of teacher to fire off questions at students without warning, was a tough teacher, and kind of "sarcy."
The only scandalous secret is that the teacher in question is quite well respected and liked in his community, nice if also kind of sarcastic, speaks only well of JKR, liked and respected her mom, and in his 30's fit JKR's physical descriptions almost to a T with the exception that instead of being unpleasant physically he was quite good looking (still is a good looking man). A recent public comment was that he is "life affirming and generous in all things." He certainly didn't volunteer to have millions of people told JKR's "vindictive" and "cruel" fictional character was based on him, specifically, and that furthermore, he "deserved" it.
Certainly writers get their inspiration from all sorts of sources including people they've known. But one might expect that now that 20-30 years have gone by, the original inspiration for Snape would no longer figure much at all in the author's feelings about him. Yet even after literally thousands of pages of HP, and 25 years or so since knowing him, JKR still seems to connect Snape to the person she feels "deserves" this connection, and deserves, apparently in her opinion, to have millions of people told about it.
PeskyPixie - Oct 27, 2007 11:59 am (#2832 of 2974)
Then one can hardly blame Snape for holding a grudge !
Chemyst - Oct 28, 2007 5:06 am (#2833 of 2974)
Then one can hardly blame Snape for holding a grudge!
Ah, then perhaps JKR saw a wee bit too much of her own self in him . . .( in the opinion of the anonymous amateur pop-psychologist)
mona amon - Oct 29, 2007 5:35 am (#2834 of 2974)
But whatever she might feel about that teacher, I think she likes Snape. I get the feeling she's just wary of saying so because she doesn't want him to be a role model for kids. I think we'll get Snape as WOTM, if not this time, then some other time.
Madam Pince - Oct 29, 2007 5:59 am (#2835 of 2974)
I wonder what she'll credit him with, though? To the majority of the Wizarding World, he's the killer of Albus Dumbledore! Of course, I'm sure Harry did a story in the Quibbler or the Prophet to set the record straight. Snape's WOTM marker might let us know how Harry handled it.
I'm guessing it'll say something about long-time Potions Master at Hogwarts and Headmaster for one year during the Second War with Voldemort. Double-agent and loyal member of the Order of the Phoenix. (or something like that... )
Victoire Weasley - Oct 29, 2007 10:17 am (#2836 of 2974)
LOL John Bumbledore, I promise I do know how to count. That's what I call a "brain fart." A little "oops, did I do that?" Anyway, I'm glad you got my point.
And I agree that anyone is up for grabs for WOTM even if they're not "good". As Ollivander said "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named did great things-terrible, yes, but great." (PS/SS 107)
But I do not think that Tom Riddle will be WOTM before all of the "good guys", if he does make it at all.
I think JKR respects Snape, but I don't get the feeling that she really likes him . I still think he'll make WOTM, hopefully next month.
Lexicon Bel~ - Oct 29, 2007 12:37 pm (#2837 of 2974)
Just thought I'd pop in with a reminder that we have Molly's birthday coming up tonight. Interesting guesses on the WotM there folks. I'm as anxious as anyone to see who she gives us!
legolas returns - Oct 29, 2007 3:39 pm (#2838 of 2974)
The random thought generator (aka my brain) has come up with a possible idea for who will be WOTM in november-how about the Peverell Brothers?
jose043 - Oct 29, 2007 10:40 pm (#2839 of 2974)
Happy Birthday to Molly Weasley & many more to come. Still cheering over her killing Bellatrix. Sorry 30th October here all ready 2:40pm
Josephine & Anne
Little Werewolves of London
Hogwarts Class of 85 - Oct 30, 2007 12:52 am (#2840 of 2974)
Happy Birthday to capslock Molly.
PeskyPixie - Oct 30, 2007 7:23 am (#2841 of 2974)
Happy Birthday Molly Weasley, slayer of Bellatrix Lestrange!
John Bumbledore - Oct 30, 2007 8:00 am (#2842 of 2974)
Um, I've noticed the use of "capslock" as an adjective for Molly's name before but still do not understand exactly what it is meant to convey. Is it a reference to the Internet interpretation that all uppercase denotes shouting?
Happy Birthday to Molly Weasley, and may you enjoy many, many more with your grandchildren and great-grandchildren to come.
Snuffles - Oct 30, 2007 8:09 am (#2843 of 2974)
John, I think it's in reference to the Molly we saw when she was about to take on Bellatrix.
painting sheila - Oct 30, 2007 8:19 am (#2844 of 2974)
Happy Happy Birthday Molly!! I strive to be as good a mother as you!!
journeymom - Oct 30, 2007 9:19 am (#2845 of 2974)
Me too, Sheila.
The woman scrimped and saved and knew how to make do.
She was a wonderful cook.
She opened her home to all manner of misfits, regardless of the inconvenience to herself.
She worked very hard.
She still obviously loved her husband in spite of his eccentricities. (Or, maybe those eccentricities attracted her at first. It one of those things that happen to couples after they've been together for a while. Those little things get on your last nerve, like hoarding electrical plugs.)
She home schooled her kids up until 6th grade. (And she had seven kids!!!! Insert Sheila's bowing-in-worship smilie here.)
She survived parenting Gred and Forge without losing her marbles (mostly).
I'm pretty sure she was a Hufflepuff.
What a wonderful woman!
Ah, I see she was in Gryffindor. This is one of those cases that make me wonder if JKR places people in Houses just to make a point. Molly is such a Hufflepuff. She even looks and is described like Helga Hufflepuff. Go read Helga's WoM card!
Holly T. - Oct 30, 2007 9:23 am (#2846 of 2974)
I thought Molly was a Gryffindor? Anyway, happy birthday to you, supermom Molly! You share a birthday with my brother.
PeskyPixie - Oct 30, 2007 9:30 am (#2847 of 2974)
Molly is a Gryffinpuff! (A Hufflepuff exterior with a Gryffindor heart)
(Happy Birthday to Holly's brother as well!)
John Bumbledore - Oct 30, 2007 10:15 am (#2848 of 2974)
Snuffles, She, Journeymom, and Holly T., all together you seem to have given a top ten list for why Molly Weasley is a supermom or as I think of her...
"Let me 'splain.
No, there is too much. Let me sum up."
I say, "Hence forth, let today be known as 'Unsinkable' Molly Weasley's Day!"
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
legolas returns - Oct 30, 2007 11:36 am (#2849 of 2974)
painting sheila - Oct 30, 2007 11:57 am (#2850 of 2974)
It's official!! The Mother of the Year goes to . . .Molly Weasley!!
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 11:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
PeskyPixie - Oct 30, 2007 4:34 pm (#2851 of 2974)
First runner-up is Eileen Prince .
I'm kidding Molly, you're great. Happy Birthday, again! (and thanks for taking out Bella for us!)
zelmia - Oct 31, 2007 12:43 am (#2852 of 2974)
All of the Weasleys in were in Gryffindor. Ron worries that he won't be in Book 1.
DJ Evans - Oct 31, 2007 8:01 am (#2853 of 2974)
I just took a look at her web site....seeing if she might have done something for Halloween, maybe add a few Halloween decorations or such. Anyhoo, while I was there, I went to the room with the closed door. When did she add a little calendar thingy down the right side of the door at the bottom? Or I've never noticed it before. And does anybody know if it does anything else besides give the date? I mean it does look a bit fancy for just a regular old Muggle calendar.
EDIT: Never mind, I just figured it out. You can change the date on it, back to the days when the door opened. Well, that's kinda cool!
Elanor - Oct 31, 2007 8:08 am (#2854 of 2974)
OMG! You're right Deb! I think it is a kind of "Time-Turner", continuing in white: if you grab the little thingy on the left, it will make the date spin very fast and then, if you click on the hourglass, it becomes blue and "time" seems to go fast backwards. The sign on the door disappears but I can't manage to open the door. I wonder if it is a way of seeing the previous times the door opened?
Edit: I've managed to open the door: one only needs to click twice on the handle. And yes, it allows one to see the old "puzzles"/informations that have been revealed behind this door in the past years.
Edit again: The Wizard of the month calendar has also changed: it is now called "Wizard of the Month Archive" and you can see old Wizards of the Month's "cards" in it. I hope it doesn't mean we won't have any more new Wizard of the Months!
Madam Pince - Oct 31, 2007 8:29 am (#2855 of 2974)
Yes, it's definitely a time-turner -- looks just like my Noble necklace! Cool! Well, I'm glad to see that there's now a way to access "old" stuff because I've often wished she had that there. But I'm like Elanor -- I hope it doesn't mean we're never getting anything new again!
Entry info in white: Elanor, on my version the little handle-thingy is on the right, not the left. Anyway, otherwise what you said is the same. You click at the top edge of the handle for time to go forward (you can only go as far forward as today), and if you click on the bottom edge, time goes backwards. Then you click the hourglass and it goes blue and spins and the door goes to how it was on the date listed, where you have to click the door handle to open the door. This is so cool!)
Wow, did we really not have any door info in the entire year of 2005? How ever did we manage?
Second wow -- I missed a lot of earlier Wizard of the Months! Glad to see them now! (Right there in plain sight she showed us each and every one of the special items belonging to the Founders that Voldy used for horcruxes. )
Victoire Weasley - Oct 31, 2007 9:01 am (#2856 of 2974)
I had a feeling there would be something "new" up, but I didn't figure it would be something "old". Anyway, the time-turner's pretty cool. It'll give us something to do while we wait for more.
Maybe the WOTM Archive means something really good is coming up...I hope.
journeymom - Oct 31, 2007 9:08 am (#2857 of 2974)
Hmmm. That was neat to spend 5 minutes scrolling through the old WoM cards. I suppose it makes sense if she stops with Harry Potter. But, still.....
Chemyst - Oct 31, 2007 11:36 am (#2858 of 2974)
Wow! So your W.O.M.B.A.T. test gets graded immediately!
Joanna Lupin - Oct 31, 2007 11:58 am (#2859 of 2974)
There's a new note from JKR...
John Bumbledore - Oct 31, 2007 12:01 pm (#2860 of 2974)
Joanna Lupin, are you referring to the new article in The Daily News (on her desk) about Companion Books?
Well, I finally am able to take the W.O.M.B.A.T Grade 1. I passed but only with an "acceptable."
Joanna Lupin - Oct 31, 2007 12:16 pm (#2861 of 2974)
Yes, that's what I meant.
How do you go to W.O.M.B.A.T. test 1? I'm too thick to figure out JKR's clues!
Phelim Mcintyre - Oct 31, 2007 2:11 pm (#2862 of 2974)
Joanna - the Forum has all the answers if you look up the site using search.
I have just done all three test and got the following: 1 - Outstanding; 2 - Exceeds Expectations 3 - Acceptable. At least I passed.
legolas returns - Oct 31, 2007 3:02 pm (#2863 of 2974)
Joanna-Where is the new note? Was this the one she did when she published the book or is it a new one.
I hope she is going to make more updates of new stuff. This cant be the end can it?
legolas returns - Oct 31, 2007 4:59 pm (#2864 of 2974)
Major pout! I have stayed up to midnight and there is no new wizard of the month yet. .
Edit-I found all the new stuff on the site+the scrap book pages which were good. I am obviously very hard to please.
Madam Pince - Oct 31, 2007 5:10 pm (#2865 of 2974)
Wait -- there was no new article in the Daily News when I checked earlier today! *pouts* It was the same one about the October book-reading tour. ***off to look for new stuff***
legolas returns - Oct 31, 2007 5:12 pm (#2866 of 2974)
Call me a sad individual but I really looked forward to the first day of each month. Now that pleasure has been taken away .
PeskyPixie - Oct 31, 2007 7:11 pm (#2867 of 2974)
Ditto, legolas. Now I have only the November comic on my For Better Or For Worse calendar to look forward to.
I can't believe Jo would just ditch us! (:insert distraught face of your choice:)
John Bumbledore - Oct 31, 2007 7:59 pm (#2868 of 2974)
I expect it to be a short Hallowe'en treat for us and I don't expect it to last long... though it would be good to have both!
Thank you Jo for giving us a scrolling archive of the WotM, and the time turner for the room of requirement. I promise not to write any "Potter Companion Books" and wait for yours.
Now, Jo, could you be a dear and let me know if I may have missed any of your special awards? Perhaps over a cuppa?
John Bumbledore <)B^D˜
jo bot - Oct 31, 2007 8:40 pm (#2869 of 2974)
I can only get the door to open to 20-7-07, which was the letter.
I'll keep trying though!
Mrs. Sirius - Oct 31, 2007 10:12 pm (#2870 of 2974)
Oh my goodness!! What is this news?? What means this news?
Verity Weasley - Oct 31, 2007 11:29 pm (#2871 of 2974)
I am really shocked about the news on Jo's site about the companion books. You realise she is suing the Lexicon???!!! I really don't see the logic. We are all going to rush out and buy her encyclopaedia the minute it comes out no matter what may come before it, so the charities certainly won't miss out. And judging by her comments in her recent book tour, it doesn't sound as though she is in any rush to do the encyclopaedia. I don't really see the distinction between all the amazing stuff the Lexicon has on the site and what they will put in their book. And Jo herself has praised the Lexicon site and said she used it to keep her facts straight when writing.
The news about The Tales of Beedle the Bard is cool though!
Elanor - Oct 31, 2007 11:51 pm (#2872 of 2974)
I'm as shocked as you are Verity, and truth to be told a bit disappointed with Jo's (or her agents?)'s reaction. Of course true fans would buy both books and actually the Lexicon "encyclopaedia" would be the perfect tool for fans while waiting for Jo's which is bound to have some different information. I hope it won't affect the website too.
I also hope we will have have access to the text of "The Tales of Beedle the Bard", it could be fun.
I will miss the fun of checking the New Wizard of the Month too.
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 1:43 am (#2873 of 2974)
Where does it say that the Lexicon is being sued? It mentions Steve but not the Lexicon. Hopefully the two things are different and wont affect the Lexicon and Lexicon Forum.
I hope we get to see the text and stories of Beedle the Bard.
Anna L. Black - Nov 1, 2007 3:19 am (#2874 of 2974)
Where does it mention Steve? Am I missing something?
EDIT: OK, I found it (on Leaky).
EDIT2 (after reading the article): I can't believe she's doing it. That's really disappointing.
Phelim Mcintyre - Nov 1, 2007 3:32 am (#2875 of 2974)
The Leaky Cauldron report says that it is not against the Lexicon on line but on a crital book called the Harry Potter Lexicon. I have defended Jo concerning other court cases, including baning Cubs here in the UK from using Harry Potter as a theme for camps. This though is, as afar as I am concerned, undefendable.
septentrion - Nov 1, 2007 6:50 am (#2876 of 2974)
I understood Jo's statement at first being about written encyclopedias, but after rereading it, it looks like she might aim at the Lexicon. If she did it, it'd be the ultimate hypocrisy: she'd used the site when she was writing to avoid going through her notes, and now that all the books are published, she would want it to close? I dearly hope she only aims at written work, but then, how can she prevent people from writing about her universe as long as they don't plagiarise her?
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 7:35 am (#2877 of 2974)
Is JKR herself behind this? She filed another lawsuit recently which the majority of the public did not agree with, but I wondered then, and now, how much of it is JKR and how much is influenced by WB and her lawyers.
ETA: I am playing the diplomat in my post as I do not want it to be removed. However, due to the nature of these two lawsuits, both filed within weeks of one another, JKR seems to be under some sort of plagiarism/copyright infringement paranoia at the moment. She really needs to sit down with her team and have a nice, long talk.
I haven't been too offensive, have I?
Chemyst - Nov 1, 2007 7:53 am (#2878 of 2974)
No, Pesky, I do not consider that too offensive.
Below, I am quoting straight from her website which she says is her own words, not those of a Warner Brothers' spokesperson.
"It is also old news …"
It is? The interviews that I recall always carefully couched it as a possibility, a speculation, an idea she was toying with if she found it to be fun; not a hard fact that she was committed to writing it.
"…which will include all the material that never made it into the novels"
Steve has always been a stickler for sticking to canon. Materials not in the novels and material only in the novels are totally different, and fairly exclusive sets.
I cannot approve …reference book(s) for their author's own personal gain.
Steve, JKR obviously doesn't want you benefiting personally. I have a solution for you: sign the royalties over to me. I will give them to my own non-profit charities.
Note to Loopy: please get back to me on how to set up a non-profit charity that provides free chocolate (for warding off dementors) to all members of the Lexicon Forums.
Mrs. Sirius - Nov 1, 2007 8:12 am (#2879 of 2974)
Well, I think much of this is legal/legalistic. It does seem to be coming from JKR herself as it is on her website. Her contention is that she is writing a book as a fund raiser.
I will buy her book the minute it comes out, whatever else is published.
I think though, she looks at this from the point of view of the not so dedicated fan. Given two titles of HP encyclopedias, some people may not recognize which book is hers and going to charity. This type of confusion seemed bizarre but I have now met so many people who can't remember/distinguish book titles, authors or intents of such things, it now seems commonplace.
wynnleaf - Nov 1, 2007 8:14 am (#2880 of 2974)
Of course, it would be impossible to know for sure without knowing what's actually in this Lexicon book, but I do wonder whether JKR actually can win this case. It all depends on whether or not there's truly an infringment. Given Steve's library background, I'm expecting that he looked into this quite carefully. Perhaps the suit is based more on possible trademark violations than copyright.
I'll be interested to see some more news and also some legal commentary on the case.
A problem, however, is the huge difference in resources to press a suit, versus resources to defend the case. Sometimes this can overwhelm one side, because the resources simply aren't there to defend, even if the case could ultimately be resolved in that side's favor.
Luna Logic - Nov 1, 2007 8:39 am (#2881 of 2974)
Could we have the exact quoting of JKR's site to discuss it ? (sorry but I didn't manage to see the document on her site).
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 8:46 am (#2882 of 2974)
I understood Jo's statement at first being about written encyclopedias, but after rereading it, it looks like she might aim at the Lexicon. - Septentrion
I don't think it's aiming at the website, but a companion encyclopedia the Lex is supposed to be releasing.
I wonder if it is possible for Lexicon Steve to get in touch with J.K., because I'm sure that a matter such as this could be settled without a law suit. After all, J.K. likes the Lexicon website and Steve is a dedicated fan of hers. Surely they could talk it out.
azi - Nov 1, 2007 8:53 am (#2883 of 2974)
Luna - if you go to the Leaky Cauldron website you can read the article and JKR's quoted there.
I could do with some explanation of how the legal system works here. I mean, why were other books like 'The Unofficial Guide to Harry Potter' allowed to be published and this not? What's the difference between them? Could you change the title to 'The Unofficial Harry Potter Lexicon' and be fine?
Someone suggested in Leaky comments that this is in response to Steve's thing about WB using his timeline from the Lexicon in the HP DVDs. I don't know if there's truth in that or not.
I'm slightly peeved myself. I'm very protective about the Lexicon. One thing I'm surprised at is how many people are not happy at the decision. I expected more people to be either neutral or agree with JKR on everything. Guess fans do still think for themselves.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 9:04 am (#2884 of 2974)
The words from the spokesperson confuse me - "infringes copyright and attempts to cash in on the successful brand." It can't be a 'cashing in' thing because, like you said azi, what about the other books? J.K.'s words on her website make much more sense - "I cannot, therefore, approve of 'companion books' or 'encyclopedias' that seek to pre-empt my definitive Potter reference book for their authors' own personal gain."
This makes it clear that the thing she doesn't like is that the book is so similar to the one that she herself is going to write. Books that speculated on what was going to happen, like the Unofficial Guide, aren't the same.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 9:05 am (#2885 of 2974)
I wish I knew if
1) JKR and WB had attempted to dissuade Steve from publishing his work before they hit him with a law suit.
2) Steve's book claims to be an authoritative guide.
3) This book is being marketed as a Lexicon web site publication.
I don't think the later is true. This suit is aimed at Steve.
Snuffles - Nov 1, 2007 9:07 am (#2886 of 2974)
I agree azi. I thought more people would agree with JKR. I suppose it comes down to the fact that while we love JKR and the Harry Potter books, it is the Lexicon that we choose to discuss everything. We know how hard Steve, Kip and the moderators work at keeping this site going and keeping it family friendly.
I'm hoping it is more to do with WB than JKR herself.
Fans of the Lexicon unite.
John Bumbledore - Nov 1, 2007 9:12 am (#2887 of 2974)
I think Jo is acting like Fudge! I can't believe she is sending Dementors (Sorry, Loopy Lupin, present company excluded) after Lexicon Steve (or is it just RDR, the publisher?)!
My analysis it in line with Azi on this. First, we know of other "companion" books written about Harry Potter. There has not been any report of action against them. Second, we know that the exact timeline that Lexicon Steve assembled (because it contains the same errors that he made in his) was used by WB on there DVD without acknowledgement of his research.
Jo, I think the proper (Dumbledore like) thing to do would be for you to press WB to settle this with an appology to Steve (about using his time-line) with out permission.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 9:25 am (#2888 of 2974)
The other lawsuit was also about what JKR and team assumed to be profit from copyright violation. Her suit was tossed as the case in question was non-profit and temporary.
I have a book titled, The Magical Worlds of Harry Potter. It discusses names, myths, and all sorts of other HP stuff. Would this also be considered a 'companion book'? If so, why only sue Steve?
Hmmm, something just doesn't seem normal judging from her actions of late.
Hieronymus Graubart - Nov 1, 2007 9:40 am (#2889 of 2974)
Luna Logic, "# JK Rowling Official Site" #2880, 1 Nov 2007 7:39 am
Luna Logic, go to JKR's site and click on "The Daily News". (It has a Dark Mark on it, because the newest news is a spoiler to DH.) It will open and show you on the left side a list of contents. The first entry again is the dark mark. Click on the second entry labeled "Companion books" and you can read Jo's comment at the right side.
As azi said, you will find more on this suit at the Leaky Cauldron.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 9:55 am (#2890 of 2974)
I agree with journeymom, I wish I knew the answers to those questions.
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 10:20 am (#2891 of 2974)
Wow, what a sticky situation.
If I were JKR, of course I would want to protect my work, but it doesn't seem right to go after one person and then not everyone else. I wonder if she has people that check out each Harry Potter "companion" book that comes out and then decides whether or not to sue.
It seems like she probably feels threatened by the popularity of the Lexicon, but when it comes to Harry Potter, JKR is it. Everyone will be queing up to buy anything she puts her name on.
I hope the suit gets dropped. I've got my fingers crossed.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 10:31 am (#2892 of 2974)
I think the problem is that the Lexicon's book is so much like her own that she is planning to write, not that it is an unauthorised companion book.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 10:36 am (#2893 of 2974)
Frankly, I've been buying HP because of Harry for a while, not JKR.
I hope the suit gets dropped for Steve's sake. He doesn't deserve this.
And I've been wondering, surely JKR can afford to write a huge cheque to her favourite charities if she feels 'companion books' will take away from the profit of her future encyclopedia? There are also other stories within the HP world which only she knows and could therefore present to the world for charitable purposes.
Oh boy, Cheering Charms all around. Everyone seems to be in need of one. And an anti-Confundus Charm for Jo!
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 10:42 am (#2894 of 2974)
The two encyclopedias will be very different, because Steve's will be about info from the books and J.K.'s will be about info that wasn't in the books.
I expect J.K.'s thinking, as someone above said, people may get confused between the two books. Obviously the dedicated fans won't have a problem, but there are a lot of casual fans who might not know that there are two. They may see Steve's book in the shop and buy it, then when they see J.K.'s they may think, "Another encyclopedia?" and not buy it because they already have one like it. If they looked at it properly they might realise the difference but not if they just see it on the shelf, see the word 'encyclopedia' and walk on.
I too hope that the suit gets dropped or resolved out of court. Maybe both books could go ahead if conditions were set, like having the Lexicon's logo and the word 'unofficial' nice and big on the front cover.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 10:49 am (#2895 of 2974)
Ah, good point, Liz. These encyclopedias are different.
My immediate thought on learning that JKR (and WB?) is suing Steve is that there has to be something we're missing. Otherwise, this puts JKR in a surprising, disappointing, bad light.
JKR is suing Steve, not the HP Lexicon, right?
Winky Woo - Nov 1, 2007 11:21 am (#2896 of 2974)
Hey new easter eggs!
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 11:29 am (#2897 of 2974)
I love Harry and the other characters in his world and that is why I read the books, not because I am a JKR fan (I don't own anything else she has written). But she created Harry and frankly I would rather spend my money on her books over, say, fan fiction or other works.
Not that there aren't talented writers out there doing fan fiction!!!
I guess I'm just saying that it's hard to tell if the books wouldn't have been as popular if another author had written them because the concept is great. But JKR did a fabulous job with these books and I think it's because of her that we are chatting here on this forum in the first place.
Journeymom, that was my understanding from what I read on Leaky. She has no problem with the website, just the publishing of the book.
I can see your point, Liz, about the confusion between the books. Isn't it the same with biographies. I always see The Unofficial Biography Of...(fill in the blank)The Story They Didn't Want You To Hear"
It seems like there should be a way to resolve the whole thing without a lawsuit. I agree JKR's team and Steve's team should just sit down and talk this whole thing out.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 11:48 am (#2898 of 2974)
I guess I'm just saying that it's hard to tell if the books wouldn't have been as popular if another author had written them because the concept is great.
I don't think they would have because how many other people would have been able to think up this kind of series? But then, that's a debate for another thread.
It seems like there should be a way to resolve the whole thing without a lawsuit. I agree JKR's team and Steve's team should just sit down and talk this whole thing out.
Exactly. Things don't always have to end up in the courts.
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 11:56 am (#2899 of 2974)
I think the problem is that the Lexicon's book is so much like her own that she is planning to write --Liz Mann
I agree, Liz, that's what it sounds like to me. Of course, I'm no lawyer, but to me it seems odd to say it's copyright infringement for someone to write something that's too much like something you're going to write but haven't written yet. Isn't that putting the carriage before the thestral?
As others have said, also apparently the books would have different themes -- the Lex one being about canon that's in the books, and as JKR herself said, her version will be about things that didn't make it into the books -- ie: all new material. So I don't see what the difference is here between the Lex book and all the many other HP-themed books like the one done by MuggleNet and all the "Unofficial Guides" and stuff. And I agree with what someone else said earlier, too -- I never got the impression from anything that JKR has said that we know for sure that she's planning to do an encyclopedia someday. She's hinted strongly, yes, but never announced definitively as far as I took it. She's been very evasive about what she plans for the future -- as I recall, she said yes she will obviously continue writing because she's (duh) a writer, but she said she was done with Harry for awhile and she had other ideas, and she said IF she did anything Harry it would PROBABLY be something along the lines of an encyclopedia, done for charity. Strong hints, yes, but not definitive.
I have to say I'm on the Lexicon's side here, and not just because I post here. Trying to be an objective observer, I think JKR has got ahold of the wrong end of the wand. Also, methinks this stinks of Warner Bros. rather than JKR anyway -- the news article I read emphasized the part about Warner Bros. being the sole owners of the "intellectual property" that is Harry Potter.
Also a bit hard to swallow, that the second-richest woman in the UK (only behind the Queen, right?) is begrudging of a middle-school librarian. Feels a bit Umbridge-ish.
(((hugs))) and Cheering Charms to Lexicon Steve. And an Ogden's. Hang in there!
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 11:57 am (#2900 of 2974)
Lately, JKR has been taking people to court. I'm not too shocked over this one as I've already gotten conditioned over the last little while. I just hope Steve comes out of this okay.
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 11:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 12:02 pm (#2901 of 2974)
Wasnt there also a case on a Harry Potter themed castle in India or somewhere like that.
I am with you Peskypixie-Hope Steve is ok.
Phelim Mcintyre - Nov 1, 2007 12:02 pm (#2902 of 2974)
The BBC's article is very much about JKR, and with the content on her site.... I will be buying the Lexicon when it comes out in the UK. I doubt I will be buying Jo's book because of her behaviour over this.
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 12:04 pm (#2903 of 2974)
I just hope Steve comes out of this okay.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 12:11 pm (#2904 of 2974)
I doubt I will be buying Jo's book because of her behaviour over this.
That's a little unfair. We don't even know all the details. We also can't judge the matter over other people's articles on the subject, I think we need to focus on Jo's statement on her website rather than what other sources say about copyright.
I suppose she's thinking of it like if, while she series was still being written, someone else had written their own version of the next book and published it. Even if it had the word 'official' on the cover (unlike that book in China).
azi - Nov 1, 2007 12:12 pm (#2905 of 2974)
Yes, hugs and Felix Felicis to Steve!
I find it difficult to believe that people would get confused between a book by the Lexicon and one by JKR. I wouldn't even have known a Lexicon book was being released if JKR hadn't decided to sue! Compare the tiny amount of publicity the Lexicon book would have got (I'm guessing it would mostly be word of mouth along fan sites like this) and the ridiculous amount of publicity a JKR book gets (I think it is overrated for what you get - there are plenty of just as good authors out there whose publication dates never seem to be advertised) and I just can't see where the confusion would be.
I'm also with Phelim. I am much more likely to buy a Lexicon book if it ever comes out, and shun hers. I lost a bit of respect with this. At the end of the day, I don't read her books because I like her, but because I like HP. I don't intend on buying anything else she writes just because she wrote it. I would only buy it if it interested me.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 12:27 pm (#2906 of 2974)
Don't you think it's too soon to decide whether you will or won't buy her book, based upon this issue?
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 12:32 pm (#2907 of 2974)
Depends on how ticked you are at a person. Right now, I'm feeling a bit ticked myself.
Oh, and just to add to the ticked feeling -- why would you write a book that you know millions of your fans would give their eyeteeth to read, but only make seven copies of it, and then just to rub salt in the wounds, announce it publicly???!!! It feels like ***nyah, nyah -- I have something you want but youuuuu can't have it! Nyah, nyah! I'm only giving it to my friends, not just you fans!***
Ouch, that hurt! She could've just done that quietly and given it to her friends and be done with it. And if she wants to make a charity donation, I think she could probably afford to do it without having to auction off this book. Why make all the rest of her fans (except the ONE with the most money to buy it) feel like red-headed step-children?
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 12:34 pm (#2908 of 2974)
We still don't know all the details, though. Let's just wait and see if she makes a video statement or if we hear any more details on the subject.
azi - Nov 1, 2007 12:41 pm (#2909 of 2974)
Yes, we should wait until we know the full details. **takes deep calming breaths**
I have vented my spleen to a few unlucky people in my vincinity already. It made me feel better (but I am still ticked off, as Madame P put it).
Elanor - Nov 1, 2007 12:48 pm (#2910 of 2974)
I am still "ticked off" too Azi and Madam Pince! And I do agree with what you've said. Since I've read the news, it's been as if Jo herself had sent a Dementor our way but it is very heartening to read everybody's posts, they're as good as Honeydukes' chocolate!
**takes deep calming breath too and considers a "drop" of old Ogdens as well...**
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 12:56 pm (#2911 of 2974)
Like it matters what I think. But-
I'll just say that I'm prepared to be ticked off. Honestly, I don't know Steve Vander Ark from Adam, and maybe he's done something that warrants a law suit. My affection for his Lexicon should not cloud my judgement. The same is true for JKR. I don't really know her. Maybe she's being very unfair. Maybe she has a legitimate case. I'm trying to wait patiently for clarification from JKR, but this, so far, is disappointing.
Edited to say, Mr Journeymom is looking over my shoulder and has reminded me about a certain Saturday Night Live episode with William Shatner.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 1:02 pm (#2912 of 2974)
I am very distressed about this matter as I want to side with both J.K. and Steve, and I still hope that it will be resolved without a law suit.
Edit: J.K. has updated her site on the matter.
Quote: As is now widely known, a complaint has been filed in the name of Warner Bros. and myself against the publisher of a proposed Lexicon, written by Steve VanderArk. This decision was reached, on my part, with immense sadness and disappointment, and only because direct appeals for a reasonable solution failed. I never dreamed, in the light of our previous good relations - including giving the Lexicon a fansite award - that this situation would ever arise.
From what I understand, the proposed book is not criticism or review of Harry Potter's world, which would be entirely legitimate - neither I nor anybody connected with Harry Potter has ever tried to prevent such works being published. It is, we believe, a print version of the website, except now the information that was freely available to everybody is to become a commertial enterprise.
It is not reasonable, or legal, for anybody, fan or otherwise, to take an author's hard work, re-organise their characters and plots, and sell them for their own commertial gain. However much an individual claims to love somebody else's work, it does not become theirs to sell.
So we now know, first of all that attempts were made to settle the matter out of court, second that J.K. believes the Lexicon's book is actually illegal, and third why they're against this book but not the Unofficial Guide etc.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 1:14 pm (#2913 of 2974)
Wasnt there also a case on a Harry Potter themed castle in India or somewhere like that
Yes, this is what I was referring to, but I didn't know whether I was allowed to openly state it.
In a nutshell (a rather large nutshell): During a religious/cultural festival in India, religious activities (sorry, I know that's not the proper word) are held inside themed pavilions. Local communities compete with one another for who has the coolest/most thought-provoking/most original design. These structures are non-profit (charity is actually given to the truly destitute during the festival) and dismantled once the ten-day festival closes (really sorry if my terminology is disrespectful).
One group, consisting of HP fans, decided to base their design on Hogwarts castle. JKR and team sued them for copyright infringement and the aim of profitting off of her creations and expressed the desire for the group to dismantle the thing immediately. Her fans were very upset as they claimed to have no idea that they needed her permission for a local non-profit affair. The suit was tossed but the fans were told by the judge to make sure the pavilion was dismantled in ten days.
I saw a gingerbread house tournament on T.V. where a group of young girls baked a replica of Diagonal Alley, complete with Gringotts! I wonder why some fans get penalized by JKR and others don't.
I agree with Azi, Madam Pince and Elanor - I'm a lot sadder than I claimed to be in a previous post ... gonna go have some chocolate (which I don't like much) to ward off the foul dementor floating stubbornly by my window.
septentrion - Nov 1, 2007 1:20 pm (#2914 of 2974)
The Leaky Cauldron has a more extensive article about the matter here, which gives us a more balanced view of the situation. It seems that both parties have good arguments for themselves. Actually, I find this story rather embarrassing for both of them. Thanks Heavens, there are still the books!
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 1:23 pm (#2915 of 2974)
For a moment I thought you were responding to my post, Septentrion!
septentrion - Nov 1, 2007 1:27 pm (#2916 of 2974)
I didn't answer to your post, but rereading your and my post, it actually looks like it My subconscious must have taken control of my fingers.
Eponine - Nov 1, 2007 1:34 pm (#2917 of 2974)
From what I understand, the proposed book would basically be a print form of the Lexicon which includes almost (I believe) the entirety of Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them and Quidditch through the Ages as well as numerous passages and descriptions from the books themselves. I don't think it's particularly fair to take information verbatim from the texts and re-organize them in order to make money from them.
This book seems to be entirely different from the unofficial theories and literary criticism that have been published. This is taking her own work, not someone else's interpretation of it or their opinion of it, but her own hard work, and putting it into a book that makes money for someone else.
And the article over at Leaky gives a lot more detail about the decision to file suit over this. Given the circumstances, I think it is entirely reasonable for JKR to take the step that she did.
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 1:36 pm (#2918 of 2974)
So JKR says ...the proposed book is not criticism or review of Harry Potter's world... which would apparently be legitimate.
I read both the MuggleNet book, and the Ultimate Unofficial Guide books. None of them seemed like a "criticism or review" of the Harry Potter world to me, yet apparently they were deemed OK. They were basically what she said -- taking an author's works, re-organizing them, and then making speculations about them. Sounds like Steve's book would do something similar, minus the speculations. Hmmmm. I just don't understand, I guess.
The thing that's odd is -- the website isn't being dismantled, is it? So even if a book is published, the information will still be "freely available to everybody" as JKR put it. It's just that it will also now be available to those who haven't had access previously because they don't have a computer or whatever.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 1:41 pm (#2919 of 2974)
I know I'm the minority here, but I find myself siding with JKR - at least for the time being. She has been extremely generous in allowing fan sites like the Lexicon to, essentially, re-publish her work. She has supported them with direct commentary, exclusive interviews, and even commendations for all their diligence and dedication.
It has to feel like a bit of a stab in the back to her that an organisation that she has been so fond and supportive of is suddenly attempting to ride her coat tails all the way to the bank.
And while it may not have been Steve, personally, who was responsible for the lack of communication between the two parties, it sounds like his representatives were rather duplicitous in their actions. It also sounds like this whole thing might have been avoided if the Rowling people had been given an advance copy.
As for the Timeline thing, I remember Steve posting that on the Lexicon after the CS DVD release. But did he contact Warner's about it then? If not, it seems unlikely that they will consider his complaint anything other than retaliation - even though I do think he has a legitimate argument there.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 1:43 pm (#2920 of 2974)
The thing that is illegal is that money is being made from it. Money is not being made from the website.
The Unofficial Guide isn't review as such, but it is about speculation. Leaky's details on the suit says, "JKR has been 'careful not to license' other 'tie-in or companion books' which merely 'regurgitate her creative expression without adding valuable analysis or scholarly commentary...in part, because...she has authored and published her own Companion Books and intends to create additional companion books.'." The Unofficial Guide fits in with the 'scholarly commentary' thing.
There are rules and guides as to when quoting a text is a copyright infringment and when it is not, though I don't know exactly what the rules are.
azi - Nov 1, 2007 1:45 pm (#2921 of 2974)
Does this mean that if Steve included some essays from the Lexicon he'd be in the clear? If he really was doing a re-hash of the Lexicon, then he would be able to include those, with the owners permission?
I notice the DVD timeline thing is in the notes on Leaky. I wonder what will become of that.
All this legal speech confuses me. What are plaintiffs?
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 1:46 pm (#2922 of 2974)
Plaintiffs - somebody who begins a lawsuit against somebody else defendant in a civil court (Microsoft Word dictionary).
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 1:48 pm (#2923 of 2974)
The Plaintiff is the party bringing charges. In this case JKR and WB are the Plaintiff.
The Defendant is the person being charged. The Lexicon and RDR, in this case.
"Injunction" is a legal order from a judge to stop what you're doing.
This is in the US, of course.
ETA: Yes, azi. The term Plaintiff is used for all Civil cases (cases between private parties). Prosecution is used for criminal cases.
azi - Nov 1, 2007 1:48 pm (#2924 of 2974)
Ahh, I was getting confused with whatever the word is for someone who tries to get money off someone in debt. Or is 'plaintiff' the word there also?
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 1:49 pm (#2925 of 2974)
All the legal mumbo jumbo confused me a little but you can tell that JKR and Warner are not very happy .
azi - Nov 1, 2007 1:50 pm (#2926 of 2974)
Lol, Legolas! Some much needed humour.
Eponine - Nov 1, 2007 2:11 pm (#2927 of 2974)
Azi, I think that if the book consisted only of essays from the Lexicon, then they'd be fine because it's speculation and opinion, not fact regurgitation. If the proposed book did include all the information from FBAWTFT and QTTA (both of which are still under copyright), then that would be a violation of copyright no matter how many essays there were. Fair use allows works to be quoted, but not reproduced in their entirety.
I have to agree with zelmia. These are her characters, her spells, her creations, and I don't think it's fair for someone to just put them in alphabetical order and sell them for profit. How would you all feel if it was your work being sold without regard for your own feelings?
Caius Iulius - Nov 1, 2007 2:14 pm (#2928 of 2974)
A time turner in behind the secret door!
Joanna Lupin - Nov 1, 2007 2:16 pm (#2929 of 2974)
On the whole, I think JKR's in the right there. She was writing this all for years, it's her. Admirable Steve's work might be, but really he only retyped it. He has no right to make profit on JKR's creation.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 2:16 pm (#2930 of 2974)
My previous post was written before I read the details of this lawsuit, so I still need to read through everything before I state my opinion. I'll be back later.
Caius Iulius - Nov 1, 2007 2:18 pm (#2931 of 2974)
Some of the answers to the Christmas riddles in white: corned beef, Bristol, blood, otter, half
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 2:19 pm (#2932 of 2974)
I've been trying to find information on what constitutes as fair use. Wikipedia has some information, but whether it is accurate or not I don't know, since it is a website that is modified and edited by the public.
Well, this is very unpleasant, but personally it won't affect the way I read the books or use the forum or the Lexicon website.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 2:22 pm (#2933 of 2974)
Wikipedia cites the actual US Code so it's a good resource. But try searching for "fair use laws" and you should get a hit for the US Copyright government web site. If I recall correctly, Fair Use is limited to analysis, criticism or parody/satire.
Luna Logic - Nov 1, 2007 2:30 pm (#2934 of 2974)
Thanks, all, for sharing your informations.
As Elanor said, "it is very heartening to read everybody's posts".
I'm sad. I can't take any side.
Now, after reading the articles and your posts, I understand better both points of view... but money seems to be right in the middle.
Hugs to everyone who wants to share it!
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 2:36 pm (#2935 of 2974)
I think J.K. and WB have a good point and the right to file the suit, but I would like to hear Steve's side of the story too.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 2:55 pm (#2936 of 2974)
Agreed, agreed, Liz Mann.
I didn't realize JKR posted another comment, previous to her book auction post. She says she's sad and disappointed they need to take this action, especially since their "direct appeals for a reasonable solution failed".
This tent in India- this was a charitable event, people had to pay to get in to see the Potter-themed tent, right? They should have gotten permission to use the Potter-related name and images. It doesn't matter that they turned over the profits to a charity. They still made a profit from JKR's property.
Really, the issue of charity needs to be removed from this present scenario. It's not relevant.
People can publish original material (essays, predictions, observations) and use JKR's material in support of the original material. I don't know how this works, but I imagine that the majority of the book needs to be original material, and JKR's material needs to make up the minority.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 2:57 pm (#2937 of 2974)
I'm sad about not getting to read The Tales of Beedle the Bard. I thought it would make a great 'Comic Relief' book from the first time I read of it in DH (a la Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them and Quidditch Through the Ages). Most of her fans aren't rich enough to afford to bid on this book, but we'd love to read it.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 3:10 pm (#2938 of 2974)
Well it is a good present for the people who have helped her. Especially considering its presentation, all hand-written with original illustrations by the author. I wonder who'll be getting them. Probably Barry Cunningham and Christopher Little, I expect.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 3:11 pm (#2939 of 2974)
Lol! PeskyPixie, this is at least the THIRD time you've posted right after me, while I go back and edit my post! I should just post a second time, rather than make these long edits.
Gina R Snape - Nov 1, 2007 3:13 pm (#2940 of 2974)
Well, I definitely side with JKR. It's nothing personal about Steve. I've met Steve, emailed him about Snapecast stuff, wish him well with all the new exciting changes in his life, etc etc. But the Lexicon is a cataloguing of JKR's world. It's not original material. It's original organization of other's material. So he shouldn't make money off that.
Now, as others have said, if he published a book of essay on the world of HP, or an autobiography of his life as the best known and most appreciated cataloger of JKR's HP world, that would be original material. But it sounds like that's not what he's doing. So it's not fair use.
I hope JKR and Steve can iron this out. It would be a horrible tragedy for Steve to never meet JKR and then as well to have that 'relationship' turn into an ugly situation over something he's spent a huge chunk of his life on. And it would be horrible for JKR to give freely of her material for free use and then feel like she was being burned by someone she came to rely on and trust when looking up things on his resource site.
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 3:26 pm (#2941 of 2974)
If I had to chose a side it would have to be JKR's. I would have done exactly the same thing if I were her. If she did try to resolve the matter out of court and was ignored, what choice does she have. She worked hard to get where she is, why shouldn't she try to protect it? If there is nothing to hide, why not let them (JKR/WB)preview the print copy? Now it is up to the courts to decide. If Steve is doing something wrong, the courts will put a stop to it. And if he is within his rights, he will publish his book and make money and life will go on.
Having said all that, I agree, I don't think this will affect how I feel about Harry Potter. I will still read the books. I will buy an encyclopedia when Jo writes one and I will keep coming to the Lexicon for information and great conversation. At least they're not trying to shut the Lexicon down...
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 3:33 pm (#2942 of 2974)
I think that's what's going to end up being interesting about this case: why is it OK to "copyright infringe" on a website, but it's not OK to "copyright infringe" in print. It's exactly the same thing in principle, and yet JKR gave it her blessing while it was a website and is suing when it's in print. The difference is that age-old bugger -- money. This might end up being some sort of landmark case in web rights. It has seemed to me for years that "everyone" (ie: government, etc.) has sort of stayed away from the Internet, because they don't quite know what to do with it or how to do it. They'd love to tax it (money again) but they don't know how. Copyright infringement? Errmmm, no money changing hands, so... hmmmm. It almost seems like for years "the higher ups" have put their hands in their pockets and looked at the ceiling and whistled. Now suddenly attention is going to be focused on "Why is it OK on the Internet airwaves but not in print?" What a mess.
This stinks. Period.
Edit: Also, it seems like this Roger Rapoport guy hasn't handled things in the smartest possible way. Rudeness is in the eye of the beholder, but the WB/JKR-beholder definitely took umbrage () at his snippy reply to them. It seems like Roger has put Steve in an awkward position here, to say the least.
Edit 2: I also don't see why it is not a copyright infringement for WB to use the Lexicon's timeline, copied exactly, on their DVD. That's taking Steve's hard work and using it for their profit. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 3:51 pm (#2943 of 2974)
I thought the same thing about this Roger. When someone threatens you with a lawsuit, you don't act like a little snot, you act like a professional and handle business. If he had handled things differently it might not have come this far.
In the end, it's just as everyone is saying, it's about money. If Lexicon Steve were charging us to look at his website and use this forum, then would that be copyright infringement?
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 3:59 pm (#2944 of 2974)
Yes it would, Victoire.
The difference between the internet and print is the principle of the thing. Print publications and paying websites make money, so they are making a profit from someone else's hard work. Non-paying websites are only having fun and amusing their visitors. They're not 'cashing in' on someone else's work, they're just honoring it.
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 4:02 pm (#2945 of 2974)
So the love of money truly is the root of all evil.
And here all along we thought it was Voldemort.
wynnleaf - Nov 1, 2007 4:06 pm (#2946 of 2974)
I think that's what's going to end up being interesting about this case: why is it OK to "copyright infringe" on a website, but it's not OK to "copyright infringe" in print. (Madam Pince)
Once upon a time I had to study copyright law for several different courses in graduate school. I don't think the law has changed much since then.
It's not copyright infringement if the holder of the copyright allows you to do it. It is copyright infringement if you take something that is the copyright holder's right, and use it without permission.
As regards the money... that's not really what makes something an infringement. If the copyright holder has the right to something and someone else uses it without permission, then that's infringement whether or not there is any money involved. In this case, JKR was willing to permit the web Lexicon to exist because it was free. But she is not willing to give permission for the Lexicon book since it will, she believes, inhibit the ability of her future book to make money for charities. But it's not the money per se which makes infringement, it's using something that is JKR's by right, without her permitting it.
So for instance in India, it didn't matter if they were doing it for charity, nor even if they'd never charged any money. Without getting the copyright holder's permission to use her work, it's infringement. She may choose to allow it or not as she pleases. In this case, she didn't allow it.
Same goes for fan fiction. Even though it's not done for money, it is technically copyright infringement to use someone else's work in that way. Some authors refuse to permit it and come down hard on all fan fiction. JKR chooses to allow it. That is her right. But even though no money changes hands, if JKR chose not to allow fan fics, it would be an infringement.
Luna Logic - Nov 1, 2007 4:11 pm (#2947 of 2974)
Thanks Wynnleaf, that point seems very clear to me now.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 4:14 pm (#2948 of 2974)
why is it OK to "copyright infringe" on a website, but it's not OK to "copyright infringe" in print. - Actually it's not "okay" in either form. JKR (or her publishers) would have been perfectly within her rights to sue any fan site for unauthorised republication of her work.
But she didn't.
Not only that, but she was about as supportive as anyone could possibly be!
I agree with Eponine. These are her characters, her spells, her creations, and I don't think it's fair for someone to just put them in alphabetical order and sell them for profit.
ETA: Excellent explanation Wynnleaf.
Victoire Weasley - Nov 1, 2007 4:14 pm (#2949 of 2974)
Yes, thanks for the insight.
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 4:18 pm (#2950 of 2974)
OK, this thread is moving to fast for me! Lol!
Wynnleaf, thanks for clarifying.
PeskyPixie, this is too funny!
Last edited by John Bumbledore on Sat May 14, 2011 11:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 4:18 pm (#2951 of 2974)
Would a homemade Harry Potter Hallowe'en costume or the Diagon Alley gingerbread house contest entry also be considered copyright infringement?
LOL journeymom, I've done it again. I hope you're finished with your post?
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 4:20 pm (#2952 of 2974)
That would be party pooping if home made halloween costumes were banned. Think of all the upset children.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 4:21 pm (#2953 of 2974)
I think it's NOT copyright infringement if no money exchanges hands. - Nope. It's still infringement. It's not the money, it's using someone else's work without permission. What discourages people from doing this, however, is the money.
ETA: I think you would be hard pressed to see a lawsuit regarding costumes make its way to court. I doubt there would ever exist a judge who would even hear such a case. Besides: it would probably fall under the "fair use" defense, since it could be argued that the costume is a form of parody.
Accio Sirius - Nov 1, 2007 4:26 pm (#2954 of 2974)
So should we who did the HP swaps just turn ourselves over to the authorities?
I get it, the legal stuff. But it does just make me sad too. I think Steve and the Lexicon comes from a good place--the love of the books and characters, it does seem like a slap in the face.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 4:27 pm (#2955 of 2974)
Well, there were many upset children in India during that whole episode. What they did was the equivalent of all us forumers pooling together our money to buy building supplies and build a replica of Hogwarts castle in one of our backyards to celebrate Hallowe'en in, then take it down on November first.
I guess according to wynnleaf's definition this is still considered copyright infringement, but the case did get tossed. If it's illegal, is that possible?
azi - Nov 1, 2007 4:27 pm (#2956 of 2974)
So where do disclaimers come into this? Does putting a disclaimer make it not infringment because you are acknowledging the authors work?
Thanks for the information everyone, by the way!
journeymom - Nov 1, 2007 4:27 pm (#2957 of 2974)
I'm going to simply sit and listen now...
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 4:29 pm (#2958 of 2974)
This is all going too fast for me. Somebody, anybody, please read my previous post and answer my question!
ETA: Journeymom, it's just bordering on freaky now!
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 4:32 pm (#2959 of 2974)
I think we should make the house out of Gingerbread and then eat it all before we can get hauled up into court. Ha Ha.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 4:34 pm (#2960 of 2974)
What they did was the equivalent of all us forumers pooling together our money to buy building supplies and build a replica of Hogwarts castle in one of our backyards to celebrate Hallowe'en
Not exactly, Pesky. It was built by civic organisers for "the biggest Hindu religious event in eastern India." The judge threw out the case, but also ruled that no characters could be used (or face civil charges) and that the festival could only keep the castle up for four days.
Madam Pince - Nov 1, 2007 4:36 pm (#2961 of 2974)
I think that's what's going to end up being interesting about this case: why is it OK to "copyright infringe" on a website, but it's not OK to "copyright infringe" in print. (earlier, by me...)
What I meant by this was not trying to determine the "definition" of copyright infringement. (Thanks, wynnleaf, for that most excellent summation -- it makes perfect sense. How do you do that? )
What I was trying to say (probably badly) is that legal definitions end up, really, being whatever some judge says they are. So it will be interesting to see what a judge in this case has to say about what has been a long-standing definition of something that is now somewhat changed by the advent of a new "invention/phenomenon" -- the Internet.
And PeskyPixie makes an interesting observation -- if it remains as wynnleaf says (basically that it's the creator's decision as to whether or not something is an infringement or not), then where is the line drawn? At gingerbread Hogwarts castles? I mean, the Harry Potter world is now so extensive, it's really almost reached out of her control. (I guess that's what this lawsuit is about really -- she's allowed a great deal of latitude, and now she's trying to grab some of it back.) If an crackdown comes too hard, it will sort of feel like "Well, you can read my books, but you can't name your kid Albus Severus." I'm kind of babbling here, but you see what I mean? It's a universal thing now -- it's sort of hard to "own" it anymore. I don't know.... as I said, it's a mess.
Here's my bets on who gets the six copies of "The Tales of Beedle the Bard" -- her agent Christopher Little, her Bloomsbury editors Barry Cunningham and Emma Matthewson, her Scholastic editor Arthur Levine, her sister Di, and her daughter Jessica. And some multi-bazillionaire who's probably not even a fan but just wants a "sure-thing" collectible will get Copy #7.
OK, so here's another interesting question: If the successful bidder for Copy #7 decides to type it out and print it, will JKR sue him/her? Could the person put it out for free on the web?
(I am still quite disgruntled that JKR won't be publishing it for the rest of us poor sots. She could've done so and still given them quite a nice thank-you gift of a hand-written copy. Or, as I said earlier, just done it and not rubbed salt in our wounds by telling us about it. )
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 4:40 pm (#2962 of 2974)
It was Warner Brothers who sued the India festival, which is commercially sponsored, apparently, for using their design of the Hogwarts Castle. This event falls outside the guidelines set up by Warner Bros., J.K. Rowling and her publishers to help charitable and not-for-profit organisations to run small-scale themed events that protect fans and allow everyone to enjoy Harry Potter books, films and events in the spirit in which they were created.
Slightly hypocritical coming from Warners, but there it is.
rambkowalczyk - Nov 1, 2007 4:48 pm (#2963 of 2974)
I tend to agree with JKR for the same reasons that Gina does.
As for the Beedle and the Bard, yes she has made (or will make) 7 hand written copies for special people in her life. Who is to say that she will not make a future announcement (probably after the auction of said book) regarding the possibility of the average person also being able to get this book as well. I am certain this will happen at some point in the future.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 4:48 pm (#2964 of 2974)
Not exactly, Pesky. It was built by civic organisers for "the biggest Hindu religious event in eastern India." The judge threw out the case, but also ruled that no characters could be used and that the festival could only keep the castle up for four days.
I've been to this event with a friend, zelmia, and have seen the organization process first-hand. Communities form 'clubs' (i.e. committees) to organize the design, etc. for the pavilion in their area. Community donations pay for the cost of supplies and building (as a Canadian, I paid more than my share for the pavilion in the locality I was staying in). I was thinking of the forum as a community in my post, hence my statement of us donating our own money for supplies and building. Maybe they've changed all the rules in the book for the Hogwarts pavilion.
And you're right, the castle had to be taken down the day of the immersion, which was probably in four days at the time of the ruling. The festival itself is a ten-day thing (ending with immersion on the tenth day).
ETA: I've gone back to read stuff and it makes more sense that WB sued for use of their design of the castle.
I do hope we eventually get The Tales of Beedle the Bard.
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 4:48 pm (#2965 of 2974)
If the successful bidder for Copy #7 decides to type it out and print it, will JKR sue him/her? Could the person put it out for free on the web?
Did I read somewhere that there were going to be conditions placed on the bidder? Or am I imagining that?
Gina R Snape - Nov 1, 2007 5:03 pm (#2966 of 2974)
There is a difference between copyright infringement and 'fair use', though I am not entirely clear what they are. But I believe fair use involves critiquing, analysing or parodying original work.
As it so happens, the Lexicon does engage in copyright infringement. But JKR has given her blessing to fan run sites for a variety of reasons. We are lucky in that regard. Anne Rice was in a similar position and banned ALL use of her characters in websites, fanfiction, etc. It was within her rights to do so. It also put a severe damper on her fandom. JKR enjoys her fans and interacts with the fandom. It is by her good graces we can discuss her books online in a forum like this one. All the more reason not to step on her toes. It did occur to me that she could get so annoyed by this situation that she has her people shut down the Lex. I hope that does not happen.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 5:17 pm (#2967 of 2974)
I had no idea that she can ban online discussion of her books. Apart from fanfictions, are the rest of our discussions also copyright infringement?
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 5:17 pm (#2968 of 2974)
I shouldn't think she would. She has never deemed the website an infringment before and if she were to do it now she'd have to shut down Mugglenet's encyclopedia as well in order to be fair. Shutting down the Lexicon's website would just be spiteful.
We are lucky that we are in a fandom whose author allows us to do all these things. I did wonder why no one ever said anything against fan videos that use footage from the movies, since the copyright notices on the DVDs says that that's not allowed. I guess Warners just let it slide in the name of good fun.
zelmia - Nov 1, 2007 5:17 pm (#2969 of 2974)
Copyright infringement is, to be overly simple, using someone else's work without their permission. Money does not need to come into it.
Fair Use is a defense against copyright infringement. Fair Use of existing works includes analysis (especially in the academic realm), criticism and parody. But claiming the Fair Use defense won't automatically win you the case. There are other factors (i.e. how much of the original work is being used in your "analysis").
In the case we're discussing, the original work is essentially being reprinted in its entirety - without consent of the original author - though organised alphabetically (or whatever).
Liz Mann - Nov 1, 2007 5:23 pm (#2970 of 2974)
The publishers of the Lexicon book have responded with a completely different version of events than J.K. and WB. Who to believe?!
Well, we'll just have to wait and see what happens in court.
legolas returns - Nov 1, 2007 5:27 pm (#2971 of 2974)
I think the easiest thing to do is disbelieve everybody, put your fingers in your ears and go la la la until the court case is settled.
azi - Nov 1, 2007 5:30 pm (#2972 of 2974)
I was just going to say I may stick my head in the sand until it's all over. It would be easier.
PeskyPixie - Nov 1, 2007 5:59 pm (#2973 of 2974)
Yes, this is all too stressful. I'm going over to the Potty Games thread to update my riddle.
Kip Carter - Nov 1, 2007 6:07 pm (#2974 of 2974)
This thread has reached its maximum number of messages. A new thread, # JK Rowling Official Site, is available to continue our discussions. Enjoy!
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